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  • Creation or Evolution?

    What do you believe, Creation or evolution? Voice your views please .

  • #2
    I dont belive in evolution at all. The bible clearly states how we were created and evolution wasn't in that process. We were created in God's own likeness. And my God isn't a monkey.
    When people said we evolved from moneys, they don't mean a monkey you see in the zoo these days. They are referring to our ape-like ancestors, (i.e.homoerectus, etc.).
    Personally I believe tin the singuarity theory where there was energy compressed into the size of a pea. Secondly, I'd like to explain the multiverse before i go any further. multi verse there are numerous bubbles, each with different universe and a different possibility, for example in one bubble, i may be typing this post as it is, and in another bubble i may be typing this post out in all caps. When two of the bubbles touched, the two bubbles are destroyed and a new universe resulted. The new bubble may have formed the possibility that the energy compressed into the size of a pea may have been disrupted. What may have caused the two bubbles to touch? I personally believe it's god.

    I personally view it as god kicked off the big bang and then sat back and watched he show. Evolution took place, etc.

    Also I'd like to note how some people's theory is that dinosaurs co existed with humans until they died in the great flood because dinosaurs couldn't fit in the ark *

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    • #3
      Originally posted by HandtoHand
      I dont want to bother prooving that evolution in an actual process, but i will briefly. Look at how the blacks are black for a sunny climate in africa, look at how the the Europeans who wore more clothes against the cold weather were more pretected against the sun and thus developed a lighter skin pigment.

      The only thing is science has yet to create a living organism, we can alter them, make them reporduce, harvest them, but we cant take nonliving things and make something living. This is what leads me to say that i belive in a combination of the two, as adacas said; god set the chess board.
      I really do believe that there are other Civilizations/Aliens or other planet/s withing our galaxy (dead/present/newlyborn living planets)

      now, do you believe that there are aliens?????

      if yes.... then, it is also a God's Image?????

      if not.... then, there might be other gods who created them to their own images???????

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      • #4
        Originally posted by sherwinc
        I really do believe that there are other Civilizations/Aliens or other planet/s withing our galaxy (dead/present/newlyborn living planets)

        now, do you believe that there are aliens?????

        if yes.... then, it is also a God's Image?????

        if not.... then, there might be other gods who created them to their own images???????

        Interesting point. I remember a few years ago we the found life..well an organism..on some planet I can't remember and the cathloic church was in an uproar becuase of the implications - there could be life outside of earth blasphemy. But there is no reference in the bible that states that life was ONLY created on earth. The book Genisis merely states creation and then how the earth and life on earth was created. I could be wrong but from my reading that has always been my understanding.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by HandtoHand
          I dont want to bother prooving that evolution in an actual process, but i will briefly. Look at how the blacks are black for a sunny climate in africa, look at how the the Europeans who wore more clothes against the cold weather were more pretected against the sun and thus developed a lighter skin pigment.
          Another interesting point. Well this is more a case of adaptation as one could argue the slanted eyes of the asians. Actully, from an anthropological perspective there are roughly 3-6 classes of human with teh original 3 of course Negroid, mongoloid and caucosoid. I argued this very point with an anthropology professor indicating that eskimos (decendents of native americans) where certainly not white and not all tribes in africa are black. The asnswer I was given well I barely remember, but she said something like it takes a long time to change. Of course for change to take place on a geneitic level is slow but ultamitely no answer was given becuase none is available.

          The maturity of scientists in terms of their thinking has not changed much since copernicus. We thought the world was flat and anyone who thought different was a hack, then proven wrong. Copernicus had the geocentric theory but the thought that all the plaents could did not revolve around the earth was blasphemy. Actually, it is this conceit of the humans position that the earth is central to evrything is the problem with believing there could be other life beyond earth.


          Scientists are alway discovering new life of this planet and alot that is not understood, but when life on another planet is discussed, it is always compared to humans and then tehy say life can't exist here or if it were to exist it would like like "?????" but that is not possible

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          • #6
            Just to point out, That they never really found life from space. They found orgainic compounds and said it was and organism. Later after study by others it turned out just to be organic compounds that can be created by having the proper building blocks and radiation.

            Let me state this again a little more clearly. Evolution is not a FACT, it is not a LAW, it is a theory. I theory is only a belief that tries to explain something that occurs.

            Science is only a philosphy. It is a belief system that relies heavily on empirical knowledge and the ability to reproduce results.

            To date there has never been any proof of evolution. That is why Lucy (a face monkey human) was such a big deal because it was "the missing link" And until the man confessed on his death bed that it was a hoax many scientists were fooled. By a skeleton comprised of a few bones from different creatures and some pigs teeth.

            I am not really concerned what your High School teacher told you. If they say that evolution is a fact they are incorrect. Even in college you may run into a professor or two that say it's fact but they are also incorrect. Why, because it's not a fact it's a theory.

            Adaptation has little to do with evolution really. To evolve something must change from one thing to something else. like an apple becomes an orange. Not a washington apple becomes a golden delicious apple.

            Organisms adapt but so far no proof that they evolve. Sickle cell anemia is an adaptation to malaria, People who have it have not evolved they are not different kinds of animals they are people with a different trait.

            Science will always try to prove evolution but in so doing it breaks the principles of science. This being to observe empirically and then test, finally to reproduce the results. As soon as someone tries to prove or disprove a theory they are approaching it with a personal bias towards the outcome. That is not science.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by eXcessiveForce
              Evolution is not a FACT, it is not a LAW, it is a theory. I theory is only a belief that tries to explain something that occurs.

              Science is only a philosphy. It is a belief system that relies heavily on empirical knowledge and the ability to reproduce results.

              To date there has never been any proof of evolution.

              Even in college you may run into a professor or two that say it's fact but they are also incorrect. Why, because it's not a fact it's a theory.
              Agreed. I know it was just an organism, my point was just the response to the possibility of life beyond earth was verry interesting. My thought is just when you look at positivism and empiricism it is one thing to say we don'yt understand but completely different to say "impossible" becuase something has not been defined.

              Hmm ... I actually think I am getting off topic but I just thought mention this.

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              • #8
                Even from a creationist view. It seems the universe is pretty vast to be just for us on one little planet. And to make galaxies so far away that we can never hope to get to them kind of makes you think that what is the point of doing all that just for us.

                I don't have a problem with the idea of life in space. I don't think that they come visit us. Face it if you have ships that can do that earth would be pretty dull.

                People assume that if their are aliens that they would be interested in us. That is just the same egoism that drives people to think that everyone talks about them when they are gone.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by eXcessiveForce
                  Face it if you have ships that can do that earth would be pretty dull.
                  LOL to true it would be the eqivalent of an ant farm

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by sherwinc
                    I really do believe that there are other Civilizations/Aliens or other planet/s withing our galaxy (dead/present/newlyborn living planets)

                    now, do you believe that there are aliens?????

                    if yes.... then, it is also a God's Image?????

                    if not.... then, there might be other gods who created them to their own images???????

                    This doesn't surprise me at all. Looks who it is coming from. I wouldn't doubt it if sherwinc was one of these aliens.

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                    • #11
                      a few years ago a team of scientists in switzerland did dna testing on a frozen cadavore that was supposed to be a cromagnum man. they surmised that in no way wa it possible for that specimen to have been able to reproduce with the female dna present in humans. the dna of a chimpanzee is supposed to be pretty close to a humans dna and there is also no chance of interspecies reproduction between them and humans so i cannot support the theory of evolution in this scheme. a couple of studies were done over a hundred years ago and then again five years ago. one on the land in america and another on the dimensions of the human anatomy specifically the brain. what was found on the soil study is that only a fraction of the nutrients found on the first were present today. the findings on the second were that the brain weight and overall size of the brains were much smaller in humans today. i bring this up because i feel that in some ways we are de- evolving as a result of resource depletion and tampering with the natural order of things. on another note scientists tried unsuccesfully to accomplish the smallest synthesis in the protein that had been widely accepted as the building block to human development. recreating all the environmental statistics felt were around in the beginning of time on earth they concluded that even with ten times the amount of time they believed it took to do this through nature they could not make it work.
                      darwin kept getting head aches trying to figure out in his mind how the human eye could have been developed. he told his friends that he just couldn't do it. the intricacies of the human eye stumped him. personally i don't care how they could have been made through nature because i have a firm belief that god created the chess board (kudos).
                      life on other planets? who is to say that god couldn't have a million chess games going at the same time? the vatican?if god wanted to start life on earth and say that life was only started here at that time then it was. but what about 12 hours later? a day is to a thousand years as a thousand years is to a day. that's 500 years later he takes a quick step over to alpha centauri and starts over knowing what we are going to do to our world before we even did it.why are those planets in the universe? when they were created people didn't have a way of viewing them for their beauty. they are too far away to have any direct influence on us. how many stars in the sky (if you can see them through the pollution) are there? and how many have satellites following them? how many of those can support life? who really knows but the possibility is definately there.
                      just look at the planets in our solar system. i don't know exactly how far away mercury is from the sun but science tells us that the sun has a huge magnetic pull which along with the pull of our planet keeps us all in line and circling around it but how much power does mercury have not to be pulled into the sun? i have a hard time believing that it is from a big bang without GOD to keep everything in its proper place. the earths magnetic field has dropped in the last fifty years to a point that hasn't happend in a very long time. supposedly when the ice age took place which renewed the field until now. some have speculated that it is because of a growing electro magnetic field inside the earths magnetic field that has caused this, but i don't know if i believe that for certain but we do have a lot of power poles around the world.

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                      • #12
                        Hmm... Interesting topic (although I've run across it a billion times). I was a philosophy minor with classes in theology and existentialism under my belt, so maybe I can spark a good debate or conversation...

                        REGARDING EVOLUTON
                        To my knowledge, the only evolution that has been proven is micro-evolution. The theory of Evolution DOES NOT state that man came from monkeys... Rather, it believes that man and monkeys descended from a common ancestor. Whether that is true remains to be seen. However, there are many archeological suggestions there was an evolutionary process in our development... Whether that is entirely true, remains to be seen.

                        REGARDING CREATION
                        Does God exist? To be objective, one must think in human terms and be logical. First, the Bible was written by men and until proven otherwise, that's how I will address it. Personally, I do not buy into the Bible, because it has more holes than the theory of Evolution and Santa Claus combined... But we can argue that later if you really want to.

                        The main idea I'd like to address is God. For this, I've picked the minds of some really intelligent people (rather read some really good books and essays)... Not resorting to any doctrines, my conclusion and that of many intellects is this:

                        1) The Universe is inconceivable
                        2) Man is limited to his experience as a human being
                        3) Therefore, whatever idea Man conjures up regarding the Universe is a misinterpretation of the true nature of the Universe.

                        Truth is only relevent to man's experience as a human being. Since God is a conceivable idea that Man has been contemplating for centuries, is God merely Man's own idea of Truth and NOT Truth itself? That's the real question.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by sherwinc
                          I really do believe that there are other Civilizations/Aliens or other planet/s withing our galaxy (dead/present/newlyborn living planets)

                          now, do you believe that there are aliens?????

                          if yes.... then, it is also a God's Image?????

                          if not.... then, there might be other gods who created them to their own images???????
                          Well doesn't the Bible state you shall not worship OTHER gods? so it doesn't say there is one God, just that that one god is suppreme to others

                          One of the arguments against the Big Bang is the question, But what was there before that? One could just as well ask the creationist But who or what created God?

                          Akso young christians are taught to reply: Were you there? is someone states Dinos lived miljon years ago, but this could just as well be replied on anything in the Bible

                          If a God started live on earth, I think it was meant as a game, an experiment not unlike the antfarm at school

                          Science is great but they lost me on the quantum theory
                          Ah well I only understood the reletivity theory some 10 years ago ( am 42 now) before I took it as is, I didn't know what it implied and how time couuld be relative only when the used a math quadrant to show it, became it clear

                          It's nice the creation helps people giving purpose to a life of senseless work and procreating (spelling?) but I rather give my live real purpose and help others, I managed to get a job wherre I do so and are apreciated for it
                          That's the purpose I gave my life, gain as much knowledge and skills and help others with it

                          Oh If you believe in a God that just started life on earth and left it to evolve, couldn't god be aliens that just visited earth but weren't sterile and left single cel organisms

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                          • #14
                            One of the arguments against the Big Bang is the question, But what was there before that? One could just as well ask the creationist But who or what created God?
                            In answer to your question "what was there before that?", people believe (more like Steven Hawkings) that there was energy compressed into the size of a pea. The energy was disrupted and big explosion occurs. That was the Big Bang.
                            And I believe that a creationist believes that God was always there and he wasn't created.

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                            • #15
                              Unfortunately, the beginning of creation is an unknown... In the case of science, one can easily argue what caused a pea of energy to form...And with creationists, who created God? Merely saying God simply exists isn't a reliable answer, since God is a mechanism of cause and effect... What caused God?

                              That is why my point is that the Universe is inconceivable. Thus, whatever conceivable idea Man has is only relative to his existence... If such a god exists and communicates with Man, it would be impossible to distinguish between inherent thoughts and divinity. How does a Man know God's will from his own?

                              Besides, if one acknowledges that God exists, he also opens to the door to the existence of other gods, creatures, etc... Since none can be disproven or proven more real than the other. For God says, "...worship no other god but me" an implication that suggests other gods must exist as well.

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