Certified JKD Instructors - How long?

[IPON]

I think the term JKD should have died with Bruce. It has caused so much hatred and political backbiting. To concentrate on who your instructor got his certificate from is bad JKD in itself. If someone can teach you stuff that works then who should argue with that? If your students are far more skillful and effective than mine then what good does my certification do? Besides being a marketing tool the name has not much use anymore.

Well said. I think Lee would be turning in his grave knowing that his students have created the "classical mess" he was trying to avoid

[Drew Howe]

Back in the day (14 years ago), when I was just starting to teach as an intern instructor under Gary Dill, it would take anywhere from 6 to 18 months of active teaching to advance from intern to the full instructor rank. The time depended on prior experience and natural ability. To be accepted as an intern instructor you had to have at least a year or more of training. So, if you wanted to be an instructor under Gary you would have to have put in 2.5 to 3 years of training. Some did it in about a year but they already had black belts in other systems and natural ability to absorb and teach the program.

Under Gary, we learned JKD as a martial arts system, and not solely as a concept. This is the way it was taught from Bruce Lee and James Lee at the Oakland school where Gary was a student in the early 70's. Now I realize a lot of people think that is wrong and that JKD wasn't a system, but then they weren't students at the Oakland school either. I don't wish to debate the subject, but even Inosanto considered James Lee to be his senior in JKD.

As a side note: In my research it seemed obvious to me which training program was most like the way Bruce Lee taught it. Simple and Direct, with no need to keep adding to what was already pure combat self-defense. I also realize that the Tao tends to contradict some of the training methodology and JKD being a system as it was at the Oakland school. However, there are two things I come back to on that. First, Bruce Lee never published what became the Tao of JKD. The notes that became the Tao were compiled and published by Tom Bleeker, Linda Lee's second husband...which incidentally only lasted a year I believe. Second, given that Bruce Lee didn't actually publish the book or approve of the contents, how am I or anyone else to know whether it is a true representation of ALL of his thoughts on JKD. I can go in to this deeper, and why I think concepts became the focus of "popular" JKD, but only if anyone wants to hear it.

[IPON]

This is the way it was taught from Bruce Lee and James Lee at the Oakland school where Gary was a student in the early 70's.

Was it really taught this way or were techniques given as a foundation for one to find thier own path, big difference. I believe Gary Dill spent his time training with james Yim Lee not Bruce. Now here is the question, was he ever authorized to teach anything that he learned?. Not a question you can shy away from, it is either yes or no. If the answer is noyou have to ask yourself why he is teaching. I am not trying to flame, but JKD has the most sensitivity with the truth.

I explained on a previous post the main reason for the "JKD expansion" was profit simple not the validity of the techniques. JKD was an infant style, which frequently changed as Lee Learned and grew as a MA as it should. But as such there was not an "heir" to the style even if you consider it a stlye
an people capitalized on it. Again, this was basically the reason Inosanto go into the picture with "Concepts" not for money (while of course he is profiting) but because of all the JKD crap that was comming out everyone was a JKD instructor and people were so greif stricken when Lee passed and after no one asks questions. People love Lee so much that the study the art just to be close to him, that is the reality. The legend and mystic of Lee is still strong and people are still greatly capitolizing on it. I know lots of JKD instructors from various Orgs and well .


I do not mean to offend, but listen to what you say it takes "6-18 months of teaching to be a full instructor" So what qualifies one to teach prior to this, the videos that were sent in or the quarterly seminars. I don't think a BB qualifies you to teach somone and even if it did, there are plenty of instructor that have no prior training and are teaching.

[Drew Howe]

Was it really taught this way or were techniques given as a foundation for one to find thier own path, big difference. I believe Gary Dill spent his time training with james Yim Lee not Bruce. Now here is the question, was he ever authorized to teach anything that he learned?. Not a question you can shy away from, it is either yes or no. If the answer is noyou have to ask yourself why he is teaching. I am not trying to flame, but JKD has the most sensitivity with the truth.

Well, we can only go on what other Oakland students have said. To my knowledge they all approach JKD as a system complete with techniques and concepts. Yes, Gary trained directly with James Lee, the most senior JKD instructor of all three schools. Gary was given permission by James to teach a small group of students while he was away at college, so long as he didn't pass himself off as a JKD instructor. James was worried that the college would start offering JKD courses which would have made Bruce very angry. Keep in mind to that this was prior to James Lee's and Bruce Lee's deaths, which I believe were with in about 6-8 months of one another. James died first. During this time only Bruce made the instructors, no one else, and he wanted to keep it small.

After James Lee died, and before Bruce died, Bruce was no longer happy with the direction JKD was going in and he ordered Dan Inosanto to close the Chinatown school and to stop teaching JKD to the public. Inosanto of course complied with Bruce's request. It wasn't until after Bruce's death that Inosanto began to teach the public once again. However, this time he no longer called it JKD. Dan felt that if he taught the concepts, and not the system, he would be complying with Bruce's last request to him not to teach JKD.

I'm not saying if this is right or wrong. Frankly I think it was just fine. However, in the early 80's more than a few people started to get the picture that JKD was JUST a weapon system because of the kali that Insoanto was teaching. In addition, people started talking about how JKD was only a concept.

There were more than just a few original students around that knew that this was not the case. I suppose Gary Dill has as much right to teach JKD as Inosanto does. After all, Bruce never told Gary not to teach JKD.

I do not mean to offend, but listen to what you say it takes "6-18 months of teaching to be a full instructor" So what qualifies one to teach prior to this, the videos that were sent in or the quarterly seminars. I don't think a BB qualifies you to teach somone and even if it did, there are plenty of instructor that have no prior training and are teaching.

Actually, what I said was that it takes a total of about 2.5 to 3 years for the average person with NO EXPERIENCE teaching to become an instructor. JKD as a system and a concept is relatively simple. JKD, the whole system concepts and all, is a combat self-defense program...not a difficult computer science program. It doesn't take a lifetime to master the program...a program that takes long to master will get you hurt in the street. This is exactly the thing that Bruce was against. But why should we let facts get in the way, right?

[thtackett]

I've been teaching JKD for around 30 years. From my experience not everyone can learn JKD, let alone teach it. To become an instructor one must be able to do it as well as teach it. When you get to be my age it gets harder and harder to do it. We need to have some of our young guys show it, as Bremer and I are no longer as physical as we were 20 years ago. But that's probably our fault as if Bruce was still alive he could do it, but he still said that he could only be sure of the fact that he would be the toughest 65 year old around.

[Drew Howe]

I've been teaching JKD for around 30 years. From my experience not everyone can learn JKD, let alone teach it. To become an instructor one must be able to do it as well as teach it. When you get to be my age it gets harder and harder to do it. We need to have some of our young guys show it, as Bremer and I are no longer as physical as we were 20 years ago. But that's probably our fault as if Bruce was still alive he could do it, but he still said that he could only be sure of the fact that he would be the toughest 65 year old around.

Tim I agree with not everyone can learn JKD. What reason do you feel it is that some people can't learn it?

[thtackett]

It's really the same reason that not everyone can be a good basketball player, or run fast, or be able to dance. You need more fast twitch muscles than slow twitch. You need a sense of where your body is in space. (we've all had a student who lacks that). You need a sense of rhythm. You need the drive to work like a son of a gun to get just one thing. For example, I drove 90 miles one way on Tuesday and Thursday night to Sifu Dan's house to train and would get home about 1 am and get up at 5:30 am to go and teach high school. You need the proper mind set to be satisfied with a minimum of responses to a single stimlus. These are just a few of the factors involved in learning JKD. This does not mean that anyone can't take JKD and become a better fighter, because they can. Learning JKD can make anyone better, but not everybody will be able to "get" it enough to be able to teach it because to teach it you need to be able to model it.

[Drew Howe]

Tim, that is all very true. As you know, in most major cities today, there are usually a few JKD instructors to pick from. I don't mean to disparage any of the numerous JKD instructors around today. But, certainly the experience training with Dan Inosanto in the early days must have been much different. This is one reason I think it is important for people interested in learning JKD to train with people like yourself...while we still have you guys.

I see a trend among many so-called JKD instructors today where they are moving so far from the core. I suppose the more commercial these guys become, with video tape after video tape, the more they feel the need to do something "new." Personally, I think a lot of this new junk is glittered poop. I don't begrudge anyone making a living...it's just all the hype that is funny.

I've thought about trying to make a name for myself like some others have, but the few times I started to go that direction it seemed I was selling out. I guess I'm not creative enough. That, and I'm not pretty enough for video and I'm not that fun to watch. Beyond that, there really is nothing totally new in my opinion. Just new names for old stuff. How many new JKD video programs will the market take. It's getting ridiculous.

Back to instructors as such: Unfortunately, the trend today is for instructors to churn out new and unqualified JKD instructors...I think this is being done for money. While I've said it takes the average person about 3 years or less to qualify as a JKD instructor under many programs, I don't agree that an average anybody should be a JKD instructor.