karate and kung fu

[Oraenor]

There is a distinct difference between kung fu and karate despite the philosophical similarities. Visually I can tell between a kung fu practitioner and a karate one but explaining it is hard.Can anyone in here give me the words that will explain the difference between karate and kungfu?

[Nemes1s]

I think I heard some where that karate is a mix with kung fu and tae kwan do and some other style i'm not sure. I don't know if it's true though

[HtTKar]

http://www3.sympatico.ca/jeffrey.muir/jeffkove.htm

kungfu is an umbrella term for the Chinese martial arts.
A number of terms are used to describe Chinese martial arts and its various aspects:
*ch'uan fa (or quanfa) "way of the fist"
*kempo (actually a Japanese term) "way of the fist"
*kungfu (or gongfu) "human effort"
*tai chi ch'uan (or taijiquan) or taikyokuken (in Japanese) "supreme ultimate fist"
(wushu (or quanshu) "martial arts or art of war"
kungfu is used to describe all Chinese martial arts, although taijiquan is usually differentiated. Some Chinese martial arts emphasize fighting (and are sometimes referred to as "Chinese boxing"), while others emphasize katas or both.
In the past, kungfu grew up mostly in secrecy over centuries with students founding their own styles which led to a plethora of styles sharing many patterns and Katas. As a result it is hard to divide kungfu styles, although three general methods are used:

*northern Chinese (emphasizing kicks) versus southern Chinese styles (emphasizing hand techniques)
*wide (emphasizing fighting) versus narrow (emphasizing the theatrical nature of sets)
*external (explosive power in styles such as Shaolin kungfu) versus internal (dynamic breathing emphasizing channeling energy such as pakua (or bagua) *and tai chi ch'uan (or taijiquan))

Usually one sees a mixture of all these features in most Chinese fighting arts, but nonetheless it does provide a general classificatory framework for the styles. Kungfu styles might be named after an animal or object, while the sets practised within a style might also be named after the same animals or objects (for example many forms of Shaolin use five animal forms: Crane, Dragon, Snake, Tiger, and Leopard; while styles such as Drunken Monkey or White Crane exist). To most non-native observers of kungfu, this is a source of considerable confusion.

[HtTKar]

http://www.ska.org/history.shtml

Karate history can be traced back some 1400 years, to Daruma, founder of Zen Buddhism in Western India. Daruma is said to have introduced Buddhism into China, incorporating spiritual and physical teaching methods that were so demanding that many of his disciples would drop in exhaustion. In order to give them greater strength and endurance, he developed a more progressive training system, which he recorded in a book, Ekkin-Kyo, which can be considered the first book on karate of all time.

The physical training, heavily imbued with Daruma's philosophical principles, was taught in the Shaolin Temple in the year 500 A.D. Shaolin (Shorin) kung-fu, from northern China, was characterized by very colorful, rapid, and dynamic movements; the Shokei school of southern China was known for more powerful and sober techniques. These two kinds of styles found their way to Okinawa, and had their influence on Okinawa's own original fighting method, called Okinawa-te (Okinawan hand) or simply te. A ban on weapons in Okinawa for two long periods in its history is also partly responsible for the high degree of development of unarmed fighting techniques on the island.

In summary, karate in Okinawa developed from the synthesis of two fighting techniques. The first one, used by the inhabitants of Okinawa, was very simple but terribly effective and, above all, very close to reality since it was used throughout many centuries in real combat. The second one, much more elaborate and impregnated with philosophical teachings, was a product of the ancient culture of China. These two origins explain the double character of Karate--extremely violent and efficient but at the same time a strict and austere discipline and philosophy with a nonviolent emphasis.

[Oraenor]

All you have given me is what kung fu is and what karate is history wise. Why has the karate offspring differ in the way of kungfu visual wise? to me, karate looks more like TKD than kungfu is which questions all this history.

[Toudiyama[NL]]

All you have given me is what kung fu is and what karate is history wise. Why has the karate offspring differ in the way of kungfu visual wise? to me, karate looks more like TKD than kungfu is which questions all this history.

No it doesn't, TKD has roots in early Shotokan karate
The fact that the kung fu was mixed with uchinadi AKA Okinawa ti ( or te) is what makes it look different from kung fu

Also japanese karate is actually what is so very different, if you look at Okinawa karate, the difference is much less
Japanese karate that has roots in Shotokan ( from Gigo onwards) looks rigid and not very mobile
The introduction of deeper stances, large movements and large classes as well as stupid rules like a form has to start and end at the same spot, is what messed up the art
If you want real karate, you have to look at Okinawa and especially those schools using the Jutsu character instead of the Do

[Oraenor]

No it doesn't, TKD has roots in early Shotokan karate
The fact that the kung fu was mixed with uchinadi AKA Okinawa ti ( or te) is what makes it look different from kung fu

Also japanese karate is actually what is so very different, if you look at Okinawa karate, the difference is much less
Japanese karate that has roots in Shotokan ( from Gigo onwards) looks rigid and not very mobile
The introduction of deeper stances, large movements and large classes as well as stupid rules like a form has to start and end at the same spot, is what messed up the art
If you want real karate, you have to look at Okinawa and especially those schools using the Jutsu character instead of the Do

So is that why karate is so shit because of this gigo old chaps! So now the robotics of TKD and karate has been unveiled to me!
I will check out the jutsu and play spot the difference!

[Toudiyama[NL]]

Any japanes Martial "Art" with Do in the name is actually not a Martial Art but a Martial way
A way of bettering yourself using the Martial techniques

Okinawa Shorin Karate is typified by higher up stances and the lack of high kicks

Oh and to debunk something stated in the thread Husanyan started about the 25 martial arts

Okinawa was never occupied by the Chinese, it was an independent kingdom with cultural ties to china

[HuSanYan]

Oh and to debunk something stated in the thread Husanyan started about the 25 martial arts
Okinawa was never occupied by the Chinese, it was an independent kingdom with cultural ties to china

there seems to be some considerable variance in versons of history, I would be inclined to believe my version over one eminating from a guy in "Little Germany"

[HuSanYan]

http://www.ska.org/history.shtml
Karate history can be traced back some 1400 years, to Daruma, founder of Zen Buddhism in Western India............yap yap yap................yap yap waffle waffle..........................with a nonviolent emphasis.yap

Ht did you read the actual thread title??, you know, the thing thats underlined in the topic list
i am sorry to be the bearer of bad news but having waded through your astounding waffle, *ahem* *uhhh*......you have a bipolar mental disorder

[SteveSeagal]

Any japanes Martial "Art" with Do in the name is actually not a Martial Art but a Martial way
A way of bettering yourself using the Martial techniques

Okinawa Shorin Karate is typified by higher up stances and the lack of high kicks

Oh and to debunk something stated in the thread Husanyan started about the 25 martial arts
Okinawa was never occupied by the Chinese, it was an independent kingdom with cultural ties to china

have you contributed anything helpful or worthwhile for those people who may come to the forum for help with choosing a style of martial art to study??.

I for one appreciate the efforts involved in that thread which i have just been reading through, if I were wondering what style to take up I would be very grateful for that thread.
If all you can do is nitpick why dont you go to a forum with a very young audience?.

[SteveSeagal]

there seems to be some considerable variance in versons of history, I would be inclined to believe my version over one eminating from a guy in "Little Germany"

Ht did you read the actual thread title??, you know, the thing thats underlined in the topic list
i am sorry to be the bearer of bad news but having waded through your astounding waffle, *ahem* *uhhh*......you have a bipolar mental disorder

You got that right HuSanYan!!!, I agree with you, what a couple of petty small minded little men

[SteveSeagal]

There is a distinct difference between kung fu and karate despite the philosophical similarities. Visually I can tell between a kung fu practitioner and a karate one

you don't say!, you must have 20-20 vision pal

[Toudiyama[NL]]

First of this thread isn't about choosing a MA but where the difference between Karate and Kung fu came from
Second, I might be from the Netherlands, but I shure as he know more about karate history than you do Husanyan

It is commonly known that the Ryu kyu islands were seperate kingdoms, and were never occupied by China, the invluence came from the 36 chinese famalies that were stationed there as well as Okinawan nobility traveling to China

Somehow you see it as an attack on yourself, when I correct one little part of your extensive posts

I know there are several stories but none of them involves Okinawa being occupied by the Chinese

StevenSegal, I'm posting in this thread, that has nothing to do with your remarks, let alone your remark about posting in a forum for young people( am probably older than you anyway)

I've 30 years of MA experience, how about you?
Of all the stories about karates history none mentions Okinawa being occupied by the Chinese, If any of you kknow of a Karate site mentioning this, it would be welcome, not even sites about Okinawa in general mention them being occupied by anybody els but the Japanese ( last time the Satsuma clan)

[Garland]

I think I heard some where that karate is a mix with kung fu and tae kwan do and some other style i'm not sure. I don't know if it's true though