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Which non chinese arts would you use to augment

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  • Which non chinese arts would you use to augment

    Which arts would be the most useful to update the Traditional Chinese Fighting Arts?

    It would seem evident that you must incorporate skills that serve you in all three types of combat. Standing, locking, and throwing. Of course each of those contains sub catagories, Wrestling, striking, grappling etc.

    Also if you are building a self defense art you must address weapons that you may realistically encounter on the streets or during a home invasion or car jacking for instance.

    note i am talking about learning to be aware of the things you need to know to survive the streets not in the ring.

  • #2
    I'll start off with what we can use in TCMA then go on to the parts i feel are missing.

    I believe that TCMAs can be very useful and even deadly in a fight. It Just that the way most people train isn't the most ideal. Although we all know that forms aren't meant to be used per-say, many people still try to do forms while fighting up to getting the stance right. Result, KO in < 2 mins.

    Yes there are a ton of useful moves in TCMA forms with the Exception of most modern Tai-chi Schools(unless its being taught by a master who learnt the applications in combat). Also Contemporary WuShu. When and if they do fight, they use Sanda/Sanshou. Traditional Wushu is different, where stances are slightly more mobile and less concern is placed on how you look and more on how you fight.

    Besides the mind set, Training methods in TCMAs aren't the most realistic nor effective. While Wing Chun is one of the few that have practical training methods, most just don't have the right attitudes during training. Not enough emphasis is placed on actual Sparring and Combat tatics. Not enough Research and application is made into TCMAs. Too much Theory and flash is why we see such poor examples of TCMAs in fights.
    If these weakness are put aside and proper training, application, sparring and what not are implemented, we may see better TCMA fighters in the future. TCMAs can be and are a good striking art when trained properly.

    On to the weapons. More than a few TCMAs have Weapons training included. Some stuff you'll encounter on the street can replace weapons one has practised in TCMAs. Broomsticks or mop handles can be used as staffs. If broken, those can then be used as Double Short staffs.
    Next comes Umbrellas. Those fall into the Sword category. Exclude the slashing tatics of huge swords and focus on the smaller rapiers or chinese swords. You could stab out a guy's heart with a metal tipped Umbrella. Block Knives/switch blades.
    Walking canes can be used as a hook/short staff combination. Smaller objects such as Screwdrivers/Spanners are used in a similar way as a knife Stabbing/slashing motions respectively. TCMartists have been known to kill birds by shooting coins. You could blind someone or at least blur him enough to make a get away.


    Not many TCMAs have effective Grapples/Locks/Ground moves.
    I'd take BJJ perhaps. Not to Grapple with but to counter grapples/locks. Who would know how to escape a lock/grapple better than a Grappler? Why BJJ? No idea. Its just for the moments when you just can't strike or there is no way to strike. Or when you find yourself on the ground and the only way out is to grapple out.
    Its like a Brand name. You want to be amoung the best strikers, MT/Boxing is the way. You wouldn't Do Contemporary Wushu if you plan on doing Striking as your forte.

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    • #3
      i thnk thats a shame and that with all the years behind it, CMA aught to be able to hold its own. If training was more reality based i believe plenty of CMA is valid.

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      • #4
        Which non chinese arts would you use to augment?

        The Chinese are masters of circular motion.
        The Japanese are masters of linear motion.

        Hey you got your chocolate in my peanut butter.

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        • #5
          You could do BJJ and call it Chin Na

          Aikido is very complimentary to Taijiquan, as is Pencak Silat (Mande Muda).

          Filipino Martial Arts go great with Wing Chun.

          *Cough* JKD *Cough*

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          • #6
            My 2 cents worth since I am asking for yours.....

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            • #7
              Originally posted by BoarSpear
              If i had to do it again, i would still start my kids boxing and wrestling at 6 then graduate them to judo/jujutsu at about 9 .....

              Then you would be wasting their time from 6 to 9.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by jubaji
                Then you would be wasting their time from 6 to 9.



                Or are you just going to run out from underneath your bridge and throw shit as usual?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by BoarSpear
                  Really? What arts did you learn from the ages of 6 to 9 years old?

                  Oh, I was wrestling from the minute I hit the ground. The point is that a kid wouldn't retain anything from that age "to perfect later in life". Too young. Now, if they kept on wrestling there would be a cumulative effect that kicks in when the kid gets old enough to start to develop a real sense of himself. But a kid who boxes, wrestles, whatever from 6 to 9 and then stops will in very short order forget/lose any benefit from that particular focus. That's ok, because at that age kids are really just building coordination and familiarity with physicality anyway, but the plan to 'instill' something in just those years is a bit over-thought.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jubaji
                    Oh, I was wrestling from the minute I hit the ground. The point is that a kid wouldn't retain anything from that age "to perfect later in life". Too young. Now, if they kept on wrestling there would be a cumulative effect that kicks in when the kid gets old enough to start to develop a real sense of himself. But a kid who boxes, wrestles, whatever from 6 to 9 and then stops will in very short order forget/lose any benefit from that particular focus. That's ok, because at that age kids are really just building coordination and familiarity with physicality anyway, but the plan to 'instill' something in just those years is a bit over-thought.
                    ........................

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Kenpodog
                      The Chinese are masters of circular motion.
                      The Japanese are masters of linear motion.

                      Hey you got your chocolate in my peanut butter.
                      Your quote is an uneducated assumption, take for instance wing chun and Xing Yi of CMA with straight lines and Aikido of JMA with circles.

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                      • #12
                        Baquazhang also contains linear sets...

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by BoarSpear
                          Which arts would be the most useful to update the Traditional Chinese Fighting Arts?

                          It would seem evident that you must incorporate skills that serve you in all three types of combat. Standing, locking, and throwing. Of course each of those contains sub catagories, Wrestling, striking, grappling etc.

                          Also if you are building a self defense art you must address weapons that you may realistically encounter on the streets or during a home invasion or car jacking for instance.

                          note i am talking about learning to be aware of the things you need to know to survive the streets not in the ring.

                          **Which arts would be the most useful to update the Traditional Chinese Fighting Arts?

                          Nil, TCMA teachers should realise the reality and drop their arrogance so that they can teach proper TCMA. Just because one person is trained in somthing doesnt make them superior in combat, the same can be said about someone with a law degree doesnt make them a lawyer.




                          **Also if you are building a self defense art you must address weapons that you may realistically encounter on the streets or during a home invasion or car jacking for instance.

                          This is for the student to realise the reality, like teachers at school teaching students to read and write, the student must go out to the real world and use the tools taught to them at school.teaching a student to act in one way is very narrow minded, better to let them decide and make mistakes in life.The one that complains about the art is one that doesnt want to learn, the one that realises that their mentality is incorrect and willing to change will grow wiser.Street survival comes from experience, not jibberish from some person.



                          Remember the meaning of Kung Fu; yes it means hard work but deeper into its meaning tells us that what you put into it is what you get out of it.Many chinese have used the word kung fu for not only martial arts but in cooking and craftsmanship.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Kenpodog
                            The Chinese are masters of circular motion.
                            The Japanese are masters of linear motion.

                            Hey you got your chocolate in my peanut butter.
                            Originally posted by Oraenor
                            Your quote is an uneducated assumption, take for instance wing chun and Xing Yi of CMA with straight lines and Aikido of JMA with circles.
                            True, it was an uneducated assumption.
                            I guess Chocolate and Peanut Butter have already been combined.

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                            • #15
                              I would have them check out schools in the area and learn as much as possible through instruction or reading. Boxing, Wrestling, BJJ, TKD for kicking, almost any art can be mixed with any other art depending on what your specific goals are. Do you care if they can kick, box, or wrestle? Or do you just want them to be able to take care of themselves, in which case education is probably more important anyways.

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