Filipino Boxing...

[Spider Web]

Can someone explain to me the difference between Western Boxing and Filipino Boxing? And where I can learn more about Filipino Boxing?

Thank's in advance for any and all reply's...

[sikal]

Can someone explain to me the difference between Western Boxing and Filipino Boxing? And where I can learn more about Filipino Boxing?

Thank's in advance for any and all reply's...

The fundamental difference is that the Filipino boxing is derived from their blade work. This leads to a very different mindset and some different applications. As I understand it, though, even as a sport, Filipino boxing has a lot less restrictions than Western boxing. Elbows, knees and headbutts, for instance, are legal.

When worked on focus mitts, Filipino boxing often looks very similar to Western boxing - though the elbows and knees would obviously indicate something different.

While I can't detail the differences in footwork between Western & Filipino boxing, I've been told by people who are more knowledgable in both than I am that there are differences there, too.

There's also the dumog aspects. Dumog (or Buno or other terms) is Filipino grappling. In Filipino boxing, the Dumog is primarily used to keep your opponent off balance and draw them into oncoming punches. In WC/Jun Fan/JKD terms, the Dumog aspects would include things like the lap sao and jut sao.

There's also a trapping component in the Filipino boxing (uh oh, I said the naughty word - trapping - and will probably stir up all sorts of unrelated comment ... but oh well)

And outside of the sporting version of Filipino boxing, people will add in Sikaran (kicking).

Some of the technical differences between the two would include intentionally not landing your fist on a cross but instead raking their jaw with your forearm or throwing a short hook to draw a response then turn the hook into an elbow and clip them with the elbow. You find these techniques in Western boxing sometimes, too, but they're considered "dirty boxing." They're part and parcel of the Filipino boxing, though.

As far as where to find out more, there are several videos out there that I've personally seen and would recommend:

Tape 4 of the "Definitive Dan Inosanto" series - and possibly tape 5, too, since it looks at some of the Dumog - you can order these at http://inosanto.com

"Panantukan" by Guro Harley Elmore - you can order this at http://warriorswaytx.com

Terms to search for to find info would be panantukan, pangamut, pangamot, kamut-kamut, suntuken and suntukan (I'm sure there are others but these are the most common that I've heard - and pretty much in order from most common to least, at least in America).

Mike

[MAMike]

Another great source for filipino boxing is the Panantukan Series from Sifu Rick Faye. He's Senior Full Instructor under Guro Dan Inosanto and a genius instructor. I'd visited some seminars here in germany and when i ever i had see him i was impressed again and again.

The trapping in Panantukan is also known as bridging or tapi-tapi which also came from stick and knifefighting.


All the best, Mike

[LoneHusky]

Hey that sounds pretty cool I'm seriously considering taking it now.

[bahotae]

Filipino Boxing and Filipino wrestling (Dumog) are all derived from western influences. During the Spanish and American occupation. The only difference is that western boxing and western wrestling is much more advanced.

[haumana2000]

Western influence?

yeah, and I take the ancient korean art of capoeria.

and Indian leg wrestling is actually derived from chinese wushu

and sumo is actually derived from philippine pigmy grappling.

way to really think it through..

[peopleschamp]

yeah, and I take the ancient korean art of capoeria.

and Indian leg wrestling is actually derived from chinese wushu

and sumo is actually derived from philippine pigmy grappling.

way to really think it through..

lol , wow bahotae is an ignorant cuss -

[bahotae]

Mga gago pala kayo! Western Boxing and wrestling has been developed more than the Filipino counterparts. Dumog in rural areas is used to settle land disputes and the techniques they use is not as effective as western or olympic style wrestling. I have met a so called dumog master in PI and I don't think dumog is as effective as BJJ or Western wrestling. Filipino boxing or panantukan, suntokan are all derived from American influences, during the American occupation. Supringsingly you cannot as many Panantukan/suntokan Masters in the Philippines compared to the states. I wonder why?

Also sikaran a so called filipino style kickboxing is also influenced by other Asian martial arts.

Niloloko lg kayo ng mga tao. Ta-tanga tanga lg.
sige ingat lg

[bahotae]

yeah, and I take the ancient korean art of capoeria.

and Indian leg wrestling is actually derived from chinese wushu

and sumo is actually derived from philippine pigmy grappling.

way to really think it through..

Your a freakin moron! Capoiera was derived from african influences. And it is impossible for Native Americans and Chinese to influence each other. There is no such thing as Philippine pygmy grappling.

[peopleschamp]

Your a freakin moron! Capoiera was derived from african influences. And it is impossible for Native Americans and Chinese to influence each other. There is no such thing as Philippine pygmy grappling.

Don't get jokes do you? Maybe that explains why your posts are so stupid .

[bahotae]

Don't get jokes do you? Maybe that explains why your posts are so stupid .

Well your analogy does not make any sense. Or may I say your sarcasm does not make any sense. You don't know anything about Philippine History. You should try to prove your point than make pointless remarks.

Saying that Filipino martial arts have no western influence whatsoever is a total lie.
Why do Arnis techniques have Spanish names then?
And how far does Filipino Martial arts History goes?

Western Boxing was brought to the Philippines during the American occupation by US soldiers. I think we can only trace the so called Suntokan/panatukan/sumbaganay/boksing etc. only to this period. I don't think we will find any literature that was printed during the Spanish occupation that will mention anything about Suntokan/panantukan/sumbaganay/boksing etc.

The Great Filipino hero, Jose Rizal who was also a Martial artist did not mention anything about Panantukan in any of his writings.

Dumog the deadly Filipino Grappling art. How could this art be deadly when the object of this sport is to make the opponents back touch the ground. OH Wait! That sport sounds so familiar. Oh yeah that's how western/olympic style wrestling is played.

But still why is there plenty of Panantukan masters in the states and there is barely any in the Philippines?

Sige ituloy nyo lg ang pangloloko sa inyo.

[haumana2000]

Your a freakin moron! Capoiera was derived from african influences. And it is impossible for Native Americans and Chinese to influence each other. There is no such thing as Philippine pygmy grappling.

bahotae brother, thats my point exactly! and actually have you ever heard of the wrestling styles of the mangyans? From your posts You seem to know soo much about everyone elses history, unfortunately like many other pinoys I know, you latch on to theirs instead of knowing your own.

[haumana2000]

Look bahotae, We all know Panuntukan as a term isn't used in the PI much and is a term associated with American Filipino artists. who cares about the term, in fact the title of the initial post was Filipino Boxing period. But you seem to choose to discredit your peoples abilities and give all credit to those outside your own, unfortunately that in itself is a byproduct of colinalization and the original divide and conquer tactics of the spaniards a.. dependency on the master if you will. i.e "Well I wouldnt have all that I do if it weren't for master" But boxing as an empty hand practice goes back waay further than any american occupation. Are you telling me that Olympic wrestlingwhich has it's roots in greece is directly responsible for all styles of Native philippine wrestling? You put too much emphasis on names. i.e dumog because of the early stigmas associated with the term. But THERE IS dumog, in the Philippines, as well as Buno, as well as Boltong, as well as others. Whether or not it is as organized in a sporting environment was never the question, you stated that they all have their roots in western styles. Plus you base all of your information on one meeting with a so called Dumog master? with 7100 islands in the PI. thats a pretty small survey area for fact finding information. Why don't you tell Mumbakki or the brothers at the submission dungeon in the Philippines, there is no dumog, they will laugh, and the thing is they do catch wrestling too, and still acknowledge the legitimacy of our native arts, And Yes Rizal was a powerful leader and influential man along with a hero to us, but the fact that he didnt use the term panuntukan means nothing. We should be empowering our people through research and the propagation and perservation of our national history, performing arts, and culture, instead of acting like the ninja craze of the 80's sho kusogi comes out with a flick, and all of our brothers went out and took karate and ninjitsu. All of our young people all wanna be jay z, because it's en vogue, and our kids dont wanna learn the language.
Good job pal.

[peopleschamp]

To continue along, with the previous to posts (to let you know I'm not filipino, I'm Indian) and I'm actually pissed that someone would discredit their own native arts and be so blatantly mistaken. Don't get bogged down in labels (giving a spanish name doesn't mean that the move was taught by the spanish (that only shows that the spanish colonizers had a linguistic influence - its just a name, the shovel punch wasn't taught by an alien species with wooden bodies and wide, flattish metal faces - despite what you may have come to believe), throwing a fist wasn't a concept invented in the west, east, or anywhere specific. It's just another natural weapon that we as an intelligent species have over time perfected to defend and prolong our species. The Phillipines, over time, was influenced (and vice versa) as much by the west, as china, india, indonesia, thailand, etc (think of it as a trade in martial arts). In other respects though, arts were highly guarded and advanced less from outside influences as they did inside innovations. The eastern arts (if you have to label them) are highly sophisticated. There are indegiounous styles of wrestling in India, all have slight differences and they too end when someone is pinned on their back (what do you expect - someone be pinned on their head, neck, ass, etc), but no one is stupid enough to say they learned these styles after British conquest - yes, we can offer good historical records to disprove such claims, but even without those we know the oral histories of culture. Records are just records and even those can be false (they're written by humans afterall), and there is no one who kept a scientific account of the degree of influence that any colonizing powers had on native fighting arts so why do you believe so adamantly and without proof of your own that the west (your basically saying this) gave the phillipines boxing and wrestling (it can also be posited that the foreigners were influenced by the filipinos and took back their arts to incorporate into their personal fighting style). Similiarities could just as easily be accounted by the body mechanics of a species with two legs, arms, eyes, and oppossable thumbs, etc.

[gago420]

Ali and "Flash" Elorde

I knew it!... we got Kuya baho-tae here! HAHAHAHAHAH!!

Welcome pare, I thought I smelled you in here.

Do you think Ali's friendship with Filipino boxing champ Gabriel "Flash" Elorde have anything to do with his boxing style? I was wondering about that while I was scanning through these posts amidst the odor in here.....

Kuya, you need to lay off the balut, pare' hahahaha