Karate ain't so bad

[darrianation]

You already know that those what you see in Karate and Tae Kwon Do is not the same as those of KungFu......

Forms of KungFu is very important and applicable to streetfighting while Forms of TaeKwonDo and Karate are not applicable to streetfighting......

the reason why MuayThai will beat Karate and TaeKwonDo
but MuayThai cant beat KungFu

keep telling yourself that!

[darrianation]

the year 1993, in our small kungfu club....

there you could see....

Chit Chiee Tong Long Kun KungFu versus AngKa KungFu....

NgoChoKun KungFu versus ChiDianBun KungFu.....

TaiChiaeKun (TaiChi) versus HapKunTo KungFu.....

ChiDianBun KungFu versus Southern TongLongKun KungFu.....

ChiDianBun KungFu versus my instructor's Hing-E (Hsing-I Chuan).....

TaiChiaeKun (TaiChi) versus my instructor's Southern Eagle Claw KungFu.....

etc.... etc.... etc.....

Note:
there we (the students) know the advantages/disadvantages of every kungfu style/systems, their deadly moves as well as their weakness......

it is very exciting to spar kungfu style versus other kungfu style

and during our hard sparring sessions..... the Tae Kwon Do Club and Karate Club found near our KungFu Club area - their students are always watch our sparring........ we usually closed our windows and doors in order for them not to see the way KungFu fights........

cause when they see the way we fights..... they will get it and claimed it them......

Karate Club and Tae Kwon Do Club near our KungFu Club - we assure that they cannot witness the way we fight..... but sometimes they see some of our KungFu Forms....... they are cheating sometimes on us secretly.....

thanks .... cause they know nothing about our kungfu art, what they know about kungfu is only thru movies that they see..... and they judge as kungfu is weak and lousy hahahahahahahahahahaha.....

Yea they may learn your secret chi dog tricks and begin levatating.

[sherwinc]

I could show you my most advanced form and still you wouldn't know much, why?, we only use the onkinawan form of which most have chinese roots but the style is made up of Okinawan karate and an atamibased ju jitsu style shinto yoshin ryu ( has links to Aikijitsu)
Because the founder didn't make his own forms, you won't see anything of it in the forms, none of the grapling and stuff like that
Karate style is of the Shurite lineage with only 9 forms 5 of which are Pinan Kata the others Naihanchi, Kushanku(kokuson), Seishan and Chinto
We do have more but the founder only deemd the 9 important
Appart from that, knowing my techniques is not the same as knowing my tactics is it

if i see your most highest/advanced Karate Forms, i will be able to know something about you, clues:

1. I will know how you walk your art, whether your movement is solid, pretending, back to where you begin, power in every execution.....

2. I will know if your feet/legs have foundation as well as your fists, solid movements....

3. I will know if you are in short/long distance fighting, stillness or moving from one stance to another, using frequently/mostly of straight/angles/semi-circles/circles.....

4. I will know if you are Karate, Tae Kwon Do, KungFu, especially in KungFu if what art of KungFu you are.....

example:
if your Kun is a Southern Mantis KungFu..... then i have a clue that to fight that art, it is recommended to attack mostly the legs of the Southern Mantis KungFu because the Hand Combinations of Southern Mantis is very hard to intercept while its Feet is useless.......

If you do Northern Praying Mantis KungFu...... then i have a clue that you have a very awesome kicking combinations..... while your hands are weak.....

but if you do Seven Star Praying Mantis KungFu.... then you are into grabbing movements frequently....... so i may know what kind of strategy i will use in order to defeat that art.......

If you do Plum Flower Fist KungFu...... then i am in trouble, why???? cause i am not familiar with that art???????

If you do WingChun KungFu.... then i will be very very careful cause ChiDianBun is in Jeopardy.......

But if you do Karate...... Haw haw haw haw

hope you understand what i mean, thou i have a clue but its a 50%, the remaining 50% is the one i'm afraid for......

[Toudiyama[NL]]

if i see your most highest/advanced Karate Forms, i will be able to know something about you, clues:

1. I will know how you walk your art, whether your movement is solid, pretending, back to where you begin, power in every execution.....

2. I will know if your feet/legs have foundation as well as your fists, solid movements....

3. I will know if you are in short/long distance fighting, stillness or moving from one stance to another, using frequently/mostly of straight/angles/semi-circles/circles.....

I can tell that from almost any form you do
BTW our forms don't give an impression of how we (Wado Karateka) would fight, where the forms are the same rigid stuff most Karatestyles do, the fighting is fast, moving in and out, angling and relaxation until the last moment before contact

4. I will know if you are Karate, Tae Kwon Do, KungFu, especially in KungFu if what art of KungFu you are.....

example:
if your Kun is a Southern Mantis KungFu..... then i have a clue that to fight that art, it is recommended to attack mostly the legs of the Southern Mantis KungFu because the Hand Combinations of Southern Mantis is very hard to intercept while its Feet is useless.......

If you do Northern Praying Mantis KungFu...... then i have a clue that you have a very awesome kicking combinations..... while your hands are weak.....

but if you do Seven Star Praying Mantis KungFu.... then you are into grabbing movements frequently....... so i may know what kind of strategy i will use in order to defeat that art.......

If you do Plum Flower Fist KungFu...... then i am in trouble, why???? cause i am not familiar with that art???????

If you do WingChun KungFu.... then i will be very very careful cause ChiDianBun is in Jeopardy.......

But if you do Karate...... Haw haw haw haw

hope you understand what i mean, thou i have a clue but its a 50%, the remaining 50% is the one i'm afraid for......

But Karate isn't a style, would you be able to see the difference between the different styles of Karate and thus know what to expect from them, could you see the difference between the form of a Goju karateka and a Kyokushin Karateka? I can assure you they resemble very close but the fighting doesn't
Like I said Wado also has a jujitsu base and this is not visible in the forms
Some styles just do forms for the sake of tradition but change about everything else

Now for sparring, I could spar with you and within 10-15 seconds I would have a reasonable impression of your skils ( they joy of an analitical brain)

It's niice that you can see what style someone does by lookking at his formss but that doesn't take any crosstraining into account

[sherwinc]

But Karate isn't a style, would you be able to see the difference between the different styles of Karate and thus know what to expect from them, could you see the difference between the form of a Goju karateka and a Kyokushin Karateka? I can assure you they resemble very close but the fighting doesn't
Like I said Wado also has a jujitsu base and this is not visible in the forms
Some styles just do forms for the sake of tradition but change about everything else

in KungFu, there is a big difference in every style of KungFu,

but in Karate the forms of every branches of Karate are looked like the same, very close, but the fighting doesn't...... i think i got your point....

[Toudiyama[NL]]

Sherwinc one question:

which KF style has forms with 13, 24 or 54 in the names ( in Okinawan Seis(h)an, Niseishi, and Useishi)

Ngo cho kun ( Wu zi quan) is the ancestor of Nahate( goju) Karate

I like to know which is the ancestor of Shurite ( shorin) Karate

[sherwinc]

Sherwinc one question:

which KF style has forms with 13, 24 or 54 in the names ( in Okinawan Seis(h)an, Niseishi, and Useishi)

Ngo cho kun ( Wu zi quan) is the ancestor of Nahate( goju) Karate

I like to know which is the ancestor of Shurite ( shorin) Karate

I sorry, i am not familiar with it, thou i know Chinese KungFu numeroulogy is 1, 3, 5, 7, 8, 12, 36, 72, 108.......

example:
5 elements of nature
5 fists of NgoChoKun
5 Shaolin Animals Fist
12 animal forms
36 death cavities
36 forms of Chen Style Tai Chi
72 numbness vital points
108 wooden dummy techniques
7 stars as in 7 fruits found in the human primary targets
8 Drunken Immortal gods
8 Butterfly Knives Slashes of WingChun

[Nit]

My god this thread is like a long lost child to me, how long has everyone been discussing this point?

I've been away for a while... cross training and modifying my perceptions.

Without wishing to sound too disrespectful there are a lot of people here that spend a lot of time talking their point when they could be training.

<contradiction>

The way I currently see it is this, if you want to learn to defend yourself quickly and effectively there are many 'scrappy' arts / techniques which work effectively from the get go.

The way karate (and all other arts) have been taught to me has been inadequet of the end result (having a fight and saving your skin).

However I have had the luck to have the advise of many and the teachings of old friend of Mr Thompson, and this has helped me to improve a lot, and to actually make a lot of the bullshit that I learned workable (and I mean really workable, not a stand and punch in the air by numbers workable).

It's taken me a long time to develop to this state and I'm very aware that I could have taken faster routes to learn how to fight.

But thats the key, I don't want to learn how to fight, I want to learn how not to fight (intentionally left ambiguous).

</contradiction>

[darrianation]

My god this thread is like a long lost child to me, how long has everyone been discussing this point?

I've been away for a while... cross training and modifying my perceptions.

Without wishing to sound too disrespectful there are a lot of people here that spend a lot of time talking their point when they could be training.

<contradiction>

The way I currently see it is this, if you want to learn to defend yourself quickly and effectively there are many 'scrappy' arts / techniques which work effectively from the get go.

The way karate (and all other arts) have been taught to me has been inadequet of the end result (having a fight and saving your skin).

However I have had the luck to have the advise of many and the teachings of old friend of Mr Thompson, and this has helped me to improve a lot, and to actually make a lot of the bullshit that I learned workable (and I mean really workable, not a stand and punch in the air by numbers workable).

It's taken me a long time to develop to this state and I'm very aware that I could have taken faster routes to learn how to fight.

But thats the key, I don't want to learn how to fight, I want to learn how not to fight (intentionally left ambiguous).

</contradiction>

Nit, we will turn them from the dark side yet!

[konghan]

This one is for those people who think traditional styles won't hold up against modern MMA practitioners.....

K-1 fighters lost the event 7-0 against Kyokushin practitioners....... this link really speaks for itself

http://ko.sherdog.com/pictures/k1_053004/k1_01.htm

As per Nebula

[brokenelbow]

Kyokushin doesn't count.

[konghan]

Kyokushin doesn't count.

uhm? new thread rules?

[Toudiyama[NL]]

Kyokushin doesn't count.

they do Kata don't they? they do basics like others do them don't they? they have pre-arranged fighting too
the only difference is the contactsparring

So please explain to us how it doesn't count

[sherwinc]

Formula:
KungFu beats Karate

Problem:
Kyukushin type of Karate beats K-1
(in a ratio of 7:0)

Question:
What if KungFu fights K-1??????

Solution:
If Karate beats K1, then KungFu will pulvorized K1

Result:
Correct!!!!!!!!!

[brokenelbow]

So please explain to us how it doesn't count

It just doesn't.