Miyama Ryu Jujutsu and San Soo Kung Fu ....

[Shaolin Bushido]

.... are two styles of martial arts that are pure self-defense in America. They were introduced or crafted by Jimmy Woo, in the case of San Soo and Antonio Pereira, a New Yorker of Puerto Rican descent who got interested in self-defense as a youngster entering the armed forces during WWII. Jimmy's techniques are reportedly a distillation of self-defense techniques mainly from Choy Lay Fut but including other techniques common to other styles. He was a good fighter and passed on not only his techniques but mentality concerning fighting against an aggressor.

Professor Pereira continued to piece together techniques such as the WWII combatives he was introduced to as well as urban know-how and savvy before finally going to Japan and becoming more classically trained in Aikido, Jujutsu and Judo which he then integrated into his style which has continued to evolve til this day.

What're you guys impressions of the arts, their effectiveness and relevance as far as self-defense?

[ddrive]

My Opinion on San Shou

.... are two styles of martial arts that are pure self-defense in America. They were introduced or crafted by Jimmy Woo, in the case of San Soo and Antonio Pereira, a New Yorker of Puerto Rican descent who got interested in self-defense as a youngster entering the armed forces during WWII. Jimmy's techniques are reportedly a distillation of self-defense techniques mainly from Choy Lay Fut but including other techniques common to other styles. He was a good fighter and passed on not only his techniques but mentality concerning fighting against an aggressor.

Professor Pereira continued to piece together techniques such as the WWII combatives he was introduced to as well as urban know-how and savvy before finally going to Japan and becoming more classically trained in Aikido, Jujutsu and Judo which he then integrated into his style which has continued to evolve til this day.

What're you guys impressions of the arts, their effectiveness and relevance as far as self-defense?

I love San Shou. It's one of the very few methods in kung fu that continues to evolve as in techniques [taking and adopting from different styles] , training metods, and tournaments.

[Shaolin Bushido]

Yes, San Soo or San Shou are reportedly the same thing as some of Jimmy's students students are reporting today. More accurately, "were" the same thing.

It's a legit form of self defense as Jimmy developed it instead of a collection of techniques used in a traditional competition.

[Tiger One]

Shou Shu Information

Sorry wrong thread!

[Uke]

Miyama Ryu jujitsu is considered family to my system and family members. Professor Pereira's school on Tremont Ave is legendary among SD practitioners in the Bronx. Their combat jujitsu is beautiful and effective. Unfortunately, the MA world felt the blow from Professor Pereira's death.

The last time that I saw them was at the tribute to my Professor when he was still alive. That was actually the last time that I saw Professor Pereira alive. There were many other schools other than Miyama ryu that came to pay tribute like the Depasquale's, Samurai Jujitsu, Sanuces, Kumite Ryu, Sugar Ryu, Graham Lewis, Ronald Duncan, Ron Van Clief, Thomas LaPuppet and many others.

But what I remember about Master Pereira was that he was soft spoken but struck like a tiger even at his advanced age. He was a great man. He had his base in Combato, but he was a master of many other arts.

I remember once watching him demonstrate a technique with his cane and out of no where he pulled a sword out and went into a slashing technique. He was a great technician.

[Tom Yum]

Glad to hear about new traditional MA masters, Uke.

[Uke]

Glad to hear about new traditional MA masters, Uke.

Well Tom, Professor Pereira isn't new. Actually he's dead. He's old school jujitsu that comes from WWII combatives. He's been around for many, many years and is another legend in the MA world, but because you don't see men like him in Black Belt or mags like it, people here won't know who he is.

[Zandar]

I might be able to dispell some of the misconceptions about Kung Fu San Soo. I have studied under a "1st generation" master for the past ten years ("1st generation" means, in San Soo, someone who studied directly under Jimmy Woo), and have also spoken with Jimmy's grandson. First:

"Jimmy's techniques are reportedly a distillation of self-defense techniques mainly from Choy Lay Fut but including other techniques common to other styles."

This is a common misconception, because the family names of our art and Choy Lay Fut are similar. Kung Fu San Soo's families are: Choi, Li, Ho, Fut, Hung (sorry if I use different anglicazations). Some have claimed a lineage from Choi Li Fut simply because of the name association and assumed that they were linked. There is no evidence to support it.
Second:

"Yes, San Soo or San Shou are reportedly the same thing as some of Jimmy's students students are reporting today."

This is another name-based misconception. San Shou and San Soo, indeed, are emalgamations of the same word; but neither is a martial art. Rather, Sanshou is the fighting component of any martial art. Jimmy used the term because he thought "Choi Li Ho Fut Hung Ga Ma" would be a bit too cumbersome for his American student (actually, he started off using "Karate" because no one had heard of Kung Fu back when he started teaching).

San Soo is a Southern Chinese style from the Kwan Yin monestary. It has no Shao Lin roots, and was pretty obscure outside of its own province. Jimmy (Chin Siu Dek, originally) learned the style as a family art; his great uncle, Chin Siu Hung (also known as Chin Neo Gi), was the leader of their village. Jimmy brought the art to the US, but did not come up with it nor modify it himself. He passed it on (eventually) as he learned it.

Initially, Jimmy thought white people were too stupid to do Kung Fu as they clumsily and poorly executed the moves. Jimmy failed to take into account that he had been practising since 4-5 years old, and Americans had never even seen martial arts moves (Jimmy came over to the states in 1939, before the Karate craze). After a while, he saw that some of his advanced students could actually do the more complex moves, and he opened up the entire art to teaching.

Some think that Jimmy came up with his own style because they have only heard from the students that were in his initial training phase (or students of those students, as it was a while ago). They'll make claims that San Soo has no blocks, or no throws, or no leverages, or no grappling, or any number of things that simply are not true. It's a valid misconception, but false nonetheless.

I hope this clears some things up about San Soo. If you have any questions, I'll be glad to answer as best as I can.

Regards.

[Tom Yum]

Well Tom, Professor Pereira isn't new. Actually he's dead. He's old school jujitsu that comes from WWII combatives. He's been around for many, many years and is another legend in the MA world, but because you don't see men like him in Black Belt or mags like it, people here won't know who he is.

What I meant was that you brought up an old Master who doesn't get popular coverage. And I agree - there are many excellent instructors/fighters out there in the TMA world that do not care for or want media coverage.

[Uke]

What I meant was that you brought up an old Master who doesn't get popular coverage. And I agree - there are many excellent instructors/fighters out there in the TMA world that do not care for or want media coverage.

Oh, if that's what you meant then there are literally thousands of master worldwide that are unknown. I'm not so sure that they don't want media coverage, Tom. Coverage may mean more students, and as I've said before no matter how much you love the arts everyone needs money to live in society. The difference is that most of the great ones just didn't whore themselves out to eventually become what some refer to as McDojos.

For instance, Professor Pereira was well known throught New York MA circles. So was Pete Siringano Sr, Moses Powell, Master Charles Nelson, Grandmaster George Cofield, Michael DePasquale Sr, Master Thomas LaPuppet, Professor Ronald Duncan, Grand Patriarch Peter Urban, Grandmaster Wai Hong, Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje, Grandmaster Jonathan Stewart, Grandmaster Leung Shum, Soke Irving Soto, and Grandmaster Chaka Zulu to name a few. These men all were masters of many arts, and known throught the world in various MA circles. But they didn't take out 2 page ads to market their art. They never fought in NHB. They never had their own sitcom like Chuck Norris.

They just studied and taught for decades, many of them dying while still actively teaching. To some, many of these men sound completely unfamiliar. To others, they sound familiar because many of the men I listed were highlighted in "The Warrior Within", a tribute to Bruce Lee.

[Hardball]

Slightly off topic but can someone tell me what the "RYU" in this thread title means?

[Uke]

Slightly off topic but can someone tell me what the "RYU" in this thread title means?

It means school or way.

[Hardball]

It means school or way.

Thanks, I've been searching all day long.

[Uke]

Thanks, I've been searching all day long.

No problem. We're supposed to be here to help each other.

[Hardball]

I try when I can Bro!!!