the Animal styles of Kung Fu

[HuSanYan]

DimWitMoc, thank you for a very informative read, nicely worded as well.
to be honest I dont think that the animal styles are for me, i have spent far too much time over the years in 'modern' combat situations (ex-military) to realise that immitating an animal could cost a person his life.
Do not get me wrong, I am still very interested in Kung Fu and may well have a go at one of the above styles in the future, like i said, there will be a time when I feel too old for boxing/muay thai etc and it may well be a very enjoyable thing to do.

Let me ask you a question, have you ever seen in real life someone use one of the above styles to win a real fight?,

i am curious.

once again, thanks for the info above.

[HuSanYan]

Dim, I have just read my above post and do not want to sound like many of the 'kf sucks' brigade.
there are 2 things that you mention above that actually make me fear taking up those particular styles and they are:-
1) holding the hands in strange and unatural positions other than a fist or open palm base, i believe that holding the hands in a fixed position does use up energy and also makes the brain get involved even if only for a split second which is often the difference between life and death or injury. A fist or open palm are quick natural and instinctive things to do.

2) any style that gets a person to stand on one leg is quite simply suicidal and shame on those quacks that teach such a thing.

Alexjitsu, Bagua. hmm, I will definetly have a look into that, and also the Hsing I that folks mention. i cannot comment on those until i do a bit of research.

[AlexJitsu]

No they don't.

Are you stupid?

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15523

[Li Mo Bai]

i think many thousand people study the animal sistems and they can work for the right peoples, very popular indeed.

[Dim Wit Moc]

HuSanYan: I don't disagree with you on hand positions. A fellow martial artist that I greatly respect, and who has studied both kung fu and kenpo for many years will honestly tell you that "weird" stances and hand positions can make you very vulnerable. If you assume an angled boxing stance with hands in tiger claw position, I feel this is very sound. The kenpo boxing stance with palms facing inward and hands open for quicker movement is even better in my opinion. Standing on one leg with hands formed in crane beaks has always felt weird to me. I don't even do it any more, but have no beef with someone if that's their cup of tea.

You have asked an honest question about fights I have seen with animal forms being used, and quite frankly I haven't. I am a high school teacher, and have sometimes used soft circular blocks accompanied by jiu jitsu locks when breaking up fights and protecting another student, but I've never gone on a Tiger Claw offensive, and have never seen it done. Well, come to think of it, sometimes when girls fight they do a pretty good Tiger Claw or at least kitty kat imitation with all the scratching they do. But you also have to look at fighting in a cultural context. There may be Asian Kung Fu students who have seen this and maybe quite frequently. I don't know and I'll let the persons who are coming from a different cultural context speak for themselves.

I appreciate your honest give and take dialogue. I enjoy exchanging and learning from people like yourself. There are two styles of Kung Fu you might want to look at before moving on to something else. Both Choy Li Fut and San Soo and known for their effectiveness. San Soo has no discernable animal forms except for the horse stance and it's late Grandmaster, Jimmy Woo, made the statement, "I not fight bug, I step on bug". This was an obvious reference to Preying Mantis and showed a disdain for animal forms in general. It is an ugly system, but very vicious, straightforward, and nasty.

There are animal forms in Choy Li Fut, but they don't look "flowery" to me. Choy Li Fut is a highly respected system in Asia from what I understand. I have read from a couple of sources that Bruce Lee accepted a challenge from a Choy Li Fut guy, and had all sorts of trouble. I guess Lee considered it a "draw", but who knows.

Choose what is best for you and it will be a good choice.

[HuSanYan]

thak you Dim Wit Mok

thanks a lot Dim, some very nicely spoken advice from your good self.
can i ask, when you refer to "San Soo", are you refferring to the sport/style of San Shou (proper Chinese Kickboxing)??, if so then yes, i have looked into this and have spoken with a number of teachers, basically it would still be as strenuous as MT or Boxing if not even more so because of all the throws etc., I happen to love SanShou and I think highly of Cung Le, those scissor kicks are just so great.

I still have a good few years of Boxing yet but as I mentioned above it might be nice at some stage to do something more aesthetically pleasing or relaxing, maybe I could do some Tai Chi.

on a seperate note, "Choy Li Fut" is a style I have looked into a bit, big circular movements (if I'm not mistaken, off the top of my head), powerful thrusts etc.. thats a very interesting style, some of those circular movements are supposedly good against multiple opponents in addition to one on one.

[Thai Bri]

Are you stupid?

http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...threadid=15523

No I am not. If I was I would try to evidence my view by posting a link to a Bullshido thread that names numerous different points of view...... with mine merely being one of many.

Its a bit like saying "look here, I can prove that mine is the best soccer team", and then posting a link where each different person all supoorts a different team.

Are you stupid?

[Dim Wit Moc]

HuSanYan: Good luck in your quest. Being a student of what the various martial arts have to offer is all part of the fun. Even people who think most martial arts have nothing to offer study them carefully so they can react to them.

San Soo is not the same as San Shou. You will not see San Soo students indoctrinated in the Jimmy Woo way in any tournament competition. If I were to capsulate the philosophy in a nutshell, it would be, "Stand like an innocuous dummy in a street stance (no obvious martial arts stance) and be coiled ready to fight. End it in one or two seconds with your opponent having something broken or dead". Do a web seach under Kung Fu San Soo, and a bunch of stuff will pop up. When you read material of San Soo students and instructors, it is kind of scary. You won't find any kind of Aikido type philosophy about doing minimal damage. It is an aggressive, I'm gonna srew you over good, mentality. The San Soo instructor I studied under for awhile looked like the devil in human form, and the guy was terrifying when you saw him spar.

There is a book on San Soo called "The Basic 45's" or something like that. Even though the system is quite complicated, many students feel one can do quite well just knowing these. Order and read it, and you will be able to determine if you are interested. If no form of Kung Fu is for you, then check out other stuff. Heck, maybe you'll end up jumping on the Muay Thai or BJJ bandwagon.

[MrPARaNoiD]

Anyone got any animal style vids?

if so please post them

[Tom Yum]

Anyone got any animal style vids?

if so please post them

Don't ask for the drunken cock style

That's the most evil of all shaolin animals.

Form 1 involves 'peck' the seeds, a series of spear finger techniques
Form 2 involves the chicken-choke (solo form, grappling)
Form 3 is the sticky-hands drill (with partner)

You must practice form 3 after form 2!!! It must be done in that order as form 2 cultivates proper chi for form 3.

[Shaolinkfman]

While hearing of a hsing-I Chicken, I have never heard of a drunken chicken style or the drills you mentioned. Sounds like wing chun not shaolin animal to me. And trust me, I know. Wanna see the school that I have learned the most from. http://www.shaolins.com/

[Tom Yum]

Do form 2 and form 3.

repeat

[sirmattu]

No they don't.

haha........ b e a utiful. i can just feel the love!

[taoistscholar]

There are probably styles for every animal out there because long ago everyone wanted to create the best style but the most common ones today are the styles that did well. Snake, Crane, Tiger, Leopard, Dragon, Eagle and Monkey are all common styles found today. Lots of the animal styles are part of the choy li fut branch.

[bbbb]

unnatural

Dim, I have just read my above post and do not want to sound like many of the 'kf sucks' brigade.
there are 2 things that you mention above that actually make me fear taking up those particular styles and they are:-
1) holding the hands in strange and unatural positions other than a fist or open palm base, i believe that holding the hands in a fixed position does use up energy and also makes the brain get involved even if only for a split second which is often the difference between life and death or injury. A fist or open palm are quick natural and instinctive things to do.

2) any style that gets a person to stand on one leg is quite simply suicidal and shame on those quacks that teach such a thing.

Alexjitsu, Bagua. hmm, I will definetly have a look into that, and also the Hsing I that folks mention. i cannot comment on those until i do a bit of research.

Ging Mo Kune is a modified SPM(I think!?)- No unnatural stances or hand position's in this...but maybe that's why it was modified!?

It's called Malcolm Sue Kung Fu Academy: but the website has got nothing to look at...which DOES bother me...Ya gotta have a website...surely???