Does that hurt?

[HtTKar]

Ht,
You said any good black belt can knock you out in bare knuckles or bare feet with one good strike to your pressure point.

Sorry Mike, not me bud.
I was actually quoting Hardball, in response to his assertion that any good black belt can KO with one punch. It's not true. I have been hit in all three areas he described bareknuckled without being KO'd, let alone knocked down. That proves my point to me at least.

Punching someone in the face is not exactly something to be reserved for extreme "Self Defense Situations".

[Hardball]

I don't punch I "Kronk" and where I come from if you don't finish someone off; he is going to come back looking for you with a 9mm or a 40 cal. Glock. Mo Fo and you can take that to the Bank!!!

Bowing out again,

Humbly again.

[academian]

Terminology 101

What does KRONK mean?

[Hardball]

Hardball,
I was attacked in the hospital by a crack fiend named Charles. When he attacked me, he had been brought in for beating up six cops. He was high on crack and drunk, which for him made him extra combative. He was a regular and we knew what to expect, so it put us on guard even more. This was and remains to this day the toughest man I have ever seen. He stood about 6'2", maybe 6'3". I am 6"4" tall. He weighed around 230, and I have personally witnessed him lifting two fully loaded, adult male police officers off the ground, one on each arm, after being tasered and pepper sprayed. In fact, the night he attacked me, a nurse tried to give him a haldol injection and literally abandoned her efforts because not one but two 18 gauge needles bent in half without penetrating his bare skin. Haldol is usually injected with a 22 gauge needle - much, much smaller than the two that ruined themselves on his skin. To make this long story short, he slammed me twice, once along my jaw at the bottom of my ear, and once right in the front of my neck. I was alone with him, with my backup in the hallway outside talking to the nurse. When I collected my thoughts, I drove the outside of my forearm as hard as I could right into the side of his neck. This is a technique the pressure point folks call a brachial stun, and it is as reliable as anything I've ever used. It has been effective on bigger people with much less effort before, and fearing for my safety, I hit him with everything I had in me. I intended to knock him straight into the morgue if that's what it took. He stood there looking at me as if it hadn't happened. I repeated the attack with the same result. Finally, my partner and two other guards came into the room and I tackled him into his bedside rail. Despite splitting his scalp to the skull, he continued to fight us all until we had piled 8 people into the room and strapped him down. The incident taught me several important lessons:

#1 - I can take a pretty good shot and fight on with a clear head if the need arises. I had been hit by the strongest man I ever met, and while he was drugged up on crack to boot, right square in the throat. I coughed for a few days, but I was fine.

#2 - He took my best shots without so much as a blink. The shot I planted on him should have knocked him absolutely senseless. Instead, it didn't even move him. Even when I "corrected" my aim and hit him the second time (and he was standing near motionless when I connected), nothing happened. Granted he is freakishly strong, and no doubt feeling the benefits of alcohol and crack as pain killers, but my point remains - NOTHING HAPPENED.

#3 - If I can take his best shots bareknuckled and he could take mine, then I need to prepare more offensively than just one killer shot, even if it's to something as sensitive as the side of the neck. I have knocked out no less than 8 people with the same shot; 4 in training and 4 documented assaults in the line of duty. At 6'4" tall and 250 pounds (at the time), I was benching well over 300 lbs, and I was training actively for 4-5 hours a day. It still took eight security guards and hospital ER technicians to subdue ol' Chuck.

In the end, you may have abnormal strength or power, and you may be able to apply things no one else in the whole world can apply. But I still maintain that without a good bit of luck on your side, the one-punch theory is worthless in the extreme, and coupled with expecting to hit a precise quarter sized pressure point in the heat of battle makes it all the more ridiculous. And please don't take offense to this, but the fact that you say you reserve the technique for the most extreme of situations tells me you never or almost never spar with it, which means it's unproven - it's based on the theory that if your hands are hard enough and you can bench press a bulldozer, you'll have a magic touch. I'm still going to need some major first hand proof to outweigh my own experiences on this one, but I'm staying open-minded. And I've also read the Mas Oyama stories. Part truth and part legend, I'd imagine, just like so many things written about Bruce Lee. He was a badass to be sure, but I'd like to see a police report about a man killing another man at a dance with one punch before I buy the hype. If it happened, you can be sure that they didn't just keep dancing around the guy's corpse. Killing someone almost always gets local authorities involved, and with all the stories of such deeds, I find it amazing that there are no accompanying stories of the trial that certainly followed. Just my skeptical side, I guess.

PS: Ht, sorry for the misquote. I prostrate myself at your feet and beg your forgiveness. BTW, have you checked your private message on Warrior's Way yet?

Guy, I am not trying to build a reputation or pull anybodys leg. If I was, I would NOT be using a code name. I don't use my real name on line. There is an exception to any rule, I'm not going to argue with you or anyone else on this site. I don't Troll and I have never gotten into an argument here. I will tell you this, I've been to the Joint and I've been in Gang Wars. A pressure point strike delivered with a condition hand can and will knock someone out. Even if it is a Technical Knockout. I've done it and that's it. I'm from the PCP generation so I know what a drug crazed thug can and cannot do.

Bowing Out.

[academian]

(see dont waste your time on karate for full oyama story) it was ruled self defence. It is possible to stun or kill with one strike but not very probable in most cases. I agree It should not be your only training

[Garland]

What does KRONK mean?

KRUNK...it's what I be gettin' with my 40oz. yeahhhhh.
Let me do my Lil. Jon Voice. O.K. ALLLLLRRRRIIIIIGHHHHTT YEAHHHHHH

[EmptyneSs]

Hardball,
I was attacked in the hospital by a crack fiend named Charles. When he attacked me, he had been brought in for beating up six cops. He was high on crack and drunk, which for him made him extra combative. He was a regular and we knew what to expect, so it put us on guard even more. This was and remains to this day the toughest man I have ever seen. He stood about 6'2", maybe 6'3". I am 6"4" tall. He weighed around 230, and I have personally witnessed him lifting two fully loaded, adult male police officers off the ground, one on each arm, after being tasered and pepper sprayed. In fact, the night he attacked me, a nurse tried to give him a haldol injection and literally abandoned her efforts because not one but two 18 gauge needles bent in half without penetrating his bare skin. Haldol is usually injected with a 22 gauge needle - much, much smaller than the two that ruined themselves on his skin. To make this long story short, he slammed me twice, once along my jaw at the bottom of my ear, and once right in the front of my neck. I was alone with him, with my backup in the hallway outside talking to the nurse. When I collected my thoughts, I drove the outside of my forearm as hard as I could right into the side of his neck. This is a technique the pressure point folks call a brachial stun, and it is as reliable as anything I've ever used. It has been effective on bigger people with much less effort before, and fearing for my safety, I hit him with everything I had in me. I intended to knock him straight into the morgue if that's what it took. He stood there looking at me as if it hadn't happened. I repeated the attack with the same result. Finally, my partner and two other guards came into the room and I tackled him into his bedside rail. Despite splitting his scalp to the skull, he continued to fight us all until we had piled 8 people into the room and strapped him down. The incident taught me several important lessons:

#1 - I can take a pretty good shot and fight on with a clear head if the need arises. I had been hit by the strongest man I ever met, and while he was drugged up on crack to boot, right square in the throat. I coughed for a few days, but I was fine.

#2 - He took my best shots without so much as a blink. The shot I planted on him should have knocked him absolutely senseless. Instead, it didn't even move him. Even when I "corrected" my aim and hit him the second time (and he was standing near motionless when I connected), nothing happened. Granted he is freakishly strong, and no doubt feeling the benefits of alcohol and crack as pain killers, but my point remains - NOTHING HAPPENED.

#3 - If I can take his best shots bareknuckled and he could take mine, then I need to prepare more offensively than just one killer shot, even if it's to something as sensitive as the side of the neck. I have knocked out no less than 8 people with the same shot; 4 in training and 4 documented assaults in the line of duty. At 6'4" tall and 250 pounds (at the time), I was benching well over 300 lbs, and I was training actively for 4-5 hours a day. It still took eight security guards and hospital ER technicians to subdue ol' Chuck.

In the end, you may have abnormal strength or power, and you may be able to apply things no one else in the whole world can apply. But I still maintain that without a good bit of luck on your side, the one-punch theory is worthless in the extreme, and coupled with expecting to hit a precise quarter sized pressure point in the heat of battle makes it all the more ridiculous. And please don't take offense to this, but the fact that you say you reserve the technique for the most extreme of situations tells me you never or almost never spar with it, which means it's unproven - it's based on the theory that if your hands are hard enough and you can bench press a bulldozer, you'll have a magic touch. I'm still going to need some major first hand proof to outweigh my own experiences on this one, but I'm staying open-minded. And I've also read the Mas Oyama stories. Part truth and part legend, I'd imagine, just like so many things written about Bruce Lee. He was a badass to be sure, but I'd like to see a police report about a man killing another man at a dance with one punch before I buy the hype. If it happened, you can be sure that they didn't just keep dancing around the guy's corpse. Killing someone almost always gets local authorities involved, and with all the stories of such deeds, I find it amazing that there are no accompanying stories of the trial that certainly followed. Just my skeptical side, I guess.

PS: Ht, sorry for the misquote. I prostrate myself at your feet and beg your forgiveness. BTW, have you checked your private message on Warrior's Way yet?

sounds like the dude was on pcp. crackheads are usually weak because all the methanphetamines make their bones weak, its pcp that makes people able to take rediculously damaging hits without flinching.

[Garland]

PCP generation???
When the hell was that?
PCP has never been hip.
Now...I can see the story if it's crack and hard liquor...because that makes more sense...which is how the story's stated.
Man...people have varying pain thresholds...and if their sense of reality is out of whack...on anything that doesn't prohibit motor skills or motivation....than there's going to be a hard time subduing them with pain.
Better to just hit them, knock them down, and keep hitting them until they can't move.
Hell...give me two valium, a pint of jack daniels...and I'll put up a hell of a fight...AND start hitting on fat chicks.
God...I've got no standards...oh, well...Fat chicks need love too, right guys...I'm providing a service....and I should be charging money. (Cuz I gots da skillz to pay da billz.) Word up.