Tai Chi VS Jeet Kune Do?

[Szczepankiewicz]

And old people.... now you get the idea. Young bucks full of piss and vinegar don't live long enough to be 'old people'.


Hikuta will destroy them both without working up a sweat.

[darrianation]

Okay I change my mind. It would be a draw! You should be respectful of your elders so you will not fight them, and you shouldn't hit a woman. So nothing will happen!

[aseepish]

Having studied both Taijiquan and JKD I`d say that you`ll be able to fight in less time in JKD. My TJQ instructor had some association with Montague and spoke very highly of him. I don`t look to TJQ for any kind of life-or-death self-defense techniques.

Then again, I`ve seen Paul Vunak use a `peng` movement to push a guy away to create space for a savate kick or something, but this was also on a tape on "self-perfection."

I`d also wai a stop sign if it would get me out of a couple of hundred push-ups!!

[kungfupanda]

In case you haven't read the threads on Jeet Kune Do. It isn't an art and asking people what it would do for you in a situation is impossible. It has no moves, strategies, or anything. It is just a philosophy.

And what is a "wai"??????

[swan104]

I like that parable/joke! I'll have to remember that to keep me on track.

I do respect Tai Chi and other internal martial arts. I don't feel I have enough knowledge of the subject to judge it, so I can't say which one is better. I think it depends on the individual, his attributes, training, experience etc.

[swan104]

Dan Lee seems to like his Tai Chi, so it can't be that bad!

Wasn't he lightweight boxing champion of China all those years ago before he met Bruce Lee and started training in JKD?

[chris davis 200]

Honestly though, is tai chi really a martial art? I’ve seen them in the park many times doing slow rhythmic kata type forms. Do they even spar? How can you become a good fighter without fighting?

Tai chi forms that you see MOST perople practicing is mearly a health exercise and these poeple probably dont even know it is a martial art.

A martial art it most definatley is!

The first stage of learning is usually the form work, with application of the form shown, noting that each form movement has numerous applications this can be very eye opening when done at full speed. (a good teacher will show you this very very effectivley against any attack, just using form movements for defence and counter) the form is done fast, slow and medium paced to give awareness in all speeds of combat.

Then comes push hands work, first single then double then sometimes push feet. this teaches sensitivity and movement responces to opponents movement. some think it is like wing chun stiking hands. Although it is not. at this point most have a good competance at free fighting because of the awareness that is developed.

Then you work punching, kicking, kneeing, shoulder and elbow striking as well as chi na (locking) into the push hands drills, random attacks, not set. also done at full speed not slow like the form can be.

Then finally comes free sparring where two people basically try to hurt each other. by this point the exponents have a very subtle awareness of the movement of their opponent and are able to easily evade most conventional attacks such as punchs, kicks and locking. At this level, the ability to fight suppasses most exernal systems IMO.

This sort of training can take as little as 4 years to get to the last level. But training really does improve your skill and the more you train the greater fighter you will be.

cheers
chris

[darrianation]

chris

Honestly I had no idea of tai chi beyond the forms. So they do spar. Thanks for the education chris.

[chris davis 200]

my pleasure.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Learning how to relax, to remain calm is probably the best single thing you can learn. For self defense or for dealing with any kind of stressful situation.

If keep your head, you'll most likely keep your head.

All the chop sockey stuff is icing on the cake.

Why was Royce dominant in his UFC days? Because no matter how big, ugly, or mean his opponent was he always kept his cool.

Correctamundo!

Cool like Fonzie.


Spanky

[ap Oweyn]

Originally posted by kungfupanda
In case you haven't read the threads on Jeet Kune Do. It isn't an art and asking people what it would do for you in a situation is impossible. It has no moves, strategies, or anything. It is just a philosophy.

And what is a "wai"??????

I think you're oversimplifying this to much. It isn't impossible. The philosophy has principles. Those principles give rise to strategies. And those strategies are implemented through movements.

Bruce Lee emphasized simplicity. That was part of his philosophy. He connected that with principles like economy of motion, straight lines to the target, etc. Those principles were embodied in movements like the straight lead and the stop kick.

Yes, you can say it's a philosophy. But to say it's just a philosophy is stopping short. Philosophy is theory. Practice of that theory results in moves and strategies. Those moves and strategies may change over time. But that doesn't mean that any discussion of them is false or useless.


Stuart B.

[aseepish]

Wai not?

The wai is the Thai formal greeting. Both hands are placed flat together (like a prayer position) and you bow slightly.

As for pushing hands (single/double), it`s a good energy drill as long as you keep in mind the fact that it`s ONLY an energy drill.

I agree with Panda - if your JKD is 70% Taiji and it works for you, good on ya! (Sorry, been hanging with too many Aussie ex-pats). Didn`t Tim Tackett have an extensive background in Chinese internal MAs?

Keep, uh, grasping that bird`s tail!

T.

[ap Oweyn]

Yep. Xingyi, if I'm not mistaken.

[chris davis 200]

Keep, uh, grasping that bird`s tail!

LOL!

[ZenPizzeria]

Several things that really should be said:

- taijiquan and jeet kune do aren't mutually exclusive. JKD concept is an approach, not a set style, and every interpretation of it is different.
- there are similarities between combat taijiquan and JKDC. In particular, one of the Chen-style silk reeling exercises looks a *lot* like Sinawali in reverse.
- you can't say "taijiquan would always win" or "JKD would always win" because in the end it comes down to the fighters and their individual attributes. JKD'ers are all different; every one is a unique opponent (I know this from personal experience training with them). Similarly, I've met taijiquan players who I'd be scared to go up against and others who couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag.
- if you combine JKD concept and practice judiciously with taijiquan, you can come up with something truly devastating. The taijiquan, particularly the spiralling silk-reeling exercises of Chen style and some of the Yang-style movements such as their brush-knees (the compact ones where the opposing hand is by the crook of the elbow of the pushing arm at the beginning of the push), add strong body mechanics and reacquaint the body with natural lines of movement.