how to build a fighter

[thekuntawman]

i just post this on the other forum, i will post it here,i just posted on some other forum a couple days before, but they close the topic after two days. i was not finish, so i want to bring it here. original one, is that there is a young guys who already has martial arts experience, but not in the knife or stick weapons. he wants to know where can he get some training to learn to defend himself with the weapons.
everybody says this video or book or seminars, but no one has said, go to a teacher. now, i am sure these guys went to a teacher before, but they are now selling tapes and seminars, so they want to promote that (and that is bull****). i believe it is irresponsible and unfair to tell a beginner such a thing like:
>I have to seriously question anyone who would even put forth the idea anymore that a Student has to be "wedded" to an Instructor for their continued growth.
Driving is a skill, when you get your License, you don't go to Easy-Method Driving School once a week for a brush up. Oh, you might get sent to some course by a Judge for being a repeated moron in traffic, but that is that.

If you want to be a Police Officer, you get In-Service training every 6 to 12 months, with refreshers and re-qualifications, in shooting, baton, chemical weapons, procedure and driving.

You do not have the Training Officer or Hand to Hand Instructor, or the Academy Pursuit Driving Instructor in the seat next to you after that.

You are on your own
(end)

now i agree that you have to go on your own to get experience. but after only what you learn in a seminars? a couple of "few good techniques"? no way man! even the driver has to learn behind the wheel before you send him out to drive on his own, or he might learn the hard way and die!

so what do you guys think, can a beginner be encourage to learn a few good moves and train on his own, then fight a street fighter?

[Kevin]

Training

Hi,

The best way to improve your ability to defend yourself is to follow a good solid training progression. Ideally this would include having the supervision of one or more knowledgable individuals to avoid possible pitfalls. In my experience, the problem with videos and seminars are most people don't really incorporate alot of the seminar/video material in their everyday training. And if they do, there is the danger of their just throwing a mish-mosh of techniques together haphazardly.

Of course it's possible to get good info from seminars and tapes.... sit down and organize a training progression... follow that progression, and learn from your own mistakes. After all... some of our forefathers in the martial arts MUST have done their training without the help of an instructor. But... it's probably not the best way. Afterall... "We stand on the shoulders of those who went before us."

Just my opinion...
~Kev

[Chop Wisby]

hey kuntawman!

yeah, i just saw that they shut down that thread on the other forum . . .

i enjoy reading your posts; keep it up!

you are blunt but not insulting, imho.

Chop Wisby

[thekuntawman]

thank you chop wisby.

i think maybe i was putting up a mirror to some people there, and there is other people who can see there reflection to, and thats the problem. i dont blame them.

i didnt care except to make sure this guys does not get bad advice.

[Chad W. Getz]

Hey Kuntawman,

So what if one can not find good schools around, because face it, there aren't alot. By good, I mean ones that will take you progressively into the fighting as you speak.

BTW, could you e-mail me this forum, I don't think I've ever been to that one. chad@fullcontacthi.com . Thanks.

What we've been doing here in Hawaii, because of the lack of schools that will work you progressively with everything, weapons, empty hand, etc., etc., we have a TRAINING/DISCUSSION Group that currently meets twice a week. Most guys have MA skills, and it ranges from Aikido and Kickboxing with no sparring to Grappling and boxing with sparring/stick work-no sparring to no experience. The goal here is for everyone to be able to work with each other, some days one guy will teach the "class", and anotehr day, maybe another guy will "teach". Some days, it's just sparring, some days. it's just practice.

[thekuntawman]

chad, if a person have to train himself, then your method is the way to do it. my problem is the "kids' approach". they read books, buy videos, maybe the will try it themself, but mostly remember the technique from looking at it so much, then say they know it. maybe they might work out sometimes or show it to there friends.

but i believe most martial artist who "do it on there own" are doing this, they are not sparring to see if it works, they just enjoy learning something new and saying "this is deadly, man!" especially these "blade expert" who have never been to a real knife fight themself, they are collectors of techniques and cute disarmings and "drills", but when you ask them about sparring they say "i only fight for real/to the death/"or some other excuse not to fight. they hide behind there knife as some reason not to learn to fight, and they talk about "laws" as if they would even have the balls to use it on a man. like they even carry their knife everywhere, which i was taught is cowardly.

but i know about you and your guys, and who can argue that this is the best way to train? there are people who have teachers, good teachers, and never fight? they are missing something important, and they are too collectors of techniques.

[Chad W. Getz]

One of the reasons we started up Full Contact Stickfighting Hawaii (soon to be Full Contact Hawaii-stay tuned folks!!!) was because of this. I myself am guilty of taking videos and learning and trying them, yet not testing it. Alot of the guys I trained with said wows and were impressed. New guys I trained with were so impressed with the moves, the techniques, I started to develop things myself that was "effective" because it worked very good against someone dummying for me. I tell you, the best choice that I ever made was to walk out there with someone and really go at it. No matter what anyone says, I am a better fighter today than I was before I started fighting. The goal was not to be a good fighter, but to BECOME a good fighter. The application of the "techniqe" and not the perfection of it. The perfection will come with the application. It is easy to open a school or do videos with all the techniques I can show or do and make money with it. But one night talking with James, I told him I don't know if we should do any tapes, because realistically, what I personally believe is that I can produce one tape that should be able to explain to someone what I believe would make someone a good fighter. I wouldn't have to repeat it and drag it out, because that is what the rewind button is for. After that, it is up to the student to practice and more importantly work on DOing it. Of course, someone with, or a group with someone, who has an analytical mind and the mindset to test it will advance faster than someone who may be stuck with a different mindset, but the whole way I see to make it work, is one similar to that of Paul Vunak. Hard progressive training. Analytical understanding of principles and concepts. And hard progressive training. For my self, I have identified categories of tools. Recognizes what is used where. Set up an outline of importance, rather than a curriculum, and accepted it for myself. I guarentee it will change, but today, this will help me to get better.

[Kevin]

Training

Hi Chad,

You wrote...
>>One of the reasons we started up Full Contact Stickfighting Hawaii (soon to be Full Contact Hawaii...<<

Just curious... how much empty hand training/sparring to you guys do? If it is somewhat balanced between MT hand & stick ... is that why your dropping the "Stickfighting" from the name?

Take care...
~Kev

[Chad W. Getz]

Well, we've always 'practiced' empty hands and weapons. And we've been known for our 'stick' fighting. I stand with strong belief behind myself and the men that stickfight with us. Especially the new guys. They are constantly pushed with the pressure of lightening up the gear and hitting hard, and they deal with it very well, IMO. One day I realized that I didn't want to be a bad ass at only the stick game, only to have the empty hand game be something else. So we empty hand spar hard now. Same rules: kicks, elbows, punching, knees, throws, groundfighting, clinching, and be friends at the end of the day. It's funny, I know my stickfighting game helped me alot with the empty hands, but I am now seeing my empty hand game help my stickwork as well. Not in any one specific area, but just in reaction and movement over all. One of the changes to the web site will be due to the fact that I am seriously paying alot of attention to my Vale Tudo game. All in all, what's in a name, the Phillipine Fighting Arts are my base, my mind will work out the principles, I will be using some areas of MT(unofficially-I don't train MT specifically), boxing(James is the shining star here), straight blast(a la Paul Vunak-via tapes, I've never met him), clinch(mixture of MT(remember unofficially) and other things I've seen done in fights, and groundfighting, of course using BJJ as a base, mixing with a few other things. All in all, everything will be influenced by the FMA as I percieve it. I am seeing good things. Lots of isolated punching, kicking, clinching(with and without punches-with and without kicks/knees-with and without takedowns)groundfighting. When I talk about all thes MA, I am not claiming them, but I am giving them credit, for example MT has utilized the principles and concepts of the kicking game to the fullest, and I will be using FMA principles along similar lines of that for that particular game, and the same goes for others. I do not box, for example, but I will take my game to the boxing ring, to test myself, so to speak. FMA has it's own grappling, but the people who have been using it to "fight" are the BJJ guys, so I will use principles of that. In a nutshell, everything will be developed though my base knowledge as it is with isolated progressive sparring, analyzing, testing, and full sparring. I have the beginning pages that will explain this more in detail, and I don't want to say too much here, because it already doesn't sound exactly how I want it. Just hang in, I will be taking care of some business and we'll have everything set soon. Watch for the changes. BTW, to answer your question specifically:

>Just curious... how much empty hand training/sparring to you guys do? If it is somewhat balanced >between MT hand & stick ... is that why your dropping the "Stickfighting" from the name?

Answer: Yes. But I don't see it necessarily as "dropping stickfighting from our name", but as leaving a blank space after the "Full Contact". Hawaii stays, because that is where we live.

Thanks for asking, Kev.

[Edited by Chad W. Getz on 11-23-2000 at 03:19 PM]

[James Walker]

WOW

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chad W. Getz I tell you, the best choice that I ever made was to walk out there with someone and really go at it. No matter what anyone says, I am a better fighter today than I was before I started fighting.

WOW Chad!!! Alot has been said on your post that is so true to me no matter what anyone says. I strongly feel the same as you do. I myself beleive without a doubt if it weren't for the commitment to the contact fighting/sparring, I would still be stagnant in my trainning. I feel that there has to be some type of progression in any trainning that one does or it would just be called spinning your wheels(for the lack of better terms).

The goal was not to be a good fighter, but to BECOME a good fighter. The application of the "techniqe" and not the perfection of it. The perfection will come with the application.

WOW Chad, you couldn't have said it any better. And you know whats so funny, is that I hear this from you everyday. Maybe thats why I believe it so much.(Joke!) Though I think if I didn't fight with you guys, my thoughts would be different. I would still be doing aimless drills in my sleep walk. But, trainning the FMA for over ten years does show in my stickfighting. It has made me comfortable with my sticks or weapons aspect of my personal mobility on what I can or cannot do. Though I would like to finish by saying that fullcontact stickfighting with minimal gear would open the eyes of anyone who wishes to further their progression in trainning, because it has done just that for me.


Of course, someone with, or a group with someone, who has an analytical mind and the mindset to test it will advance faster than someone who may be stuck with a different mindset, but the whole way I see to make it work, is one similar to that of Paul Vunak. Hard progressive training.

Enough said Chad, I couldn't have said it any better.

Thanks Again,

[Edited by james walker on 11-25-2000 at 04:36 AM]