Wing Chun Forms

[Hardball]

I learned Sil Lim Tao from my Sifu, while cross training in Wing Chun. I've been able to learn several forms from books and tapes (other systems) but I find the Bil Gee form and Chum Kil forms overwhelming to watch on vid. Has anyone here taught themselves Bil Gee or Chum Kil? What alternative methods do you suggest to learn these forms other than a Paid Sifu?

[Uke]

I learned Sil Lim Tao from my Sifu, while cross training in Wing Chun. I've been able to learn several forms from books and tapes (other systems) but I find the Bil Gee form and Chum Kil forms overwhelming to watch on vid. Has anyone here taught themselves Bil Gee or Chum Kil? What alternative methods do you suggest to learn these forms other than a Paid Sifu?

Well Hardball, its going to be hard because learning from tapes and books is usually for those who have mastered the basis and principle of a technique and are looking for variations. My best suggestion is to pay a Sifu for a private lesson just to get down the mechanics of the technique, the do's and don'ts and other nuances. Once you get the principle, then you'd have a better shot at learning and improving on the form.

If money is definitely an issue, why not try networking on forums like this one. I know that IPON has had some training in wing tsun, but I'm not aware as to whether he knows the bill jee form. But its worth a shot. You both are in NY as well, so that should be even more incentive to ask him. But I still would recommend going to a sifu for at least one private lesson if you can afford it. Or at least attend a seminar where you can ask someone there about the form after the seminar is over. If you're going to using your fingers for thrusting, I'd ask someone who knows how to do it properly. More training accidents happen because guys jump into technique without knowing how to execute it correctly and how to condition for the technique.

Good luck and don't forget to talk to IPON if you haven't already.

[Hardball]

What about Chum Kil? { Finally somebody answered this thread}

[Thai Bri]

Just copy them from a tape and ask a paid hypnotist to convince you that they are worth something. That way you don't have to join the group hypnosis that is a Wing Chun class.

[kuk sool won]

yeh! instead of that you can sit through a 10min thrilling Ram.

[Hardball]

Just copy them from a tape and ask a paid hypnotist to convince you that they are worth something. That way you don't have to join the group hypnosis that is a Wing Chun class.

Ha Ha Ha Ha

[Uke]

Just copy them from a tape and ask a paid hypnotist to convince you that they are worth something. That way you don't have to join the group hypnosis that is a Wing Chun class.

I think a hypnotist would charge 10 times what one private lesson with a sifu would cost. Plus, I've always wondered how you know that they don't have fun with you while you're under? Like subliminally planting a suggestion so that if a certain word is said or a bell is rung you won't bark like a dog or instantly begin doing the robot without even being aware of it.

But as far as chum kil goes, ask IPON or pay for the private lesson, Hardball. If you've already done shil lim tao and gotten the basics down, then you could benefit greatly from just one private session focused on chum kil. But as I said, seek advice from someone proficient in those forms. If you are against asking IPON, I'm sure there are other WC practitioners here who might help you. I just thought the fact that you two were in NY would be convenient.

[Hardball]

Don't believe everything you read on the internet. NYC is a big place plus that's my security cover. Thanks for your help though. I like the idea of a private lesson focused on that one form.

[Sly Dog]

Unlike the forms in many other systems, the Wing Chun forms are simply a list of techniques that form the vocabulary for the system. Wing Chun schools put too much emphasis on the forms based on tradition, and spend much less time teaching the solid application of the techniques listed in the forms. If you are wanting to learn the forms for the fun of it, a DVD and a remote will work great. If you want to know what you're actually doing you have to find a Sifu who will not hold anything back and teach you ALL combat applications of the techniques. Anything else is just the typical Wing Chun School where Chi Sao is the primary activity, and milking money out of students the primary goal.

[Thai Bri]

Funny that. When I slated Wing Chun for not being practical people queued up to tell me that I hadn't invested enough time and energy into the forms, and that they would only reveal their secrets of structural power after years of dedicated study!

[Troll Virus]

Funny that. When I slated Wing Chun for not being practical people queued up to tell me that I hadn't invested enough time and energy into the forms, and that they would only reveal their secrets of structural power after years of dedicated study!

Kinda stale and cynical that.

Just like 90+% of Karate/TKD/kung Fu people talk shit about their MA, the same is true in WC.
It's the good stuff you can discuss, but the crap isn't worth wasting time on.
If you've not had the benefit of good instruction in any art, then at least maintain an open mind until you do eh?

[Sly Dog]

Thai Bri

As I said before, I understand you frustration. I suppose I got lucky and trained under a teacher who felt no need to string people along with the idea that there is some secret knowledge or techniques hidden in Wing Chun.

I guess other WC people would argue this point, they have for decades, but that's what makes the WC community so unlikable. These people have nothing better to do than bad mouth each other in forums and play at Chi Sao.

Find a teacher that will strip away the garbage and teach combat apps.

[Mephariel]

Just copy them from a tape and ask a paid hypnotist to convince you that they are worth something. That way you don't have to join the group hypnosis that is a Wing Chun class.

And this is Thai Bri's what? the 200th time he is on a crusade against Wing Chun? I mean, jeez, we know you didn't like Wing Chun, oK?

[m_calingo]

And this is Thai Bri's what? the 200th time he is on a crusade against Wing Chun? I mean, jeez, we know you didn't like Wing Chun, oK?

Whaaaaat? Deluxe Martial Arts Forums just wouldn't be the same without ol' TB bashing WC or some other MA every other day.

Just wouldn't be the same at all. No sir, not at all...

Kinda reminds me of an dear, departed relative of mine going over the same story again, and again, and again, and again.....

::in an raspy, old man voice::

"(gasp, wheeze) huh...uh... I ever tell you about the time I took Wing Chun...uh...and I didn't like it....uh..huh(gasp, wheeze)....


Well did I....(gasp, wheeze) ??"

[Thai Bri]

Haw haw....

In fairness to me, though, isn't it strange how there are different camps in this one art..... some agree with me on some things, but then disagree with members of their own art on others?

Its a bit of a mess.

Up to now there's only Sly Dog that seems to make an ounce of snse from the WC world. But, then again, if he isn't emphasising his forms then he knows nothing........ ;-)