The reality of Kungfu

[roku]

...and anything with the word butterfly in it definitely belongs to a fake martial art!

OK, Darriannation, I pretty much agree with most of what I've seen you post, and I thought your kid safety posts were excellent. I do have to call this on a technicality... "butterfly guard" in BJJ . While I seem to get that BJJ isn't your favorite MA, you probably wouldn't refer to it as a fake art.

BTW, I've had a few questions for you from both your kid safety posts and some things I've seen you write on combatives...

1. Did you actually author those kid safety checklists/recommendations yourself or get them from some guides. If the former, I'm truly impressed. If the latter, great posts all the same.

2. Does your screen name have any particular significance besides a play on your name or nick?

3. If someone wanted to get an intro to some good combatives, do you have any particular recommendations?

4. Any opinions about Senshido?

Thanks.

[darrianation]

OK, Darriannation, I pretty much agree with most of what I've seen you post, and I thought your kid safety posts were excellent. I do have to call this on a technicality... "butterfly guard" in BJJ . While I seem to get that BJJ isn't your favorite MA, you probably wouldn't refer to it as a fake art.

IF BJJ has a butterfly in it, it must be fake . Actually I am a fan of BJJ, I like it very much! I think it’s a great sport and solid adjunct to self-defense. As a stand-alone system for self-defense I don’t think it’s great. You need striking and weapons also. Ground fighting skills are important but you shouldn’t want to go to the ground in a real fight, but shit happens, so you need to be prepared.

BTW, I've had a few questions for you from both your kid safety posts and some things I've seen you write on combatives...

1. Did you actually author those kid safety checklists/recommendations yourself or get them from some guides. If the former, I'm truly impressed. If the latter, great posts all the same.

On the Karate kids thread? The tips were from me but the actual checklist was from the FBI web site.

2. Does your screen name have any particular significance besides a play on your name or nick?

It actually is very close to my real name Darren.

3. If someone wanted to get an intro to some good combatives, do you have any particular recommendations?

These are some good ones:

1) Gunsite- (Arizona)
2) Thunder ranch- (Texas, and I believe Oregon)
3) CHRISTIAN GATICA (Crucibles)
4) Jim Grover (AKA Kelly McCann of the Crucibles) (You can get his videos Paladan press)
5) Massad Ayoob lethal force institute
6) Geoff Thompson
7) Sammy Franco
8) Richard Dimitri
9) Jim Wagner
10) Peyton Quinn
11) Rex Applegate
12) Jeff Cooper
13) Carl Castries
14) AMOK
15) And many others

The main thing I look for when I am looking at a self-defense system Are:
1) Combat psychology and mindset (dealing with fear and the effects of adrenaline)
2) Realistic (plausible), detailed scenarios that work all aspects of SD
3) Live action drills (Unpredictable, dynamic, full speed and power, without cooperation from you partner)
4) Functional techniques
5) Striking, grappling (including ground work), and weapons (modern weapons Knives, Guns, sticks, chemical, stun, and improvised)

*guns if applicable

Functional techniques are:

1) Functional techniques works well against a wide variety of attacks at high percentages.
2) Functional techniques take advantage of natural reactions, body type, and natural abilities (they can be individualized)
3) Functional techniques are easy to learn and retain.
4) Functional techniques primarily use gross motor skills.
5) Functional techniques do not need to be modified or adjusted to meet the large number of varying attacks.

*Functional techniques can work effectively either as a stand alone, or in combination with other functional techniques that work just as well against a large number of different attacks.

4. Any opinions about Senshido?

Thanks.

[/QUOTE]
It’s good I would recommend it. I really like the shredder it makes a great compliment to whatever martial art you do. I also recommend ROSS and Combat Sambo.

[sherwinc]

I like sherwinc’s definition the best: Sherwinc’s definition of fake KF is “Any kung fu system who's practitioner is beaten by any non-kung fu practitioner or school, is fake kung fu. Sweet definition huh?

DEFINITION OF THE FAKE KUNGFU:
1. No Battle Flags / No Mother Flags..... one of the purpose is to know how many kungfu students and practitioners there in your kungfu club.
2. The presence of Samurai Sword or Arnis Sword instead of Jian, Kwan Do, Tri-sectional Staff, etc.......
3. Black Belt rankings........ instead of only one standard club color sash used.
4. Wearing of such Kimono uniforms instead of Kamiseta Chino or white t-shirt or kungfu uniform....
5. The structure of the Form
6. The Verbal Commands, especially those English commands
7. When executing the kungfu forms, it does not back to where it begins......
8. The broken Rhythm movement like those of karate and tae kwon do....
9. etc.........

DEFINITION OF THE COMMERCIALIZED KUNGFU:
1. The fare/money that you pay for your instructor is too not reasonable.....
2. Using kungfu in a fight seems stupid, and you wonder why.....
3. etc.........

CONVINCED????????

[m.artist]

I like sherwinc’s definition the best: Sherwinc’s definition of fake KF is “Any kung fu system who's practitioner is beaten by any non-kung fu practitioner or school, is fake kung fu. Sweet definition huh

oh well that's convienent

[DrAgOn-T]

Ok you martial arts god. Try this. Go to a great tai chi school with an old master and try to kick him and put a rear choke. On secong thought videotape it and tell me what happens. You obbviously have no idea what you are talking about and dont even have respect for other peoples styles.

hey at least you got the martial arts god part right. I'll pencil in the old guy beating right in between my oriental massage and afternoon tea.

[DrAgOn-T]

by the way I have respect for all styles it's the people who say kung fu is the best I was aiming this at.

[yentao]

So dragont, you are saying you just need some attention? Well you sure did and started an immature posts following up by others doing so in reply of it. But it was pretty funny man, it would have been better if you didn't post something like that because it won't change a thing about those people you are addressing except that you have shown how immature you really are and insult those you shouldn't have insulted. Take care....

[DrAgOn-T]

love you too

[darrianation]

DEFINITION OF THE FAKE KUNGFU:
1. No Battle Flags / No Mother Flags..... one of the purpose is to know how many kungfu students and practitioners there in your kungfu club.
2. The presence of Samurai Sword or Arnis Sword instead of Jian, Kwan Do, Tri-sectional Staff, etc.......
3. Black Belt rankings........ instead of only one standard club color sash used.
4. Wearing of such Kimono uniforms instead of Kamiseta Chino or white t-shirt or kungfu uniform....
5. The structure of the Form
6. The Verbal Commands, especially those English commands
7. When executing the kungfu forms, it does not back to where it begins......
8. The broken Rhythm movement like those of karate and tae kwon do....
9. etc.........

DEFINITION OF THE COMMERCIALIZED KUNGFU:
1. The fare/money that you pay for your instructor is too not reasonable.....
2. Using kungfu in a fight seems stupid, and you wonder why.....
3. etc.........

CONVINCED????????

Sounds like you’re back peddling.

I still like your other definition of KF better. Every time I say I have beaten a Kung Fu guy you say because he is in fake or commercialized kung fu. Every time someone else claims to have beaten a KF guy you say because he's fake. Every time a KF guy is beaten in the UFCs, you say he's fake. Every time anyone posts a vid clip of a kung fu guy loosing to a MMA or a MT guy you say the KF guy is from a fake/commercialized school.

You are just oblivious to the fact that even real Kung Fu guys can really be beaten. Kung Fu is not a demigod to the martial arts world.

[m.artist]

Sounds like you’re back peddling.

I still like your other definition of KF better. Every time I say I have beaten a Kung Fu guy you say because he is in fake or commercialized kung fu. Every time someone else claims to have beaten a KF guy you say because he's fake. Every time a KF guy is beaten in the UFCs, you say he's fake. Every time anyone posts a vid clip of a kung fu guy loosing to a MMA or a MT guy you say the KF guy is from a fake/commercialized school.

You are just oblivious to the fact that even real Kung Fu guys can really be beaten. Kung Fu is not a demigod to the martial arts world.

i think those are some of thee wisest words sherwinc will ever read

[jubaji]

LOL Ironically enough i didnt feel mean enough to write it, .

I rarely have that problem.

[sherwinc]

i think those are some of thee wisest words sherwinc will ever read

of all i know, once a KungFu Master, KungFu Instructor - once beaten in a fight even just once.......

they will surrender their art and they will no longer practice anymore since they lost their dignity, will, etc.......

Want a good example???????

Chua Giok Beng of Ngo Cho Kun KungFu defeated his unbeatable KungFu opponents........ Chua Giok Beng's opponents are now his respectable closed students.........

Question:
Is your instructor had any experience beaten in a fair no rules fight/matches?
Where is he now?????
Is he continue learning his martial art??????

you know, even the BattleFlags and MotherFlags of the Non-commercialized kungfu schools fall down the ground - their kungfu school will automatically closed before they fix their battle/mother flags to stand........

Note:
You said Tyson is great, inspite of many winning fights of him, how many fights also that he lost????????
In KungFu - you defeated the match only once and you can no longer join anymore, why?????? cause even in yourself - you are very ashamed for what happens to you......

in kungfu:
example, for 10years of practicing kungfu, beaten in a fight just once is a shamefull thing.....

another example:
some of the Japanese especially ninja's do cut their head if they beaten in the fight just once......

CONVINCED???????

[darrianation]

Sherwinc-

You poor brain washed son of a bitch! They really have a grip on you, you will follow the Kung Fu god to the slaughter with unwavering faith in a man made system.

Then truly there is no real kung fu because someone, somewhere in each and every system has lost at some point. Practitioners from Shoalin KF have lost at some point, Wing chun has lost, Ngo Cho Kun has lost, and etc, etc.

Have you ever heard of deprogramming? This is what you need. You believe Kung Fu is god! It is not! Kung Fu is man made therefore fallible. Its practitioners are fallible, it is not perfect, holy, or mystically superior to anything else. My teacher says this, my teacher says that, you are a plain old' fool to believe such nonsense.

Dude, do you even now what reality is? I doubt it little lotus flower, you are living in a fantasy world, a make believe world believing in fables and magic death touches and other blatant bull shit like that. You should be committed to a mental institution somewhere.

If you have deep seeded spiritual connections to Kung Fu then fine but spirituality, health, and all of the feel good bullshit in Kung Fu does not translate into fighting superiority. Kung Fu looses all the times to non-kung fu systems it’s a fact of life except it and get over it! I am tired of your wining and grasshopper philosophy. So shut up and get some professional help.

[sherwinc]

my friend, pls calm yourself, we do only sharing of our thought, ideas, and that.....

if you were here only besides me i'll buy you a free beer ok?

[darrianation]

my friend, pls calm yourself, we do only sharing of our thought, ideas, and that.....

if you were here only besides me i'll buy you a free beer ok?

Sherwinc you definitely need that beer but lay off the ganja. I have no problem with people having there oppositions and sharing what they think, or telling me what they think of mine. But…There needs to be a rational, common sense explanations for why they think the way they do.

Your arguments as far as I can tell lack both common sense and rationale. You repeat what your teacher tells you as if you hang on every word he or they say as if it’s the almighty truth and there can be no error to what they say. You talk in absolutes, but you do so without any real world experience. You use the same intangible arguments to dismiss any ding in the armor of the almighty kung fu:” He practices fake/commercialized kung fu. KF is to deadly to use in the UFC, or secret kung fu is real and superior to non-secret kung fu or to any non-kung fu”.

You come across at least to me like you belong to some kung fu cult with an absolute authoritarian leader who is seen by the practitioners to have an exclusive position as a mediator between the kung fu Gods or some higher mystical power and the rest of us. You seem to be excessively zealous, unquestionably commitment to the identity of your teacher, and believing in your own elite status and malevolence of all outsiders who oppose your views.

Even konghan who I do not agree with argues with reasonable ideas and common sense opinions (although some maybe questionable in my mind). This I can respect, because he does so rationally and with real world experience.

I think Kung Fu has a lot of good things in it even some functionality but it goes to far. It takes movement and techniques to excess, and at that point becomes wasteful. I understand the religious and spiritual tones to it because of the culture in which it came, but to me as a westerner it lacks any real significance, because what I am interested in is fighting, pure and simply self-defense. Kung fu to me is nothing more than a feel good art that may have a few effective components but goes off the deep end of efficiency and doesn’t hold any real value to me or my goals.

If you want to claim spirituality, healing, and Zen, becoming one with nature or oneself then fine I think Kung Fu is good for that. But stop babbling about its effectiveness and efficiency when it comes to real street combat. Kung Fu involves to many extracurricular activities to be efficient and takes to long a period of time to become effective, and even then there are to many non-applicable elements to be considered a relevant combat effective system in today’s modern world.