Suggestion?

[WTG]

Burton, or anyone.

I have made the time for 10-15 rounds of equipment training in my daily workout. I wish to use speed bag, Top&bottom and heavy bag. (this will be solo training)

Any suggestion as to a program to follow for what we do? Burton, how would you divide your time between the above equipment. Would you use sticks on the bags? Throw the bag? Use the bag as a body on the ground for position training etc...

Also, what about the kicking shield?(not solo:-) Any inventive ways to use that?

Again,I would be also interested in anyones advice and personal ideas.

Wishing you all the Best!

-Rick

[bzarnett]

I've modified my daily workout every few months based on my changes in JKDU. For each "phase" of JKDU I up the ante and what I expect out of myself.

I know you are asking specifically about the equipment training, but I figured I would give the whole run-down of my current training pattern anyways

In do stretches three times a day -- a morning and before bed stretch which lasts about 7 minutes, and then one when I get home before my workout which lasts about 20 minutes. I also do about 5 minutes of strength training (Hindu push-up, crunches, etc.)

(I have back problems and sciatic problems so for me, the more stretchs the better off I am. Nothing like doing a video grading with your sciatica kicking you in the butt -- literally.)

I warm up with 5 minutes of shadow boxing (light), and then do several 3 minute rounds of shadow boxing based on a particular game (i.e. Stand-up shadow boxing, Clinch Shadow Boxing, and Ground shadow boxing). Every other day I add in stick or knife.

I then work 3 - 3 minute rounds on the heavy bag working basic kick boxing combinations -- this really works the cardio. Sometimes I wear the mask and mouthguard to add some extra exhaustion.

I also do "forms". I prefer Tony Blaur's term though -- muscle memory forms. I generally make them up on the spot and forget them. With these, I take any partner drill and do it by myself applying a lot of imagination. For example, I might want to work from an underhook to an opposite arm arm-drag to a bear hug. So, I work out the pattern a few times to get the general idea and then I add imagination into it which adds a bit of resistance. And I keep working it. Imagination is really important in this circumstance. Then you start adding the American Kenpo "what-if" phase which is where I say "What if I went for XXX, but my opponent slipped it and did YYY". Its not realistic but it allows you to work a few things. Regardless, this is a general idea I got from Tony Blauer. (I started out with Tony's Close Quarter Combat muscle memory form and then worked the idea a bit with my American Kenpo background.)

Since this daily training is without any partners, I'm limited in what I can do.

Once a week I get together with my main workout partner speed and we take the first hour of our workout to do 3 minutes on the mitts, and 1.5 minute rounds in each of the ranges like the assist. instructor test.

Saying all this, I did not start this way and this particular training program I have adopted I just began a few weeks ago. Progression is everything.

I might sound like a lot (and I take fridays off), but it only goes for 45 minutes to 1 hour -- to reach my goals that is not too bad. Speaking of which -- I better start on my workout.

P.S. I have a WC Dummy, but I found the muscle memory forms a better tool IMHO.

[Burton]

The shadow boxing Bryan was talking about is great. Dan Gable, wrestling great, used to train very hard, then went home and practiced hand fighting in his basement. He said he would train, and when he could "see" his opponent ending his workout, Gable would keep on. Excellent.
About Rick's question, personally, I would skip the speed bag. It is a good shoulder conditioner, but not much else. Top and bottom bag is good. I used to do a bunch of rounds on the heavy bag, starting with double sticks, then stick and dagger, switch hands, single stick, switch hands, double dagger, single dagger, switch hands, then on to the emptyhands. I did 2 minute rounds without a break. I would then do punching, then elbows, then knees, then kicks, punches and kicks, elbows and knees, everything together, then headbutts, eye and groin strikes, clinch, takedowns, then one last 4 minute round of everything together. If you can take the bag down, do so and work your ground mobility. Use your imagination, and work on those things you need the most work on.

[Jim McRae]

Burton:

When you use a knife on your bag, do you use a foam trainer or do you use an aluminum or steel trainer? I have a Century Wavemaster on my lanai that I use for all manner of striking training, and been using only a foam trainer on it for fear of ripping the fabric.

Mahalo,
Jim

[Burton]

I use an aluminum trainer for slashing, and a short stick for slashing and thrusting. The end is beveled so that no tearing will occur. It is good to be able to thrust full power with a stick as it teaches you to grip well. Since there is no tang, you must hold on as your full-power thrust hits. For the wavemaster, foam may be a better option due to the durability of the bag.

[WTG]

Thanks guys!

Burton, what role do Thai Pads play in your training now? And, on a related note, what do you think of training methods such as the 14 count, 18 count etc...

In other words pre-arranged drills. Also the 1-2 series the 1-3 etc... Or, do you feel it is better to just be responsive to a free feed?

FWIW,

my current work out is:

Mon-Wed-Fri. Weights for an hour.

Mon-Sat. Ninpo workout:
Rolling (18 different rolls and breakfalls) 30mins.
Kihon Practice (striking and blocking/evasion) 1000reps
100 sword cuts from every posture.

(Takes and hour and a half done every morning)

Tues.-Thurs.-Sat.

Speed bad 3x3mins.
top&bottom 3x3mins.
Heavy bag 10x3mins. (3 rounds hands/elbows-3 for kicks knees-4 combos)
Heavy bag on floor (play for 15 mins.)
Holddowns/submissions (positions)
Slip/bob&weave 10 mins in mirror
stick&knife on hanging tire 5x2mins.
footwork shadowboxing about 10 mins...

Teach jujutsu:
Mon-Thurs. Sat 1 1/2 hours
Teach Ninpo:
Mon-Thurs-Sat 1 1/2 hours
JKD Weds-Fri-Sun. 2 hours
Brazilian Jiujitsu Sunday:
2 hours.

Every night shrimp rocking chair 10 mins.
Stretch 1/2 hour

Everyday:
Za zen 1 hour
Shingon Daily service ritual: 1/2 hour

I include spiritual practice as part of my training.

It is allot, but I am lucky to have the ability to do it now so I take advantage of it. I don't run though I had a knee injury and it was pretty bad, so I have not ran in 5 months. I NEED to run! I will start in a few weeks as my knee is finally starting to feel ok again...

Thanks,

-Rick

[armlok]

Rick,
Cut that out!!! Don't give Burton ideas about those damn pad drills. I prefer letting Jim hit me than throwing fullpower kicks/knees/punches at pads. After a couple of rounds I'm ready to lose yesterdays lunch. Beside that, I always screw up preset drills, I like to just flow with isolated and free sparring. Whenever I think about something I short circuit (ask everybody about my salute ) but when I just move around I do ok.

[WTG]

LOL!

-Rick

[Jim McRae]

I personally enjoy doing thai-pad drills, and I practice the muay-thai 15-count several times a week either with a partner or on my heavy-bag (some people just don't like holding for those thai kicks ). Obviously, doing a pre-set drill will not automatically make you into a great fighter. However, it does have several positive effects:

(1) Physical and mental conditioning: If you do the 15-count all-out for 5 or 10 rounds, you will not only toughen your body, but you will train your mind to allow you to keep performing well after your body has given up.
(2) Muscle memory: By repeating kicks, punches, elbows, knees, etc. over and over, you build positive muscle memory for these techniques. Also, certain combinations of these techniques are put into muscle memory that can be used later in sparring.
(3) More effective techniques: Proper repetition of technique leads to more powerful, explosive, non-telegraphic technique. Also, by working out when you are fatigued, you learn to relax, and relaxation brings speed, power, etc.
(4) Keep your guard up: If you train the thai pads with a helpfully-sadistic partner, anytime you drop your hands due to fatigue or bad technique, he/she will pop you in the face. This obviously builds the good habit of keeping the hands up.

Obviously, to make the techniques practiced in the 15-count (and other) thai pad drills effective, you have to take them into sparring and practice them against a resisting opponent.

Take care and train hard,
Jim

Burton: Regardless of what you have the rest of the class do, please make Shelton and me do the pad drills. I'll make sure he has a big meal beforehand )

[WTG]

Right on Jim!

All last summer a student and I would go to the park and do the "chai set" on focus pads left and right leads.
The "tba" set right and left, and 5x5's on the Thai Pads!

After that we would work on whatever... but six days a week, every morning he would come over and we would head out.

What a great time, those drills really helped and what a workout! I LOVE to have a partner training with me, pushing me past what I would do on my own.

Best wishes,

-Rick

[Burton]

We simply don't have time in our classes to add Thai pad drills. They are great conditioning, and help with power, although most of the round kicks are aimed above waist level. I prefer to use focus mitts, kicking shields, and a combination of the two when time is limited. The kicking shield is easier on the body than Thai pads, and is easier to hold at leg level. I don't care much for the long counts, as most students will be too busy thinking about the routine instead of relating to an opponent. The positives are that you make sure you use all your tools. But, I have never seen any Thai trainer do drills that are more than 4 counts. Usually, in actual Thai camps, the emphasis is on honing basic combos of 2, 3, and 4 movements. The long counts were devised as a way to keep students interested in the training, as there was a belief that most people had to be entertained in order to keep them. I don't think this is true to the extent that we need to create long, complicated memory exercises. As Armlok said, it is better to work on flowing.
The long counts aren't bad for you unless the drill is being done consciously, working on the memorization and coordination between feeder and striker. That can be a waste of time, and pulls the trainee out of the mind set that one would use in an actual fight.
With that said, I will let Jim and Armlok use the Thai pads everynight while everyone else practices knife fighting!

[armlok]

When I get my hands around Jim's skinny neck.....

[WTG]

Oh I see..

Originally posted by armlok
When I get my hands around Jim's skinny neck.....

hey Sifu,

looks like Armlok wants to do neck wrestling and knee drills!



-Rick

[Jim McRae]

..."I will let Jim and Armlok use the Thai pads everynight while everyone else practices knife fighting!"

Burton, you have found my weak point. You know the only thing I like better than kicking something is stabbing it to death!

Jim "the Giraffe" McRae