Anyone Practiced This Defense?

[Motion]

If you've practice this defense technique how effective was it for you?


[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njPgVLPTWZk[/YOUTUBE]

[Guest]

Its just the basic SBG crazy monkey position, its quite a popular teaching tool now.

Its not my cup of tea personally, when I box I don't spend my time wrapping my hands around my head in an elaborate attempt to defend a jab, or anything else for that matter. When I box, my hands are hitting my opponent as many times as they possibly can, that is how you win bouts.

As my coach says, you don't put on gloves to block punches.

[Ghost]

This kind of defense doesnt leave you with much chance to answer his attack, far better to parry his punch and actually have a clearer shot of hitting. Its ok though, another bit of defense you can add it.
My advice is it try it in sparring and see if it works for you.

Happy times.

[Motion]

Here's an image of Rampage Jackson using this defense.

[fire cobra]

I agree totally with everything said so far and will add that Muay Thai have the same (or similar) defence BUT the idea is to cover/shield with the arm while at the same time hitting with one of the other 6 weapons available to hit with,as a boxing only defence its way down the list of efficiency after leading off,anticipation,evasion and hit,parrie and hit etc,maybe good for when cornered and to gain time to compose etc,but never a tactic for in the centre of the ring imho.

[Guest]

To pitch in with the flip side...

In the SBG concept as I understand it, the crazy monkey position is part of a Boxing program that is designed to be non-attributes based. They want someone to walk into their gyms, young or old, and be able to walk out with fundementals that aren't exclusive to athletes with 10 years of training. They see the crazy monkey position as a simple base that anyone can learn to defend themselves against punches coming in from a range of angles.

I applaud anyone who tries to bring martial arts to the every day person, people who really need it, and strip away techniques that are unrealistic to learn given the constraints of natural ability. As I say, not my personal cup of tea and not convinced it is a great option for the ring, but I don't believe that is the motivation behind the technique.

Not an expert, could be wrong, I'm sure Bodhi will be along promptly....

[fire cobra]

To pitch in with the flip side...

In the SBG concept as I understand it, the crazy monkey position is part of a Boxing program that is designed to be non-attributes based. They want someone to walk into their gyms, young or old, and be able to walk out with fundementals that aren't exclusive to athletes with 10 years of training. They see the crazy monkey position as a simple base that anyone can learn to defend themselves against punches coming in from a range of angles.

I applaud anyone who tries to bring martial arts to the every day person, people who really need it, and strip away techniques that are unrealistic to learn given the constraints of natural ability. As I say, not my personal cup of tea and not convinced it is a great option for the ring, but I don't believe that is the motivation behind the technique.

Not an expert, could be wrong, I'm sure Bodhi will be along promptly....

I like the SBG training methology,but i wouldnt like to teach that paticular way of covering against jabs/crosses etc to a smaller person eg a flyweight against a heavyweight,as part of a overall game it has its uses,but more suited to Muay Thai/MMA than boxing i think.

[Ghost]

This technique is from boxing and is used in boxing.
Its one technique of many, we dont need to over analyze it.
It works just fine. Its used fairly well in thai boxing as firecobra points out. The elbow spike application and turning the head in is more thai development of the technique where elbow spikes and so on are common.

[Guest]

I'm sure you and I share similar views about anything that claims to be "non-attribute based." That's a sales pitch, plain and simple.

To a large extent yes Mike, but to a certain extent no (and I'm talking in general terms now, away from SBG and crazy monkey).

I think it depends whether you are positioning your instruction as Combat Athletics, Self Protection, or just Recreational martial arts:

Anyone trying to sell Combat Athletics as non-attribute based is kidding themselves and their students, I fully agree. Recreational martial arts, if that is how you honestly position it to your students, can be sold on the basis that as long as they are having fun and getting a workout then don't worry how it turns out. Some people just want to bash pads and swing sticks, and couldn't care if in a technical, attribute or combat sense it means zero.

For me the most difficult, and also the most dangerous fine line, is Self Protection. If you read pretty much all of my posts on SP across this board, you will see that I always say that good self protection starts with being in shape and having a strong level of attributes (physical, mental and emotional). I do believe that to be the case for the majority, and have no time for all the magic tricks and short cuts people try to sell. However, I always give that agenda because I know that many of the people on here, especially the guys I am talking to in this thread, are experienced athletes and fighters from one arena or another.

The difficulty in SP is when you try to teach someone like my Mum. She is a small, slight lady in her late 50's with pretty much no fitness or athletic background at all. She works as a nurse in wards where sometimes things can get scary. When she asked to teach her some SP, I just knew that 99% of what I can do she never could, not to any real level of use. So what I taught her had to be, and was, non-attribute based. I simply had to work with what I had knowing my Mum was never going have a solid base of attributes for me to work with. So having gone through that experience, and doing the best I could with some specific concepts in my toolbox, I do believe it can exist.

Now some people would say "well I just think thats a waste of time, a small woman in her late 50's whats the point, it will never work". Well what the hell is the point of martial arts then if we can't teach someone like my Mum? She needs it a damn sight more than I do.

[g-bells]

If you covered up like that, how are you going to see any leg kicks coming??

Let me state i'm not knocking it, just asking a question.

[Ghost]

If you covered up like that, how are you going to see any leg kicks coming??

Let me state i'm not knocking it, just asking a question.

a better question might be to ask how will you see all the punches coming at you.

As soon as a hook or an uppercut is thrown this technique wont work will it and you might obscure your view of an incoming punch, in particular hooks.

[Ghost]

I personally prefer to isolate the components of this. Though i have been taught it both ways but if you look at the cover for the right cross, i think this is a useful defense.
Im not keen on the defense against the jab, there are simply better alternatives.
Put together as a kind of alternating defense as shown in the video is ok but its really a "im being overwhelmed and cant cope" defense.


The defense against the cross is useful though for a few reasons.
The right cross for most is their big punch. This defense (the cover of the right cross only) allows you to defend with little skill or timing required. Its a solid defense against a solid punch, it also leaves your big right cross/hook/uppercut free to counter providing you dont launch into this alternating defense.

Certainly a useful block to have on its own. IMO.

[Ghost]

Are you looking at it as a sort of snapshot? As a reaction to a specific offense? Because it looked as if it was being taught as a basic "position" or ready.

I would agree that as a cover or block from a specific attack, it has a useful place. I just think it's unsound as a ready position or overall defensive idea.

Im assuming its a defensive tactic that can be adopted as opposed to a stance as such, if its a stance then forget it.

[Motion]

Put together as a kind of alternating defense as shown in the video is ok but its really a "im being overwhelmed and cant cope" defense.

But what about how Quinton Jackson uses it?

[Motion]

^
Well you're not going to win a fight just with the crazy monkey defense. Jackson has used the same defense in other fights that he's won.