Jkd/kali

[thekuntawman]

one of my students yesterday showed me 2 videos of this style, done by a grandmaster, and a master.

now i am convinced this art has no effectiveness, especially the way that it is being taught. i would welcome anyone who is willing to prove me wrong.

[McDojoJKD]

Yeah the videos and seminars and "certifications" is why I quit all commercial schools and went to garage training. I saw some tape where some JKD famous guy said " I will kick from MuaY THAI, TRAP WITH WING CHUN, BOB AND WEAVE FFOM BOXING AND THEN I CAN DO EITHER A KALI SWEEP, JUDO SWEEP, SILAT THROW AND THEN SUBMIT HIM WITH A BJJ SUBMISSION...."
Just absolutely ridiculous, what happened to the straight blast economy of motion simple techniques of JKD. I mean its all about money ,seminars and selling nice t-shirts. I mean you have so many martial arts its just ridiculous and to think that some teacher is a bjj blackbelt, muay thai teacher, Escrima, Bando, karate blackbelt all rolled into one just does not even make sense.
I wish we would just drop the JKD name and just call it training.

[thekuntawman]

you must a saw the same video i saw!

it was a joke, i'm so embarassed for this, because i did not know it was that bad. i really was blaming the students of the style, when i see it came from the top. what is sad, is i know many of the source of the FMA they do, and its nothing like that (what the kali/jkd do).

this is the reason people do not respect the FMA. now we have people hiding behind bjj, like it will make a difference.

[danjuandesiga]

I'm not sure if this video proves anything. After all, it is from an individual who is certified under an instructor that is directly certified through Guro Dan Inosanto and with no direct certification or recognition from Guro Dan himself.
Since the topic is JKC/Kali, here is one example.

Kali Combatives video

[thekuntawman]

this is not the same thing that was on the video.

the techniques i saw on that video cant be done in sparring, and it was not shown through sparring either. we all know the difference between demonstration technique and fighting technique. what i saw, is a whole hour of demonstration technique. the entire hour was a bunch of eskrima (excuse me, kali) techniques that do not work. he is talking about, well in the philippines, filipino boxers do this and filipino boxers do that. he showd the difference between a muay thai round kick, and a "kali round kick", a muay thai elbow, a silat elbow and a kali elbow. a whole lot of bullsh!t. plus the techniques had the same one-step/kenpo style looks to it. not FMA, just some techniques he was calling "filipino". and please dont get me started on the tagalog!

[thekuntawman]

and you do not prove your value as a fighter by saying who you study with. means nothing.

bruce lee build his reputation from what he can do. we do not praise bruce lee because he is certified from yip man.

it is a very western idea, to hide behind who you study with, and what certifications you have for your resume. if you look at the masters of FMA, none of them have certificates. if you want to see what they are worth, you look at their skill. when someone throwing around his resume, i dont even have to ask if he can fight or not.

it is also a western idea to learn new arts to make yourself "unbeatable". some people think, all i need is muay thai for stand up, eskrima for weapons, and bjj for the ground and i am well-rounded (western martial artists dont like to say "you cant whip me" cause they will have to prove it, so they say they are well rounded), in other words, no one can beat me. people are afraid to be confident. they rather be confident around friends and in their minds, so thats why the video tape course of martial arts, and seminars, are so popular. and why people dont go to tournaments. see in the tournament you find out where you stand, and most people dont want to know. they rather make videos, teach seminars and tell you who they studied with (or what they studied). this is not FILIPINO martial arts. a western martial artist will look at unfamiliar technique, and think, i gotta learn that. a filipino will look at it, and say, that shit not going to work on me. and if it does, it just means more training. so, if i beat a guy with my technique, whats he going to think, i need to learn kuntaw now? this is how a beginner thinks. see, if you want to be unbeatable, you will have to train harder, and be better at your art, than he is at his. dont matter what kind of things he knows. what i saw on the tape was a guy who sucks at muay thai (he never been in a ring, you can tell), a weak boxer (doesnt even deserve to be called boxing), sucks at eskrima (no matter what he tries to call it), sucks at silat (he is doing ba gua and xing yi, i know those techniques). lets not even talk about the wing chun. jack of all trades? no, he's a joke of all trades. he is just good at demonstrating what each art is like.

all of that, and they want to call it FILIPINO martial arts. dont blame that junk on the filipino. if you want to learn how to fight, call me.

[thekuntawman]

filipino martial arts is the best style of fighting. theres a lot of good arts out there, every country has best fighters, but the filipino style is the best for plain old fighting.

i wish more people believe that, and stop mixing the art, like it needs help or something.

if you believe your art is the best, the next step is to train to make yourself the best fighter. if you cant fight, then adding silat or wing chun is not going to make you better.

[McDojoJKD]

And right now the greatest craze is bjj, until bjj players starting getting knocked out, now its a MMA school on every corner Muay Thai and BJJ its amazing how many BB's in BJJ have popped up all over the place. I have even seen stick grappling tapes LOL!!! JKD dudes have to reinvent themselves in order to stay competitive. what happened to just plain ole knockout blows.

[Garland]

one of my students yesterday showed me 2 videos of this style, done by a grandmaster, and a master.

now i am convinced this art has no effectiveness, especially the way that it is being taught. i would welcome anyone who is willing to prove me wrong.

let's have a look see, shall we?

[William]

Bottom line:

It doesn't matter how many systems you claim to know.

It doesn't matter who you claim to have trained with.

It doesn't matter how many seminars you've been to.

It doesn't matter how many pieces of paper you got at those seminars.

It doesn't matter if you have a belt to hold up your pants.

It doesn't matter how many students you have.


What matters is that you can back it up and use it in real time against real people who want to take your head off. Walk the walk as they say. The rest is just fluff.




William

[McDojoJKD]

Teach Brother!

[jeff5]

it is also a western idea to learn new arts to make yourself "unbeatable". some people think

Actually cross training and learning from different teachers and styles is as old as the martial arts itself. Its only relatively recently (say the last 70 years or so), where someone would only study one style.

[Black Grass]

one of my students yesterday showed me 2 videos of this style, done by a grandmaster, and a master.

now i am convinced this art has no effectiveness, especially the way that it is being taught. i would welcome anyone who is willing to prove me wrong.

Since they don't use titles (GM or master) like this in JKD/Kali who and what video are you taking about. Dan Inosanto ? JKD Definitive collection ?

What can you give an example of a technique.?

And if you say that Filipino Martial Arts is best for plain old fighting and that you need to prove it in the ring, then why no FMA in the UFC or Pride ? There is one pinoy in the UFC Brandon Vera and he is BJJ.

Just my thoughts.
Vince
aka Black Grass

[roz]

Kuntawman, how many different tribes are in the Phillipines? how many different languages? The Fillipino people who came to the U.S.A. brought the term Kali with them. Did they not?

i do agree that the American boxers did learn ALOT from Fillipino boxers, ie., the low hands down, then the high hands up, this formula came from when the typical knife stance was stationed low, then it got transversed to hands up. this history could be seen from early boxer pictures. Ali was even known to look up to a Fillipino boxer,-can not remember his name.

furthermore Kuntawman why so much anger? if we are wrong and you are right then so what. if you can not stand the way the american people do things, then why interact? also please enlighten on where Dumog, and Kino Mua Thai came from,- not everyone is a liar-.

3 Salutes

[thekuntawman]

Since they don't use titles (GM or master) like this in JKD/Kali who and what video are you taking about. Dan Inosanto ? JKD Definitive collection ?

What can you give an example of a technique.?

And if you say that Filipino Martial Arts is best for plain old fighting and that you need to prove it in the ring, then why no FMA in the UFC or Pride ? There is one pinoy in the UFC Brandon Vera and he is BJJ.

Just my thoughts.
Vince
aka Black Grass

1. since you asked, the two people are dan inosanto (on a tape with him and a female blond) and ron balicki. i dont know the names of the tapes. and let me say this, mr. inosanto is a childhood hero of mine. but those techniques and drills on that video, crap. i dont admire any man so much i will hold my tongue if i disagree with something.

2. example of a technique? the defenses against the jab cross. anybody who is a fighter will know those techniques dont work against somebody who is really punching at you.

3. there has been another filipino fighter in the UFC, his name is onassis parungao. he is not a mix martial arts fighter, and he won his fight. he is a hung gar. but not seeing something on TV does not mean everything else is no good. but then again, that is a beginner's way of thinking. we never saw a real boxer in the UFC does that mean boxers cant fight? so a filipino fighter was a bjj, so what? we are not talking about bjj, we are talking about jkd/kali. filipino style fighters fight all over the place. some people will not study with a teacher unless he read about him somewhere in the magazine or he sells videos. skill is something you can tell right away, one on one. dont believe me? go to mike tyson and tell him he cant fight because he lost his last 3 fights. tell him he needs wing chun, bjj and muay thai to be a complete fighter. tell him he is a puss because he backed out of k-1. if he opened a gym i wonder if people will not train with him because he is not "complete" blah blah blah. remember when every karate school had a "ninja" program because its so popular? well at least where i was living (washington dc) they are all jkd or bjj now.

next year they will be hawaii bone breaking experts.