What Do You Think Of Akido?

[jubaji]

LOL! So it seems!

[Red Rum]

My disappointing experience with Aikido was this. Two friends of mine who claim to be high ranking Aikido practitioners (I truly hope they were lying) were training with me and I asked about Aikido. They said that I should grab their arm. I did. They then said 'No, no, no' grab me like this or it won't work. (!!!!)
I grabbed them like they said and they tried to twist my arm. I just folded my arm (using wing chun) and they couldn't do anything.

They then tried to do another move by holding my arm behind my back (like a bouncers grip). Again I turned round and relaxed my arm and they couldn't do anything.

Since then I have seen a couple of Aikido people at SENI, relative martial art fairs and gyms. They have been exceptionally poor. They are okay at close quarter clinch work but rely on the attacker doing certain things and in certain situations

There are far better arts out there (ie if I want a clinch use BJJ. If you want to throw someone use Judo. And as for striking - just train boxing)

Segal has doen martial arts other than Aikido including karate, judo and kendo. I know he has doen a lot of weaponry work as well. Also, if you have done any martial art for as long as he has, than you had better be good or you'd be a laughing stock!

[Red Rum]

I don't know what NHB stands for, so please forgive me.

As for the demo. They asked me to grab their arms. It wasn't like I was holding them as hard as I could or trying to be difficult. I grabbed them in a normal way and they couldn't handle it. In wing chun demos, I ask students to throw in a punch and it could be a hook, straight punch, low punch etc.

I asked them to show me defences against grabs - I asked what they would do if I grabbed them. And they didn't come up with an answer

It just wasn't at all impressive.

[Red Rum]

Not at all - the guys I was with asked me to try and get out of it. I wasn't even trying that hard.

When I train, I train sensibly and I am always keen to learn things about martial arts. I would never try to make things difficult for a martial artist (trying to catch them out etc) unless they asked me to.

Admittedly this is one of the only times I have seen Aikido (I did attend a class once, but it looked amateurish, so it's not a good example).

Everyone I have spoken to on the Aikido subject have said that it doesn't show you anything that you can't learn through other arts

[ScottUK]

Since then I have seen a couple of Aikido people at SENI, relative martial art fairs and gyms. They have been exceptionally poor.

I have to say I always enjoyed David Rubens' aiki (Yoshinkan trained in Japan) demo at SENI - very nice stuff, aggressive and dynamic. No 'students flying through the air under their OWN steam' with that guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_OjcQtN_TM

[jeff5]

I'd say as far as combativeness goes, akikido rates pretty low. I actually like it as an art, just that I don't know how good it is from a self defense aspect. This is mainly because of the historical development of Jujitsu and Aikido.

In Japan you had professional warriors, the Samurai. They fought with Bow, Spear, Sword, etc. They had their primary weapons, secondary weapons, and when all else failed empty hand. The empty hand portion was a very small subset, because as a warrior you obviously don't want to put down your weapons. Most of the close in grappling that they did would be reminiscent of Shui Jiao, Western Wrestling, or Judo just from the very nature of the armor they were wearing and how melee fighting progressed.

Once Japan was at peace, many of the houses and schools got very stylized and very specialized. Remember, they had a period of hundreds of years where they really didn't use their skills for actual combat very much. Daito-Ryu Aikijujitsu, which is the forerunner of Aikido, was codified during this time. I'm not saying that the old Jujitsu Ryu weren't combative, because from what I've read training in them was extremely hard and there was still the "kill your enemy" mind-set.

Then from Daito-Ryu we have Aikido. Aikido was not developed as a combat art, it was developed as a Do, a way to personal development and sefl perfection. Any actual combat or self defense techinques in it were secondary.

So yes I think its easy for lots of us today to criticsize Aikido. But I also think that we aren't looking at it correctly for what it actually is.

[Hardball]

Problem is, it is all but impossible to find any ju-jutsu dojos around any more. The last good books about this subject were by George Kirby, in the late 70's and early 80's. So, out of what is left out there today, I think Aikido is pretty much one of the last links to samurai.

George Kirby is still around. In fact he is the Grandmaster and Founder of the very prosperous American Jujitsu Association. www.americanjujitsuassociation.org

[Hardball]

I just bought two more of his books, one on Nerve attacks and the other on advanced Jujitsu- These were written fairly recently. All I can say is I wish I lived closer to Santa Clarita, where he teaches!

Check your local YMCA, a lot of his understudies teach there. Also, try his DVD's also.

[tntma]

Aikido can be extremely effective in a real fight situation. It does however take a long time to get proficient at the art, but once you do, you can be very effective, yes even against a experienced brawler. Even though aikido is mostly a defensive art, dont be fooled, an aikidoist can be offensive too, esspecially some of the harder styles of aikido.

Aikido may not be the best art for everyone, esspecially those with little patience, but it is definately effective, if used properly, same as any other art.

Also, Aikido is very similar to Samurai, since most of the movements and techniques are based from samurai.

[jubaji]

Also, Aikido is very similar to Samurai, since most of the movements and techniques are based from samurai.

Oooh, you were doing fairly well until there...

[tntma]

Oooh, you were doing fairly well until there...

Im not sure I follow you, aikido movements are largely based on samarai techniques.

[jubaji]

...............................

[Hardball]

If Akido meets Boxing, Akidoka would be wise to go for double leg takedown.

[ScottUK]

Nonsense. He'd be better off with a samurai technique...

[Hardball]

Nonsense. He'd be better off with a samurai technique...

That is a Samuriai technique. They used it when they dropped or broke their sword.