What is, and what is NOT Jeet Kune Do.

[Thai Bri]

I'm getting a bit fed up with some of you JKD guys claiming that MMA practitioners ARE doing JKD. Just because JKD was about "absorbing what is useful" etc., it does NOT mean that everyone who cross trains is JKD.

I think its a bit sad that some point to a MMA champion, and try to somehow bask in their glory......as if they somehow are doing the same as you, and even learning from you.

JKD is the way of the intercepting fist. Of course it involves techniques from different arts. But so what?

STOP LEACHIN' OFF THE MIXED MARTIAL ARTS!

[Ryu (JKD?)]

No.






























LOL, of course MMA isn't "JKD" as MOST people practice it!
The philo behind it is the same however. Find what's useful, test it, and disregard what doesn't work in a real environment.

Poor Bruce. His philosophy is one big religion now.

Ryu

[brokenelbow]

Heck Ryu, according to Lamar you don't even do JKD, so I don't see where MMA = JKD. Thai Bri, many JKDokers need affirmation for what they do by associating themselves to whatever arts or sports are succesful.

Poor Bruce. His philosophy is one big religion now.

Jihad, jihad, jihad!!!

[Ryu (JKD?)]

Hey whoa! Be careful with those words!! The government's watching us......It's WATCHING US!!




Heh heh, Good ole Lamar.
But I guess Paul V, Matt Thornton, and Eric Paulson don't do JKD either.....so I'm in good company.

Ryu

[roz]

apologetic for the way you feel. i think all the one-a-be jkdokers are the ones who mislead every one, like jkdrs' can catch bullets with thier fingers, arrows w/teeth,disapear in the cage against opponets,influence judges with simple eye contact, and call upon other jkdrs with sublinamal messages.

sorry for the misconception:

[Nutz]

Re: What is, and what is NOT Jeet Kune Do.

Originally posted by Thai Bri
I'm getting a bit fed up with some of you JKD guys claiming that MMA practitioners ARE doing JKD. Just because JKD was about "absorbing what is useful" etc., it does NOT mean that everyone who cross trains is JKD.

I think its a bit sad that some point to a MMA champion, and try to somehow bask in their glory......as if they somehow are doing the same as you, and even learning from you.

JKD is the way of the intercepting fist. Of course it involves techniques from different arts. But so what?

STOP LEACHIN' OFF THE MIXED MARTIAL ARTS!

Hmm... You have to look at what their meaning is in the message, not just the words they may have chosen. Think for example of what the concept of JKD tries to convey--use what works.

In its very essence, and that alone, anyone the cross-trains their martial arts and betters themselves as a fighter, at least philosophically (regardless if they intended to or not) is practicing the concept of what Bruce advocated, which is to say, not be classical and do what works for YOU as an individual in a realistic combat situation. That is what I take from the concepts and philosophy of JKD as it was presented to me. Incidentally, if you were to follow this ideology through you should see that the way individuals will fight we exmplify the varying truths of individuals when it comes to the fight game. This means that people are diffenent and just as no two fingerprints are alike, no two fighting styles will be the same--if the practicioners strive for their truth and not somebody else's.

[lssanjose]

I don't remember anything about bruce saying TAKING what's useful. There's a deeper connotation when he writes of ABSORBING what is useful. Absorbing doesn't mean blindly taking.

"You must be careful not to add on other systems or tecyniques simply because they seem interesting or look good"

" Each thign must be evaluated to make sure that it does not take away from what your true goal is"

- Bruce Lee after telling steve golden of the artist and the horse.

[akja]

Originally posted by lssanjose
I don't remember anything about bruce saying TAKING what's useful. There's a deeper connotation when he writes of ABSORBING what is useful. Absorbing doesn't mean blindly taking.

"You must be careful not to add on other systems or tecyniques simply because they seem interesting or look good"

" Each thign must be evaluated to make sure that it does not take away from what your true goal is"

- Bruce Lee after telling steve golden of the artist and the horse.

You're right it goes more like "use what is useful, reject what is useless and add what is specifically you're own."

Bri is wrong about the leaching but he's right that MMA is not JKD, not even close. There are some concepts and techniques that "crossover," for instance in MMA's feints, bob and weave, grappling and so on are all taught but not really "within" in the concepts of JKD.

By the "standard" that many people are setting that "anything" can be JKD would lead us to beleive that a JKD instructor is not even needed. That they can "figure" it all out themslves and "label" it Jeet Kune Do!

[lssanjose]

Jeet Kune Do was Bruce's term for how he conducted himself in combat. It represented HIS way of combat. Anyone can use his art to advance their study in the way but their innovations are theirs not Bruce's. So give credit where it is due. No harm in giving yourself credit

[Lost Ronin]

This argument has been discussed many times... OH what the heck. I don't disagree with you and I don't exactly agree with you Bri Thai. I mean, MMA is a full contact sport that allows practitioners to use any and all martial arts techniques. MMA athletes always strive for efficiency, its all about making it better and trying to surpass the given limits as much as possible. Kinda sounds like JKD, doesn't it? Honestly, apart from the shift of focus from disciplines such as Wing Chun, Savate, and Boxing you can't really tell apart "JKD" from MMA, in the techniques anyway.

The only thing that sets JKD apart from MMA is its philosophy, one is a sport meant for entertainment and the other is a vehicle of personal growth and development. I don't think anyone has the right to claim a particular set of techniques or principles as JKD. Because that is not what it was meant to be in the first place. Bruce himself said it, "JKD is just a name, don't fuss over it." For example, if I practice Boxing, Wrestling and Brazilian Jujitsu and I focus on practicality and self growth. Who is to say that I am not practicing JKD?

You don't have to practice a single shred of Wing Chun or any of that stuff to practice JKD. JKD is from the heart, it is a persons emotions and training expressed physically. Then MMA is in a way JKD. Its all about the individual, screw everybody else. It may not be "JKD" in the sense of the philosophical background, but then again JKD philosophy stresses that fact that there are no set ways to do anything.

[lssanjose]

Bruce was right when he said that not many will get Jeet Kune Do. I still don't understand it fully but my understanding is better than what it was before. JKD does adhere to structure. But it's not an imposing structure. Each person in JKD has their own structure physically. In Principle JKD is structured around non intention or economy of motion as some call it. There are things that can facilitate the principle of non intention: strong side foward, longest weapon to nearest target, daily decrease, minimal responses per stimuli, no passive movements, etc. In the Bruce Lee magazine the Ted Wong interview mentioned that Bruce wrote the following : wherein lies the root of JKD ? as the interview goes it follows by having written : on guard position, mobility, coordination. etc.

I am being taught that the structure in JKD is really tight and economical. There is a way to punch. Now i'm not saying what kind of punch but rather is the punch being delivered tightly, economically and powerfully?

when bruce discusses using all ways and bound by none.. i'm thinking he means that they don't rely on one line of attack : one line being like one path. also it's a psychological thing when he says that. It doesn't mean that it uses all martial arts systems, but rather that don't think of what you are hitting your opponent with at the time of conflict, there's no time for that. AT the same time Bruce mentioned combining natural instinct with mechanical control. He also mentions sharpening or dissolving of the tools.

so also he mentions not to worry about the outcome of the fight and let nature take its course and the limbs will strike according to the discipline they've undergone.

When one truly masters something they go beyond the confines of their style and discover new ways of utilization. It's refinement not ornamentation.

Again these only are my interpretation of Jeet Kune Do.

[swagman]

MMA

In my view it is impossible to seperate MMA and JKD, or to even associate them either.
The reason being that you cannot practice JKD as a style, you can only follow it as a philosophy.

So is MMA, the same as JKD, not neccesarily, but the practioners of MMA could still be followers of JKD.

[shasan]

it's just a name. Give anything a name and for some reason it's limited to that name. kinda silly.

[Lizard]

How is JKD for "personal growth" does the stretching make you bigger or something?

MMA does NOT allow ALL MA techniques.

Sorry, I didn't actualy add anything to the disscussion but I have begun to change it to make it slightly better.

[lssanjose]

like what techniques aren't allowed lizard?