Has anyone fought decent chinese MA practitioners?

[darrianation]

Does this technique trigger the same defensive reflexes that Ive heard the shredder can make even experienced people do?(i heard that shredder makes people curl up and hide kind of)

Yes. Think of it this way, no matter how big you are or how bad ass you are, or how well trained you are, there is nothing that prepares you for or trains you for fingers being deeply shoved into your eye sockets. This will ruin your day every time!

You basically overcome or circumvent their OODA.

[Bjjexpertise@be]

So what exactly is the shredder?

[jubaji]

For him to elbow you effectively he needs torque, to have torque you need distance. If you keep him close he cannot effectively elbow. The same goes for you, you cannot elbow him either because the distance I am talking about negates torque. .

I didn't say "elbow him", I said post his elbows, for which you do not need torque or distance, of course.

[jubaji]

Yes. Think of it this way, no matter how big you are or how bad ass you are, or how well trained you are, there is nothing that prepares you for or trains you for fingers being deeply shoved into your eye sockets. This will ruin your day every time!

You basically overcome or circumvent their OODA.

Ai-yaa, not this bs again.

[jubaji]

Hooks can be blocked by raising you arms, or negated by getting your head up under his chin. .

...................................

You hope.

[jubaji]

Anyhow if he is being driven backwards he has no damaging power. .

Uh-huh


I'm sure you boxed at least a little at some point in your life. I assume you know better than to back up in a straight line.





Btw, I'll eagerly await your report on how it works on someone who has a significant height/weight advantage over you.

[bartjam]

So what exactly is the shredder?

check it out here:

http://www.senshido.com/swwd2.html

its creator has realized two videos on it. They are great stuff

[darrianation]

Jubaji,

You like to scrutinize everything don’t you? That’s great, I do to. I have scrutinized this concept over a period of many years. I first came on to it in 1988 by way a very experienced real world guy, a guy who was an anti-terrorism expert for the state department in diplomat protection and trained police, FBI, and military spec-ops guys in combatives (tactical- weapons, knives, and H2H). Anyway, a group of us took it and ran with it. We experimented with it under just about every conceivable way we could think of and some of these guys were pretty creative. It stood up to all of our attempts to prove it wrong or right.

"I didn't say "elbow him", I said post his elbows, for which you do not need torque or distance, of course." Jubaji

Not exactly sure what you mean in this particular case, but this is a strong technique. It can be done from any stance even the neutral (non-assuming) stance. It is basically non-telegraphed and explosive, and uses strong leveraging. It can be very difficult (but not impossible) to redirect the energy, trap the arms, or knock them out of the way.

As for hooks, if the BG is being driven back, true he can still land a shot but this shot will be from a deposition that is not conducive to causing much if any damage. I Demonstrate this with someone punching me with hooks or what ever he wants wearing nothing but bag gloves (and I am not wearing any head protection) to show them as long as I am driving them back they cant hurt me, even if they do land a shot or two.

It does work against bigger taller guys, even someone who can bench press 500lbs. Especially if you follow it with rapid and determined eyes attacks. Even muscle bound guys cannot build/prepare his eyes for this even he will turn (most likely) from the onslaught. At any rate this is taught in many women’s groups. I have taught it to women and have received positive feed back that it worked in the real world.
Even guys that are 260 lbs lack the power under these conditions. Now can a 140lb’er do this to a 260lb’er? Well, it’s probably as good as anything else he can do. That’s why there weapons for great size disparity equalizers. The 140lb’er can us it as a clearing technique to clear the bad guy enough to draw his weapon. We use this technique in close quarter combatives to clear and acquire (for firearms).

Try this Bend someone backwards and exert pressure so they are falling back and while you are applying pressure on them see how hard they can hit. They can’t hit all that hard even if they can bench press a small car. Or just clinch them and run them back and do the same thing, you’ll get the same results.


"I'm sure you boxed at least a little at some point in your life. I assume you know better than to back up in a straight line." Jubaji

Yes I have boxed, The trick is you are not moving backwards, you are driving him back. Can he twist out or move off line or some other way escape the forward drive? Yes, eventually he probably will. But you have to remember this sudden and violent pre-emptive attack or counter-offensive does mess with or even over ride his psychology. Even trained MAs can succumb to its psychological effects. Count on it? No, but it does work on a high percentage.


As far as its effectiveness in the real world I Know a lot of guys who have used this or a variant very successfully against larger stronger opponents. I have a friend who is a professional body guard that spends a lot of time on the job JO’ Berg South Africa (as well as other places) and he swears by this technique. I also have used it successfully as a body guard and in street confrontations. I also have other acquaintances that have used this very successfully as well.

Still the thing I like best about it is regardless if he’s trying to post your elbows, or he’s punching, or he’s grabbing on, or even he’s spitting or doing what ever, this technique is strong enough, defensive enough to move right through his attacks and nail him.

To me the Blast (not the straight blast) has everything you want from a technique. It can be used as a clearing technique from the neutral/ready stance from close range, or a breeching technique to get inside to allow you to do other nasty things. If you think about it and compare it to say the cross it actually has less components in it that the cross does. The cross has arm movement, wrist turn, weight redistribution, turning on the ball of the back foot, trunk/shoulder/back twist, maintain a guard with opposite arm and etc. The blast has some of these things but it actually fewer in number. It doesn’t get much easier. It is also aggressive, it disrupts the BG’s psyche, and it distracts him, disorientates him, and off balances him. Also it does not require perfect execution, it is gross motor skilled, what more can you ask of a technique?

Well I described the technique and why I like it so much. Is this techniques fool proof? No! Can it be defeated? Any technique can be defeated. Can you find weaknesses? Yes, all techniques have weaknesses. My philosophy when it comes to any technique, tactics, or strategies is this:

There are no 100% techniques. There are no guarantees. You cannot predict what the other guy will do, nor how tough he is, or how ferocious he will fight. Nothing in fighting works all the time for all the people. To me it’s about keeping your arsenal small, keeping your techniques uncomplicated, and at the end of the day the best you can really hope for is to be a capable person, and have a small group of techniques that you can rely on to work the majority of the time, in the majority of situations.

[jubaji]

This is a prime example of kungfoolery. "The technique" is all-powerful, "eye gouge" will erase natural advantage and experience. Sorry champ, I'm sure a good smack in the head is wonderful, but you are spouting the type of bs that one would expect from a teenager who just saw a Hong Kong film.

[darrianation]

This is a prime example of kungfoolery. "The technique" is all-powerful, "eye gouge" will erase natural advantage and experience. Sorry champ, I'm sure a good smack in the head is wonderful, but you are spouting the type of bs that one would expect from a teenager who just saw a Hong Kong film.

So, are you fuckin’ with me? You know I stated there are many names for this technique, and one of them is the chin jab. The chin jab is advocated and endorsed by many competent professional combatives instructors such as:

Fairbairn, Sykes, Styers, Applegate, Dennis Martin, Kelly MCcann, Carl Cestari, Peyton, Quinn to just name o few.

My version takes on the shape of Mr. MCcann’s because it’s just as offensive as Fairbairn’s but it is a little more defensive as well.

An example of me using it:

I was working a VIP detail for a political candidate running for national office. He was touring the country making campaign speeches. One afternoon after his speech he was mingling with the crowd shaking hands and doing photo ops, when a guy approached shook his hand and began berating my client for his politics. I approached positioned myself between him and my client and said “Sir you need to move back” He ignored me and continued with his verbal assault while becoming more aggressive. I again said, “Sir, you need to get back now”. He again ignored me, I then grabbed his arm, and he immediately pulled away. I immediately launched into a blast as his arm was still being retracted. He turned slightly as he retracted his arm so his head turned at a small angle. my left palm landed on his jaw and my right landed on his ear. He was up ended and went to the ground before he could get up again I along with another teammate scooped him up while other team members re-positioned our client.

This technique is simple to learn and easy to retain. As an example I taught a women’s SD seminar a few months ago and taught the blast/chin jab at the seminar. We spent a total of 15-minutes on this particular technique. Two months later she came and began training with me. She didn’t remember all the stuff I taught at the seminar (although I put it in the handouts of techniques and how to practice them) but she could execute the blast superbly. Another example one of my other students I taught this to him on his first lesson, and then he wanted me to work on his kickboxing skills, so the next month that’s all we did. After a month had gone by he still nearly put me on my ass when I had him do the blast on a shield I was holding.

So this technique is:

1) Endorsed by some of the best in the business
2) Simple to learn
3) Easy to retain without much practice
4) Non-telegraphed, quick, and powerful
5) Does not require great size, strength, or athletic ability to perform it
6)) Effective and works at a large percentage

Now the follow-ups I described can be a little more difficult and takes more practice but they take advantage of the priority targets:

1) Eyes
2) Throat
3) Brain stem/base of spine
4) Groin

*Other good targets of opportunity, chin/jaw, ears, temple neck, knees, shins, kidneys, solar plexus, and etc.

This technique is in the top 2 or 3 techniques of every professional that I associate with or know. So, where is the kungfoolery in this technique? It is true that many MAs including CMAs have some version of this, but that just shows it’s dexterity and usefulness. In kungfoolery they employ many techniques that rely on perfect execution, such as complicated footwork, precise timing, laser targeting, and fine motor skills that has to be performed under a high measure of stress, fear, and adrenaline. Such as complicated trapping, punching arm intercepting and bashing, etc. This chin jab/blast doesn’t rely on any of these things.

So, if you think this technique is KF crap then I would be very interested to hear what you think a good technique is, and why?

[Tom Yum]

This is a prime example of kungfoolery. "The technique" is all-powerful, "eye gouge" will erase natural advantage and experience. Sorry champ, I'm sure a good smack in the head is wonderful, but you are spouting the type of bs that one would expect from a teenager who just saw a Hong Kong film.

I think the point he is getting at is that the technique can work in a self-defense situation where you are not necessarily dealing with a Randy Couture or Crocop, rather an angry and obsessed Joe Blow with the intent of harm.

In a self-defense situation, how often are you really pitted against world champion fighters? Or even decent amateurs?

Alot of the brawls that i've seen begin with 2 or 3 dudes swinging at each other, but it starts off with shoving, haymakers and "bench press" shoulder punches that become downward rabbit punches as the fight closes the distance. The only time anyone gets knocked down is if they are charging in, with chin up (you know, the "what's up" pose), hands down and happen to charge into one of the bench press punches.

From there you might see some groin soccer kicks and even attempts at TKD style roundhouses (with even less hip turnover than a TKD blue belt) intermixed with pushing and quick flurries of bench punches and downward rabbit punches.

After 3-4 minutes of constant brawling, both dudes are completely gassed and in some kind of a crude clinch, hitting each other with more rabbit punches....by now at least one of the dudes has taken 10 punches and hasn't gone down, but has some dark welts to show for his troubles, maybe a cut lip...the more sophisticated street dude will try and headbut, stomp or tackle the other and finish by ground and pound.

Total fight time, less than 10 minutes.

[jubaji]

So, are you fuckin’ with me? You know I stated there are many names for this technique, and one of them is the chin jab. The chin jab is advocated and endorsed by many competent professional combatives instructors such as:

Listen to yourself. "The move" does this, "the move" can do that, "the move" is sold by...blah,blah,blah. Like a little kid who just learned to ride a bike. Textbook kungfoolery.

I'm sure you'll agree that many, many more fights have been ended with a straight right than with your miracle move. I guess I should convince you that it is a super-duper extra special top secret army forces bouncer body guard cia fbi nsa abc faa technique that can turn a 98 lb weakling into an unstoppable killing machine. Perhaps I can even get you to part with $ for a video, t-shirt, and autographed underwear.

Wake the **** up!

[darrianation]

Listen to yourself. "The move" does this, "the move" can do that, "the move" is sold by...blah,blah,blah. Like a little kid who just learned to ride a bike. Textbook kungfoolery.

I'm sure you'll agree that many, many more fights have been ended with a straight right than with your miracle move. I guess I should convince you that it is a super-duper extra special top secret army forces bouncer body guard cia fbi nsa abc faa technique that can turn a 98 lb weakling into an unstoppable killing machine. Perhaps I can even get you to part with $ for a video, t-shirt, and autographed underwear.

Wake the **** up!

Wow, save the drama! I like the straight right too. You made the big deal about my technique, that’s the only reason I went into it so deeply. I thought maybe you weren’t getting it, but I believe you do get it but you just like the dramatics. The blast is actually just as simple as the straight right, but more aggressive, hits harder, and makes a better clearing technique for ESQB weapons acquisition, just another difference between those people who train in sport and those who train in combatives. The only reason the straight or cross is used more often is because more people train with it. However it’s a great technique too. Also more people injure their hands with a straight/cross (in the street).

I have seen plenty of people get knocked out with the straight but never a broken neck from it. On the other hand I have actually seen a guy get his neck broken from the blast. Don’t get me wrong I love the straight right it is very powerful, easy, and effective. It has all the stuff that makes a good technique.

When you grow up and understand that there is a difference between training in sport MAs and combatives then we can talk. And talk about 13 year olds the majority of your posts lack any substance at all, but silly name-calling and making fun of people. I think your pretty fun most of the time, I guess your purpose here is to amuse us. So’ don’t go calling me a 13 y/o when you aren’t able to carry on an adult conversation your self.

"I am slowly loosing my faith in the martial arts one idiot artist at a time"- ME

[jubaji]

Could you miss the point a little more?

Wow, save the drama! I like the straight right too.

Yeah, it's your over dramatics that I'm talking about, dope. You're about wetting yourself over this "miracle move". Someone played you for a chump and convinced you that they had reinvented the wheel and you bought it. How many video tapes did they sell you?

[darrianation]

Yeah, it's your over dramatics that I'm talking about, dope. You're about wetting yourself over this "miracle move". Someone played you for a chump and convinced you that they had reinvented the wheel and you bought it. How many video tapes did they sell you?

Okay drama Queen; does that come with two snaps and a hip shake? It sounds like you get your posting advice from the queer guys.