Was it Pekiti-Tirsia, which influenced the knife work of Sayoc kali?

[Golok]

I asked this question in Pekiti-Tirsia Europe forum.

In Sayoc kali site, there is video clip, Where Chris Sayoc assists GT.Gaje. Was Chris Sayoc GT.Gaje's Student and is there any relationship Between Sayoc Kali and Pekiti-tirsia Kali?

GT. Gaje gave this answer.

I will personally reply this so that each one who may know the truth should understand what is the truth:

Chris Sayoc and his father including his brothers and sisters studied with me in New York City at their early stage of younger age where they were in Taekwondo and were at a certain age were blackbelts of Taekwondo. We had the school of pekiti-tirsia in Jamaica, Queens New York. Their foundation was pekiti-tirsia and the time they were under my guidance including his father Bo Sayoc where trained and for the first time they were expose to the art of Kali. We did lots of Demonstraiton in almost several activities in New York city specially the cultural activities. So on record what CRIS IS DOING NOW AND HIS FATHER OR HIS SISTERS OR BROTHERS RELATED TO THE FMA, the roots is Pekiti-Tirsia. Of course they can present another version of techniques in different interpretation but the bottom line is tracing their teachings in terms of flow drill and other mechanics, the root is Pekiti-Tirsia.

In so far as relationship is concern, I don't know how they evaluate their realationship to me, but when Bo Sayoc was in Manila, we talked in the phone in a very friendly manner and there was no animosity. As cultured filipino we don't consider differences in opinions as a mortal treatment but rather it is a sign of good and healthy relationship. But I hope that in all their teachings, the truth must always be the truth and I respect them for that.

I hope I satisfy your questions. To me the SAYOC KALI IS NOT A THREAT TO PEKITI-TIRSIA, they are helping me to promote the Pekiti-Tirsia, they believe that they are a part of the family of what is the kali family, the indigenous art of the Philippines, but if they talk about arnis and escrima that is a different story.

So, there was a thread, where was told that P.T.K. is getting its knife works from Sayoc Kali. When we compare it to highly honoured GT. Gajes answer, it doesn`t look like, that P.T.K. is getting its knife work from Sayoc Kali.
Please no martial politics here, only discussion, because this is not one of those “which is better” threads. In this world there is place for both systems, and their practioners, but I think the history must be clear between them.

There is no such a thing, like superior art or style. There is only individuals who are practising them.

[Airyu]

Hello Golok,

All politics aside, the thread you are referring to was posted by individuals looking to stir up issues(not your original thread but some of the others spawned from it). Tuhon Sayoc was a student of Tuhon Gaje for ~ 3 1/2 years or so, in Pekiti Tirsia Kali. Tuhon Sayoc's father, Bo Sayoc operated a school in New York, which also held Filipino cultural events, in which many other prominent FMA Instructors(ex Master Presas, Professor Vee, Master Marinas etc...)came and helped influence various aspects of the Sayoc family's art, as well as Tuhon Sayocs understanding of the different arts. (please remember that the Sayoc family also has deep roots in the Philippines, refer to the lineage information at Sayoc.com) There was a long thread on the Sayoc Public forum covering this same topic.

Having studied both Pekiti Tirsia Kali, and Sayoc Kali. They are very, very different. Of course some aspects of both arts will seem similar to each other, as both are blade oriented arts. But, upon studying both you will quickly see the various differences in techniques, teaching methodologies, strategies etc.

Train Hard it is the Way!

Guro Steve L.

https://www.Bujinkandojo.net

[Sun_Helmet]

Sayoc Kali

Golok,

There is no anymosity towards PTK, or GT Gaje from Sayoc Kali either. Tuhon Chris Sayoc respects all the elders that he's trained with throughout the Twenty plus years since PTK.
It would be a great disservice to both systems to interpret that they would stay the same these past twenty five years.

Since we're on the topic of credit, we shouldn't leave out the biggest influence on Sayoc Kali... which has been Doce Pares, particularly the elders like GMs Diony Canete and especially Cacoy Canete. They were instrumental in furthering the evolvement of Sayoc Kali.

Another would be Guro Dan Inosanto. His support and encouragement in the growth of Sayoc Kali has been constant, and Tuhon Sayoc respects him highly.

If anyone would like more info on Sayoc Kali:

https://www.sayoc.com

--Rafael--
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[Golok]

Greetings

Greetings !

Thank you! I can see wisdom in your answers. That kind of discussion is very welcome, when we are talking about Different styles and arts, their history and relationship between them. Because I think, that there is no room for discussion like that, which is better style, or whose teacher or Tuhon is faster and stronger, than others.
So, thanks again for your constructive answers.
Because there is individuals, there is also different styles in martial arts. People are having their own view about them, and when there is enough experience the man might create his own style.
Regardless of martial arts or style, everyone is creating his own style to fight, which is fine for him. It is important particularly, when we are alone, and we have to defend ourselves. Especially then, it is very important, that we can use our art, or style as effective instrument of fighting and surviving.
It is Richness, that there is so many martial arts and styles, that everyone can choose one for his/her special needs.

Sincerely yours Golok