If Bruce had Lived.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Look at it this way, Bruce Lee, Jigoro Kano, and the Gracie Clan have all 'discussed the higher level philosophical topics of MA' to change the way the rest of of think about the subject.


Acutally 'fighting' takes up but a very small percentage of your actual training. Methods of training, mindsets of training, and actual technical practice of technique takes up a much larger percentage of your time than 'fighting' ever will. At least for most people.

Where do the methods and mindsets come from? From people sitting around thinking and discussing said topics.

It's good that you are skeptical, but everything you do in training came from one of these high level sessions.

'Actually fighting against someone who is fighting back' is a small, albeit important, part of your overall training, wouldn't you say?

[terry]

I think, when it comes to the formation of fighting methods, that optimally wisdom and philosophy are formed out of experience rather than the other way around.

I dunno what the mix between the two is. I seem to always be trying to fit in more mat time.

[Ryu (JKD?)]

Szczepankiewicz is correct.

[tkdkid]

Well I don't think anyone can tell for sure what Bruce would have done if he was still alive but I would imagine he would have a huge influence in martial arts and mma. I got nothing but love for bruve he was tremendous martial artist, one of the best...may he rest in peace.

[moma_news]

There is a divisive rift in JKD and will always be one, I think.

Who's right and who's wrong? It doesn't matter. We're at this position today because of the way things have played out in the history of JKD.

No amount of debating or arguing is ever going to change it. This forum and many others like it have proven this, time and time and time and time again!

People are too entrenched in their "way" of JKD to ever listen to a "logical" argument. That goes for all sides.

A lot of this is Bruce Lee's "fault" for lack of a better term. By trying to make JKD more philosophical in nature it has left room for different interpretations.

And of course, he died too soon, never really laying a clear path for JKD. I believe his focus was always more on his own development. Probably thinking he could map the path of JKD in later years. I'm only guessing here, though.


Is this good or bad? I don't know. I see good and bad points on both sides.


It's ultimately up to each person to decide the path they're going to take. And why.

To me, the most important thing is to keep an open mind.


Many people get very emotional about this issue and run their mouths a lot. Mostly on the Internet!

For those people, I would say to make sure that you're not "all hat and no cattle" so-to-speak!

Someone will call you on it someday!

[ryanhall]

I believe that Bruce today would look a lot like Vale Tudo and RBSD stuff. A lot of Kali would have been cut out, as destructions and gunting are largely not functional. According to Bruce, his aim was towards efficient streetfighting/self-defense, not sport. He would have seen the overlap between the two, however.

Most importantly, he would consider people foolish for spending their time debating what a dead man might have done thirty years post-mortem.

[swan104]

I think as Bruce got older he would have looked into:

1. "Realistic" weapons defence.
2. Even though many of the JKD principles apply whether you are young or old (eg, non-telegraphy, economy in motion etc), I think as he got older, he would have to rethink his own strategies for fighting younger, more athletic martial artists.

[Szczepankiewicz]

He would have done as he always did, rethink constantly. Experiment, analyze, repeat.

Then he would have thought it out, wrote it down, and passed it on to whomever would listen.

Ever the philosopher....


******

A note on arguing on the internet. I think it does serve a good purpose: The free exchange of ideas. All of those people who seem to bash on it seem to be doing so....on the internet....

[Guest]

What is gunting? Pardon my collossal ignorance!

[ryanhall]

Bri,
Gunting is an FMA term that means 'scissors.' You attack the limb of an opponent on the first beat. An example of this would be leaving your guard wide open as if to say "take your best shot." The idea is that you intercept the other guy's strike and execute a pre-planned counter. If you throw a cross through my open guard, I can guide your fist into the tip of my elbow or parry and use an edge of the hand to to strike the bicep. It's really cool in concept, but it's hard as hell to do. Not to mention, you're reacting instead of acting. If the other guy is too fast or you're not right on the money, you're gone. Even if you could do it, there are more vulnerable targets to be hit than a hand or an arm. Hope that helped.

A note on arguing on the internet. I think it does serve a good purpose: The free exchange of ideas. All of those people who seem to bash on it seem to be doing so....on the internet....

Spanky,
I agree with you. However, when the same things are argued repeatedly and without any kind of conclusion, it becomes an exercise in frustration that is unproductive. How about this one instead: would Bruce have liked Gatorade or Powerade? I say Gatorade all the way.

[Szczepankiewicz]

Well gee Ryan, I guess that's where moderators come in and shutdown the bullshit and ban the idiots.....


Ahhh, but I digress.

[moma_news]

Spanky,

Debating? Yes. I'm for that. As long as it's logically based.

The pointless posturing that often happens with these "arguments" or "debates" is what I bash!

Now, how do you know when to stop beating the dead horse, though?

[Szczepankiewicz]

Please see my previous post on moderation.....

[moma_news]

Well gee Ryan, I guess that's where moderators come in and shutdown the bullshit and ban the idiots.....

Sure... it's just that easy isn't it Spanky? And they NEVER come back either. Problem solved!



Man... I've got to get this guy ( ) added to the Smilies on the Martial Direct board!

[Szczepankiewicz]

With good moderation you can keep the nonsense to a minimum. It's gotten a lot better here since ryan started and terry is more available.

As far as people coming back, again, a good moderator can take check of them and using Phil's Phantastic Phuana Phile you can generally weed out the trouble makers.

Now, there are examples of group think and 'over' moderation available as well.

Getting back to debate and philosophize and what Terry and I were going back and forth on.

Our curriculum is set up in four major categories. One is concerned chiefly with strategy, tactics, principles and exercise. The other three deal with transportation, striking, and grappling. So over 75% of what we learn deals with doing, more so if you count the exercises.

For any given technique you spend, say, about 10% of your time taking notes, learning, pondering, possibly discussing, and eventually teaching said technique. The other 90-95 percent of your time is spent executing, practicing, improving your technique. Training your body to know the technique without knowing it at all.

So Terry is absolutely right, as all who have trained will recognize, that experience is very important. Train, train, and then train some more.

However, without the philosophy to guide your training, without direction your efforts may well be misguided. Look at all those people working soooo hard in the mcdojo. They work so hard for so long and are often times worse off than when they began.

Me old football coach used to say that 'Practice does not make perfect. Practice makes permanent'.

And of course Edison said: 'Genius is one per cent inspiration, ninety-nine per cent perspiration.'

Without the one percent, you are inefficient in your 99%.