I think Wing Chun > Boxing on the street. In the ring, however, wing chun would only win if they trained to an extreme with lots of sparring, conditioning, etc.
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mixing Wing Chun and Boxing?
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Rationally I dont have to prove a negative. I dont have to prove that WC is NOT effective. It is down to the proponents of it to prove that it is.
If we do not follow this basic rule of argument, I can charge you all $1000 for membership of this forum, and you have to "prove" that I have no right to do so...... But thats silly, isn't it.
No? Send me a pm for my address. Cheque or cash.
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Originally posted by Thai BriRationally I dont have to prove a negative. I dont have to prove that WC is NOT effective. It is down to the proponents of it to prove that it is.
If we do not follow this basic rule of argument, I can charge you all $1000 for membership of this forum, and you have to "prove" that I have no right to do so...... But thats silly, isn't it.
No? Send me a pm for my address. Cheque or cash.
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I never said all that about "any" boxer, "any" fight and "any" day of the week of course. You putting words into my mouth is symptomatic of your inability to prove a point.
But Boxing is a better self defence art than Wing Chun. Heres the super quick version as to why.
1. WC train like pussies in comparison to the brutal fitness and hard contact training that boxwers undergo.
2. Boxers have a much smaller syllabus. They are masters of a few techniques that have wide application potential, whereas Wing Chun has more techniques that can be really mastered by anyone.
3. Boxing punches are fluid and flexible. WC tap tap tap with their ineffectual little straight jabs, like a pregnant woodpecker thats had a hard night on the booze.......
4. Boxers prove themselves in realistic conditions. WC "Masters" build up reputations by impressing the already converted with flashy demos.
5. Boxers spend all their time on relevant training. WC people play at Chi Sao, forms and air punching in much of their training time. They "imagine" it to be relevant trainng. But it isn't.
6. WC exploded in popularity. Like so many other "popular" arts, standards dropped as instructors made money out of dishing out grades to as many paying members of the public they could. But this is not pssible in Boxing. There are no grades. In order to prove themselevs they fight each other, so theres no deception as to real ability.
Now I don't think boxing is a complete art. Not by a long way. It would have to include pre emptive strike/fence training, some kind of grappling and verbal judo etc for that. But it is a far far better base upon which to build your self defence around than flashy flicky jabby crappy mainstream Wing Chun.
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Originally posted by Thai BriI never said all that about "any" boxer, "any" fight and "any" day of the week of course. You putting words into my mouth is symptomatic of your inability to prove a point.
But Boxing is a better self defence art than Wing Chun. Heres the super quick version as to why.
1. WC train like pussies in comparison to the brutal fitness and hard contact training that boxwers undergo.
while Boxers only used their face and chest to block the WC's oncoming hand attacks....
Originally posted by Thai Bri2. Boxers have a much smaller syllabus. They are masters of a few techniques that have wide application potential, whereas Wing Chun has more techniques that can be really mastered by anyone.
Originally posted by Thai Bri3. Boxing punches are fluid and flexible. WC tap tap tap with their ineffectual little straight jabs, like a pregnant woodpecker thats had a hard night on the booze.......
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I think you have something against Wing Chun. In your posts you try to prove Wing Chun wrong...Well I practiced western boxing before going to wing chun and I saw that it suited me better, but I will never look down on boxing just becaue now I practice wing chun...I still use jabs, cross and hooks, and I think they are useful in fighting.
Why you have to say "boxing is better than...BJJ is better than..."...I would say "TO ME boxing is better than..."and so on. If you find wing chun useless for your fighting no problem, but you shouldn't insult the wing chun style. And it's not easy to master wing chun, you become efficient only after at least 4 years of intense practice and to master it one should spend 10 years up, but that depends on the person. And chi-sau is only an exercise, it is not sparring or fighting. When a wing chun practitioner fights you will never see him doing chi sao. Many so-called wing chun masters have down-graded the art, and many schools around are not what they claim to be. But I can name a few good masters, those I know to be really good: Hawkins Cheung, Yip Chun, Austin Goh, Leung Ting(in HK). There is too much talking about wing chun, I agree, and most of it is useless and false. But if you really think that the style is no good then you shouldn't have any problems going to one of the above schools and have a fight with an instructor.
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Of course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best.
If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough.
I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video.
Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot).
That's plain common sense.
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Originally posted by Thai BriOf course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best.
If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough.
I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video.
Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot).
That's plain common sense.
click this link:
then enjoy, this will be good to you, true
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In fact, I think EVERYONE should click on that site. Look at the pictures. Look how ridiculous those pencil necks are. Look how they don't even train with the rght distance, as they block fully extending punches that DON'T EVEN REACH THEIR HEADS!
Its so poor. So awful. Pathetic.
ps - Convinced?
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Originally posted by Thai BriOf course there are people who can apply it. But ALL reasonable boxers can apply their art, not only the best of the best.
If you want to do Wing Chun, then do it. I couldn't care less. I'm into the fighting arts for self defence. If it takes years and years to "become effective" then it is hardly useful to me. I gave it 12 months of hard training. That was enough.
I saw Senshido's video "The Shredder" and grew more as a fighter MERELY BY WATCHING THE VIDEO than the entire 12 months WC training. And I am deadly serious. I did the same thing with Geoff Thompson's "The Fence" video.
Thats one of the many great martial arts myths. That the longer it takes to learn an art, the better it must be. It adds to the mystery of it all.... But, of course, the SHORTER time it takes to learn the better. Why learn how to ride the uni-cycle when you can get on a bike (and go faster to boot).
That's plain common sense.
Anyway, how can you learn a fighting art from videos?
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We'll have to agree to disagree about WC.
As for learning from videos, I guess you just have to see them. Firstly I have built up many relevant skills in the first place of course. But the two videos mentioned are about APPLYING those skills.
Neither say, "this is how you punch, this is how you kick". They are both about how to get your techniques home.
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best regards
..Now..if only Thai Bri knew Wing Chun...go see Cheung, William.
He's Bruce Lee's mate... Introduced him to Yip Man don't ya know.
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I agree. Boxing negates the theories in wing chun. I am 5'6" 147lbs. Boxing is blow for blow power based fighting. Smaller people don't have a chance chance without technique based (or stressed) fighting systems. I'd rather keep from getting hit than keep exchanging punches until one person drops.
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