Video certification

[akja]

Originally posted by Davidc316
Ryu,

You are acting extremely defensively for someone who has apparently got the upper hand over a clueless idiot like me who has just "ran away" from the other forum.

Before going any further, can we please establish some facts...

Ok, the person who is going to certify you (or at least, give you some kind of certification test) is called Paul Vunak. Is that correct?

Ok, how much time have you spent training with Paul Vunak?

Third, question... does Paul Vunak (who I admit to not knowing much about) sell Jeet Kune Do tuition videos via the Internet?

Four question- have you purchased and studied any of these videos (if they exist)?

Fifth question- when you go for your certification tests will you be tested on matters which are addressed in any JKD instructional videos?

END

I stress that this is not an attack, nor a defence. This is merely an attempt to establish some facts before I offer a more full respo

I remain on standby and hope to hear from you.

IF YOUR ON STANDBY? I'M STILL WAITING!

I can't beleive that you are actually a "member" of the JKD community and you don't know about Paul Vunak!!

[Davidc316]

Ok akja. I offer the following response:

The issue of which country a person comes from is an absurdity. Because I happen to live in Scotland does not make my views any less valid that someone who lives wherever you happen to live. For you to imply that a person is less knowledgable about a particular martial art because of where they come from borders on racism.

Twenty years ago, the idea of the worlds best Jujitsu practioners coming from Brazil (and not Japan) was an outragious proposition! But we all know what's happened since those days.

As for issues of my website and which camp I belong to...

I belong to no camp at all and I will NOT be forced into bad mouthing any respected original Bruce Lee students.

The information on the "important people" page on my website was the result of many weeks of intensive research (often 14 hours a day). As for the Joe Lewis issue...

I agree with you! So far, I have observed no significant evidence that Joe Lewis trained with Bruce Lee for any great period of time. This may change in the future, but so far the evidence just isn't there. That's why he doesn't get featured on that page (there's a big difference between a passing comment and actually having a full featured profile).

There are several close friends and students who have gone on the record as saying that Bruce was heavily influenced by Jack Dempsey. Joe Lewis was merely mentioned as an example of one person who has said this.

I fail to see how you've somehow caught me out by bringing up something with which we seem to agree.

[akja]

Originally posted by Davidc316
Ok akja. I offer the following response:

The issue of which country a person comes from is an absurdity. Because I happen to live in Scotland does not make my views any less valid that someone who lives wherever you happen to live. For you to imply that a person is less knowledgable about a particular martial art because of where they come from borders on racism.

Twenty years ago, the idea of the worlds best Jujitsu practioners coming from Brazil (and not Japan) was an outragious proposition! But we all know what's happened since those days.

As for issues of my website and which camp I belong to...

I belong to no camp at all and I will NOT be forced into bad mouthing any respected original Bruce Lee students.

The information on the "important people" page on my website was the result of many weeks of intensive research (often 14 hours a day). As for the Joe Lewis issue...

I agree with you! So far, I have observed no significant evidence that Joe Lewis trained with Bruce Lee for any great period of time. This may change in the future, but so far the evidence just isn't there. That's why he doesn't get featured on that page (there's a big difference between a passing comment and actually having a full featured profile).

There are several close friends and students who have gone on the record as saying that Bruce was heavily influenced by Jack Dempsey. Joe Lewis was merely mentioned as an example of one person who has said this.

I fail to see how you've somehow caught me out by bringing up something with which we seem to agree.

The only country issue there is:

Who taught you? And who taught them? Jeet Kune Do is American. If it left the country then there must be a lineage to trace.

You are questioning somebody who is training underone of Dan Inosantos most prestigious students.

Who of us has the training or right to question how Paul Vunak teaches?

[Ryu (JKD?)]

Originally posted by Davidc316
Ryu,

You are acting extremely defensively for someone who has apparently got the upper hand over a clueless idiot like me who has just "ran away" from the other forum.

I'm not angry, David. I'm just displeased by the way you've conducted things on the forum. It seems that others feel the same way.

Originally posted by Davidc316
Before going any further, can we please establish some facts...

Ok, the person who is going to certify you (or at least, give you some kind of certification test) is called Paul Vunak. Is that correct?

Yes, Paul Vunak is the head of Progressive Fighting Systems.
He has instructors world wide and is certified directly by Dan Inosanto.

Originally posted by Davidc316
Ok, how much time have you spent training with Paul Vunak?

My first training session with Paul was in 1998. I spent about 3 days with him so he could test out and tune up my skills that I had been learning from Thom Cruse (another PFS instructor under Paul). I had spent about 4-5 years training JKD prior to meeting Paul. My training with Paul personally was much shorter than my other instructors (because of distance) which is why I continued to seek him out, and try and train with him as much as possible. (which wasn't easy) I'm not afraid to say this and will most certainly not lie about it either. I also enrolled in a BJJ and later judo school for about 3 years. Like I said, my training is not strict JKD...it's more MMA then anything else.
My skills in JKDC did not come from years of being at Paul's "studio". They came from years of training with various JKD instructors and practitioners as well as MMA people, etc.

Originally posted by Davidc316
Third, question... does Paul Vunak (who I admit to not knowing much about) sell Jeet Kune Do tuition videos via the Internet?

He sells JKD instructional tapes, but offers no "certification by mail" type things at all.

Originally posted by Davidc316
Four question- have you purchased and studied any of these videos (if they exist)?

Do I study his instructional tapes? Of course, I have nearly all of them.

Originally posted by Davidc316
Fifth question- when you go for your certification tests will you be tested on matters which are addressed in any JKD instructional videos?

His videos are about attributes and fighting. So if you mean is he going to test my attributes and how well I fight full contact against resisting opponents? Then yes. He sure will.

END

I

Originally posted by Davidc316
stress that this is not an attack, nor a defence. This is merely an attempt to establish some facts before I offer a more full response.

Sure it was.


I'm not sure how things are done in your camp of JKD...(the only things I know about the group comes from having sparred with a couple of them.) PFS is a large "family" that branches out all over the U.S. Training with other PFS instructors and practitioners over the years and then being "tested" by Paul does not mean we study JKD for "2 days" and then get certified...which is what I'm almost sure you're trying to drive at.
We train just as long and hard as anyone. Watching videos is useless unless you test it out over and over again with people who are fighting you back, and getting your range game sound with the best of those ranges.

I hope that "helps."

I will say this though. First impressions are hard to break, and I probably shouldn't of said "don't give a shit about what Bruce Lee did or didn't do." I was tired and sore when I wrote that, and don't personally believe that. I think you very well should give a shit about what Bruce said and did. The man has found some very sound and objective truths about combat. Plus, you do need foundations in martial art. You need the right delivery systems of punching, kicking, clinching, and grappling.

Hopefully this will be our last post to each other. I was more than fine to agree to disagree when you said you didn't think anymore could be said about the conversation. What irked me was the fact that you came in here still talking about it.

But, "kay saraa saraa"

Ryu

[akja]

And I originally spoke up because my Sifu does not certify. I had to go to another source for a JKD certification. I am qualified but given the respect that I have for my Sifu I call my art Kempo Jujitsu because it reflects what I teach. The "fist law" and the "gentle art."

My Jun Fan Gung-Fu is mixed with BJJ, Trad. JJ and Karate. my hands are Jun Fan but that is just me.

And I can and will teach my Kempo Jujitsu on a video format. If you know what needs to be learned by the student, then the video is a good way to learn. I said good, not the best or the most desirable, but good.

There is a whole lot that can be learned by video if you are capable of learning. The biggest skeptics of this are the ones that just can't picture themselve actually doing it.

I'm learning from some "old masters" in this fashion. George Kirby, George Alexander and Lou Angel.

Check them out and see if you can buy any rank from them!!

The bottom line is you have to pass the test!!

If this format is going to help me to build up my organization allow me to retire to martial arts full time. Then I'm in! I will have the time to train under my instructors and go and teach my students.

So wheres the problem?

There is no problem my training dates back to 1973 and I am qualified to teach and train in whatever fashion I choose!

[Ryu (JKD?)]

By the way, akja, thanks for the support.

Ryu

[akja]

Originally posted by Ryu (JKD?)
By the way, akja, thanks for the support.

Ryu

You know it!

[akja]

Davidc316,

So wheres your lineage?

If you don't post it. Then who is the one that needs to be judged?

[Davidc316]

Ok, firstly to Rhu,

Thank you for answering the questions. You have answered well and any implications that you are some kind of insincere video certified JKD person are clearly wrong.

Even though I never mentioned your name in this thread and even though I added "I think" (meaning, I don't know for sure) when I was talking about this subject ealier on (way back) NEVER THE LESS- I am man enough to admit when I have made a mistake and any implications that you are in any way a video-certified JKD person are wrong. I sincerely appologise for making that particular implication.

Of course, this still leaves the issue of Kali, concepts Vs original and all that stuff. This is an issue which is still very much alive.

In the other forum I felt that we were having a good constructive debate when suddenly somone appeared out of the blue and started saying (something like) "Great comment Rhu!" between posts. Being a relatively new person here, I suddenly realised that this was not an unbiased forum or debate at all- it was in fact nothing more than a cleek! I am not willing to hang around some forum having a million people blindly ganging up on me simply because I am not a member of their particular herd. So I left.

I think it's unfortunate that things have gone so sour.
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Akja,

like I've said all over my "crappy fan site". I'm not a JKD person and I don't belong to any Jeet Kune Do camp.

In my lifetime I have been a member of two Jeet Kune Do clubs.

One of which was run by two brothers who had obtained certificates from Dan Inosanto, the other was run by a person who had obtained a certificate from the Jeet Kune Do Nucleus (Linda Lee, Shannon Lee, Howard Williams etc). I was at both clubs admittedly for a very short period of time.

I don't want to name either of these two clubs because I'm not interested in direct personal attacks. If you were desperate to know, then you could probably work out what the clubs were.

[akja]

Originally posted by Davidc316
Ok, firstly to Rhu,

Thank you for answering the questions. You have answered well and any implications that you are some kind of insincere video certified JKD person are clearly wrong.

Even though I never mentioned your name in this thread and even though I added "I think" (meaning, I don't know for sure) when I was talking about this subject ealier on (way back) NEVER THE LESS- I am man enough to admit when I have made a mistake and any implications that you are in any way a video-certified JKD person are wrong. I sincerely appologise for making that particular implication.

Of course, this still leaves the issue of Kali, concepts Vs original and all that stuff. This is an issue which is still very much alive.

In the other forum I felt that we were having a good constructive debate when suddenly somone appeared out of the blue and started saying (something like) "Great comment Rhu!" between posts. Being a relatively new person here, I suddenly realised that this was not an unbiased forum or debate at all- it was in fact nothing more than a cleek! I am not willing to hang around some forum having a million people blindly ganging up on me simply because I am not a member of their particular herd. So I left.

I think it's unfortunate that things have gone so sour.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Akja,

like I've said all over my "crappy fan site". I'm not a JKD person and I don't belong to any Jeet Kune Do camp.

In my lifetime I have been a member of two Jeet Kune Do clubs.

One of which was run by two brothers who had obtained certificates from Dan Inosanto, the other was run by a person who had obtained a certificate from the Jeet Kune Do Nucleus (Linda Lee, Shannon Lee, Howard Williams etc). I was at both clubs admittedly for a very short period of time.

I don't want to name either of these two clubs because I'm not interested in direct personal attacks. If you were desperate to know, then you could probably work out what the clubs were.

Good enough. But you shouldn't mess with anybody with "real" training then. Thats all. Have a good day.

[Ryu (JKD?)]

David,
Apology accepted. I would like to apologize myself, once more, for my comment that I feel started this whole thing. The "don't give a shit about what Bruce did or didn't do."

I shouldn't have said that, and it was just frustration (and a sore shoulder) talking.

As far as the people on the board who make comments to one another.......well it's a public forum. There is no "herd" here. When someone wants to jump in to say something (even if it be complimenting or attacking someone's post) they are free to do so. None of us have any power over that. And rightly so.

Anyway, hope things can get better as of now.
I need to get away from this computer now anyway and train.

Ryu

[Davidc316]

Ok. I agree.

Let's move on from this negative episode and get back to the real world.

[Guest]

No. Lets' stay negative. It ded funny........

PS - there is a JKD lineage in Scotland. Go here

https://www.rickyoung.co.uk

I have never trained with him, but I have trained here

https://www.maxt.co.uk

and this guy is also certified to teach JKD (as well as Thai Boxing and Combat Submission Wrestling). But he isn't in AScotland, he is near to my dear home on the west side of Manchester.

[shasan]

For what it's worth, I don't know if I would feel comfortable being trained by someone who got a 'video' certification.

Although I can't quite put my finger on why that is... I don't know if they're just as good or not, but from a pure unknowledgeable student point of view, that piece of information about the instructor would cast a lot of doubt on his abilities, hence making me look elsewhere for instructions.

Whether that's a rational view or not, I'm willing to bet most students or prospective students of the arts will feel that way.

Peace,
Sameer.

[akja]

I don't want to be misquoted. I was just saying that the watered down effect would be more likley in another country where there is less of it.