Forms vs reality?

[Red Rum]

it's a slime chance you would use ur forms in a street fight

How? What forms? You couldn't stand there and do siu nim tao (wing chun), whilst someone is attacking you. If you are talking about using extracts of forms then fair enough, but I would disagree that this is 'using your forms'.

Saying that, Daniel Laruso managed it at the end of Karate Kid 3....
'Best Karate still inside... Now time let out'
'Get the point, get the point...'

[aku aku]

How? What forms? You couldn't stand there and do siu nim tao (wing chun), whilst someone is attacking you. If you are talking about using extracts of forms then fair enough, but I would disagree that this is 'using your forms'.

Saying that, Daniel Laruso managed it at the end of Karate Kid 3....
'Best Karate still inside... Now time let out'
'Get the point, get the point...'

I think it's kind of assumed that you wouldn't stand there and go through your forms when you're attacked, although I heard of one instance where that's exactly what happened.

[aku aku]

You are right in that a martial art is meant to teach people how to perform complex movements. But a fist is not a complex movement. It is as simple as... closing your fist!

If you have new students who can't even do that, they are a hopeless cause.

I've run across several people who just couldn't do what I considered to be the simplest of things but those are the people who need trianing the most. If you break it down for them and they put in the practice time they will progress and improve.

[medic06]

Jonbey, that is nonsense. There are people in this world who just cannot do martial arts. It is not an instructors responsibility to train someone who cannot learn. It takes you away from people who want to be martial artists and work hard

I am not talking about people who struggle to do a complex or difficult move, but a person who can't close a fist? It is not worth training them. Or are you from the 'take their money and let them believe they are doing well' generation

In ancient times, you had to prove that you were worthy to learn martial arts before you could train. Oh how times have changed...

It's not so much that they can't close their fist, it's that they usually have a bad placement of their thumbs.

[jonbey]

ah, that is precisely the point I was making.

Actually, I was watching Beni, my 1 month old son, closing his fist yesterday, and the thumb was always inside the fingers. This seems to be natural in a newborn.

I shall monitor his natural fist development as he grows up. Maybe later it will feel natural to hold the thumb outside, but I think it is most likely this will have to be taught.

[Red Rum]

It's not so much that they can't close their fist, it's that they usually have a bad placement of their thumbs.

I kind of know what you mean (different arts strike differently, use fists differently etc), but it shouldn't take two seconds for a person to correct that.

If a person just can't grasp the concept that a thumb on the inside of the fingers is bad, then they are better off doing a non-sport/martial art related activity.

Aku aku - I would love to know who the attacker was for the form guy. He should be strung up and humiliated for eternity.
The person doing the form during the fight should be exiled from martial arts!

Deluded deluded people. Now I understand why wing chun and kung fu have such bad names

[medic06]

I kind of know what you mean (different arts strike differently, use fists differently etc), but it shouldn't take two seconds for a person to correct that.

If a person just can't grasp the concept that a thumb on the inside of the fingers is bad, then they are better off doing a non-sport/martial art related activity.

Aku aku - I would love to know who the attacker was for the form guy. He should be strung up and humiliated for eternity.
The person doing the form during the fight should be exiled from martial arts!

Deluded deluded people. Now I understand why wing chun and kung fu have such bad names

It's one thing to teach people how to form a correct fist. That's easy. The hard part is breaking that old habit. That takes practice and time. . . .

[stickbowhunter]

I used to question forms myself in my younger years. then i realized they help me get the flow of the style, give me the basics, help build endurance, help with transition of stances, HELP THE MIND AND BODY BECOME ONE. and then it happens, you start to show the flow of your style, you start to generate power the correct way, YOUR MIND AND BODY BECOME ONE. you no longer block then strike then set up to block and strike again..... you block and strike at the same time then you suddenly find yourself with another opportunity to do something else that you really don't think about.... you just do it.

sme