Wong Jak Man kicked Brue's ass.

[sean carter]

not true
dan was there and linda has confirmed this

Ok one I find it hard to believe that, because Linda would be going back on her word again and confirming that she is a liar. She has said on more than one occasion that her James Lee and Bruce were present and that teh other people that were there were with Man, and she said at least 13 others. No one not even Inasanto has every mentioned him or anyone else being there with Bruce. I also find it hard to believe that Inasanto would have actaully said out loud that he was there, he would never make such an outrageous claim.

[pstevens]

Ok one I find it hard to believe that, because Linda would be going back on her word again and confirming that she is a liar. She has said on more than one occasion that her James Lee and Bruce were present and that teh other people that were there were with Man, and she said at least 13 others. No one not even Inasanto has every mentioned him or anyone else being there with Bruce. I also find it hard to believe that Inasanto would have actaully said out loud that he was there, he would never make such an outrageous claim.

I have a better idea! Why don't you go and beat Wong's ass, then you can go around saying that you beat the guy who supposedly beat Bruce Lee...

For all the publicity this guy's getting for his infamous match, he's nowhere to be found...

[m.artist]

Ok one I find it hard to believe that, because Linda would be going back on her word again and confirming that she is a liar. She has said on more than one occasion that her James Lee and Bruce were present and that teh other people that were there were with Man, and she said at least 13 others. No one not even Inasanto has every mentioned him or anyone else being there with Bruce. I also find it hard to believe that Inasanto would have actaully said out loud that he was there, he would never make such an outrageous claim.

he's said he was there, and so has lynda...what's the lie in that?
they both have said it from the begining. i fail to see a lie in that

[sean carter]

he's said he was there, and so has lynda...what's the lie in that?
they both have said it from the begining. i fail to see a lie in that

If you say you have heard him say it, as well Linda confirm it I have no choice but to believe it. My problem is this is the second time im hearing some one assume he was there. If Linda said this, how come she didn't testify to him being there in her book about Bruce, where she told all those lies. She said it was her James Lee, and Bruce. And second how come I have not heard Dan Inasanto do any magazine interviews and say he was present when he was asked about Wong Jack Man.
I think what you said about Wong JAck Man and me fighting is funny. But more seriously though, we have two witnesses that are credible. I feel Linda cannot be one of them and I will tell you why. The Lies of Linda Lee is why. I think we could come up with one million lies she created, but lets focus on her worst ones. First was her Dragon movie, my god. Even Robert and Peter Lee said they were disgusted. Saying that Bruce was injured by wong JAck Man, only to come back and defeat him, artist privledge my ass, you have half the country believing that shit. Number two was her complete lack of respect for his family, Bruce spent the majority of his life with his family and his last 14 years in America with his wife and kids, she completely neglected that concept. Even his brother lived with him in America did you know that. What about his closest friend next to Linda, James Lee who died an untimely death, opened the first studio with him. Lets not forget her biggest real life lie to the police, when asked if Bruce used narcotics she said no, only later at a death inquest to admit it. She is concerned with one thing making Bruce into Christopher Reeve. If Bruce wanted to be him he would have been.
2 witnesses that are credible. Wong Jack Man, and chinese man interviewed by Black Belt. Everyone else besides Linda and these 2 could either not be tracked down, or refused to comment. Why do I believe Man, for a couple of reasons. First, Man's first account matched up more with the mystery old man interviewed by Black Belt, while it contradicted Linda's. 2 rumors about the fight around then and now, match up with Man's account. He basically said that no one won, and he fought defensively the whole time because he thought Bruce was taking it too seriously. He said he felt that he was a better fighter than Bruce. He also said the fight took 20 min. Now Man never broke Bruce's and his agreement to keep silent about the fight till Bruce talked on TV.
The Chinese Man also said that the fight lasted 20 min, and that neither man won, or knocked down the other.
Linda claims the fight lasted a few minutes, but Bruce was exhausted, and felt it took too long, but he maid made Man quit after he ran around.
Now in Black Belt a friend of Bruce claims that Bruce never said he won the fight, except for that occasion on TV where he didnt use names. He said Bruce wrote a letter to him about it saying, I couldnt hit him,he embrassed me, and he has no class.
Now with all this info you decide for yourself.

[m.artist]

If you say you have heard him say it, as well Linda confirm it I have no choice but to believe it. My problem is this is the second time im hearing some one assume he was there. If Linda said this, how come she didn't testify to him being there in her book about Bruce, where she told all those lies. She said it was her James Lee, and Bruce. And second how come I have not heard Dan Inasanto do any magazine interviews and say he was present when he was asked about Wong Jack Man.
I think what you said about Wong JAck Man and me fighting is funny. But more seriously though, we have two witnesses that are credible. I feel Linda cannot be one of them and I will tell you why. The Lies of Linda Lee is why. I think we could come up with one million lies she created, but lets focus on her worst ones. First was her Dragon movie, my god. Even Robert and Peter Lee said they were disgusted. Saying that Bruce was injured by wong JAck Man, only to come back and defeat him, artist privledge my ass, you have half the country believing that shit. Number two was her complete lack of respect for his family, Bruce spent the majority of his life with his family and his last 14 years in America with his wife and kids, she completely neglected that concept. Even his brother lived with him in America did you know that. What about his closest friend next to Linda, James Lee who died an untimely death, opened the first studio with him. Lets not forget her biggest real life lie to the police, when asked if Bruce used narcotics she said no, only later at a death inquest to admit it. She is concerned with one thing making Bruce into Christopher Reeve. If Bruce wanted to be him he would have been.
2 witnesses that are credible. Wong Jack Man, and chinese man interviewed by Black Belt. Everyone else besides Linda and these 2 could either not be tracked down, or refused to comment. Why do I believe Man, for a couple of reasons. First, Man's first account matched up more with the mystery old man interviewed by Black Belt, while it contradicted Linda's. 2 rumors about the fight around then and now, match up with Man's account. He basically said that no one won, and he fought defensively the whole time because he thought Bruce was taking it too seriously. He said he felt that he was a better fighter than Bruce. He also said the fight took 20 min. Now Man never broke Bruce's and his agreement to keep silent about the fight till Bruce talked on TV.
The Chinese Man also said that the fight lasted 20 min, and that neither man won, or knocked down the other.
Linda claims the fight lasted a few minutes, but Bruce was exhausted, and felt it took too long, but he maid made Man quit after he ran around.
Now in Black Belt a friend of Bruce claims that Bruce never said he won the fight, except for that occasion on TV where he didnt use names. He said Bruce wrote a letter to him about it saying, I couldnt hit him,he embrassed me, and he has no class.
Now with all this info you decide for yourself.

sorry, but i couldn't understand what you said in numer 1 at all!
lol

but about number 2
here's what i think
here you have people, respectable people, who are still around, going on with their lives. dan inosanto is a jkd instructor in la, and i don't know what linda is doing but im sure she's fine. both of them have said, and recalled, how the fight went, and that both where present along with brother lee.(not bruce, i mean his bro)
now.
when someone loses a competition, they usually are ashamed for losing. now, in the case of a chinese man, losing a fight, his reputation is ruined for life. he no longer has any students, or followers. but, to keep the reputation, one may tell a little white lie. not a huge one, not something like "i kicked his ass!"
but more like, "eh...he fought..i fought....nobody won...." that way they don't attract too much attention to themselves. but the keep their reputation.
now
linda and dan are both doing great right now. i have heard nothing from wong jak man in years. i have no clue what he was doing, and the last i heard, he was a waiter at a chinese resturaunt.
an old man telling tales to keep his credibility is not unheard of
what you say may be true, and linda has been known to act strangely at times, but, let's look at the respect of the people we are looking at here.

if you are right, then i stand corrected
if not, then...i stand correct i guess

[sean carter]

sorry, but i couldn't understand what you said in numer 1 at all!
lol

but about number 2
here's what i think
here you have people, respectable people, who are still around, going on with their lives. dan inosanto is a jkd instructor in la, and i don't know what linda is doing but im sure she's fine. both of them have said, and recalled, how the fight went, and that both where present along with brother lee.(not bruce, i mean his bro)
now.
when someone loses a competition, they usually are ashamed for losing. now, in the case of a chinese man, losing a fight, his reputation is ruined for life. he no longer has any students, or followers. but, to keep the reputation, one may tell a little white lie. not a huge one, not something like "i kicked his ass!"
but more like, "eh...he fought..i fought....nobody won...." that way they don't attract too much attention to themselves. but the keep their reputation.
now
linda and dan are both doing great right now. i have heard nothing from wong jak man in years. i have no clue what he was doing, and the last i heard, he was a waiter at a chinese resturaunt.
an old man telling tales to keep his credibility is not unheard of
what you say may be true, and linda has been known to act strangely at times, but, let's look at the respect of the people we are looking at here.

if you are right, then i stand corrected
if not, then...i stand correct i guess

For Info on WOng Jack Man Just look it up. he is one of the most respected martial artists to date. As for Linda like I have said she has every reason to lie regardless of what kind of person she is, she has obvioulsy done it before. As for Inasanto even though I have never heard him say he was there, I still dont believe he said Bruce won because he has been honest about Bruce's faults in the past. The statements I made in reason one, just referred to Linda's efforts in Dragon to deify Bruce, many of his former students not only his family disagreed on how he was portrayed in the movie, not to mention the facts.
All im saying if you really research the topic of this fight like i have, you will find out that the general consensus was that Bruce did not get that far in learning Wing Chun at that time, and thats why he could not penetrate the more experienced Wong Jack Man. He realized that and felt as if he needed to learn more. This is not when he created JKD, which Linda insists. If you read his tru bio accounted by other people around him, it was his attempt returning to China to try to learn more Wing Chun, and have it recorded, that ended up in him following his own style. His master Yip Man refused, him and Bruce then bribed him severing their relationship. He returned to America officially creating his own martial art form. This story is confirmed by Yip Man's students, not to mention Bruce Lee's brothers, as well as James Lee who was not Bruce's brother but his best friend by the way.

[m.artist]

i'll look it up
but it's just strange though that in every bruce lee bio i have read, or just about anything on him, when it talks about that fight,....eh...who cares...
i'll do a lil more research then
thx for the info

[seany85]

http://martialarts.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.kungfu.net/brucelee.html

I was referred to this article from this site.
Have a read and see what you think.

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=cache:mf31tn8EN0gJ:martialarts.about.com/b/a/011143.htm+Wong+Jack+Man+&hl=en

[m.artist]

it's strange
i went to a few websites, including the most famous bruce lee site(divinewind)
and alot of these places say that bruce won by what linda describes, but none of them say that dan was there
maybe we were both right

[sean carter]

it's strange
i went to a few websites, including the most famous bruce lee site(divinewind)
and alot of these places say that bruce won by what linda describes, but none of them say that dan was there
maybe we were both right

As a die hard Bruce fan since age 9 i wanted to believe he was the best. But from what Ive learned he merely was an amazing athlete and person. I also learned that Bruce was a tough guy and always had been a bully since he was a young kid. He could also never except losing or failing at anything. A good example is of how his brother try to teach him to play the guitar and how Bruce after 20 minutes almost broke it by throwin it on the floor. I dont believe Wong Jack MAn defeated Bruce, but I have been skeptical about the Potrayal of the fight in Dragon since it came out. The articles you have sent me are where I originally stumbled onto the truth. If I find the articles that talk more about the people who surrounded the issue and the people involved, they shed light on what happened, and why Linda, and people like her are saying what they are saying. Bruce's life and death have been covered up in similar ways, this is why his brothers, and many others are now coming out with publications. Found it: http://www.lakungfu.com/sifujackmanwong.html

[konghan]

Me too am a big fan of Bruce Lee in fact I`ve watch his movies The Way of the Dragon, Fist of Fury & The Big Boss several times during the 70`s.

But character wise, Bruce is too cocky, too much pride, & too much self confidence in himself. I think he was struggling in some kind of psychological trauma from being discriminated on in hollywood. That he was force to go to Hong Kong to seek his fortune & fame.

From what I have read & seen in film about his life I say, he is a rebel against his own heritage, struggling to fit into the mainstream " white america" but couldnot get accepted that has cause him to fight everything about "chinese tradition", in other words he blames the chinese tradition or himself of being a chinese struggling against hollywood.

Bruce want to be a proud chinese but at the same time he wanted america to be chinese.

Chinese at that time were stereotype as a bunch of laundry people & driving rigshaw with that slid eye & big two front tooth, that`s how hollywood & most of the world view the chinese people. And Bruce want to change that and thanks to him he did succeeded and that is the only best thing about him.

[sean carter]

Me too am a big fan of Bruce Lee in fact I`ve watch his movies The Way of the Dragon, Fist of Fury & The Big Boss several times during the 70`s.

But character wise, Bruce is too cocky, too much pride, & too much self confidence in himself. I think he was struggling in some kind of psychological trauma from being discriminated on in hollywood. That he was force to go to Hong Kong to seek his fortune & fame.

From what I have read & seen in film about his life I say, he is a rebel against his own heritage, struggling to fit into the mainstream " white america" but couldnot get accepted that has cause him to fight everything about "chinese tradition", in other words he blames the chinese tradition or himself of being a chinese struggling against hollywood.

Bruce want to be a proud chinese but at the same time he wanted america to be chinese.

Chinese at that time were stereotype as a bunch of laundry people & driving rigshaw with that slid eye & big two front tooth, that`s how hollywood & most of the world view the chinese people. And Bruce want to change that and thanks to him he did succeeded and that is the only best thing about him.

I agree, and I would like to say one thing. I feel Bruce suffered from two things, evolution of time and and stardom. When he left America during the sixties he did not realize, the state the country was in. Regardless of war, it was a mulitcultural time, a time where he would have had a lot of freedom doing movies if he found the right people with money, mainly hippies, beatnicks, and revolutionaries. It wasn't til 2 or 3 years doing so called B movies in China, that he caught on to this, and how much because of the change in time and view,and how marketable he now was. So he went from a stage of being frustrated and distraut to almost immediate superstardom. Not to mention how crazy it was for him in China. So he went from a point where he was starvin himself, taking back pills, and having ridiculous amounts of stress, to a point where he could now have a way to get what he wants, he would just have to grab it. This added more anxiety, which was controled by weed, and some times supressed by drinking saki. But lets not forget about his failing relationship with Linda, and his constantly having to watch Raymond chow pocketing his money, and people following him, his other women, and the media as well. Bruce could not take it, because the world was moving to fast, and he was out of control.
And what is sad is no one helped him, but they all say that he wouldnt let anyone near them as an excuse.

[m.artist]

I agree, and I would like to say one thing. I feel Bruce suffered from two things, evolution of time and and stardom. When he left America during the sixties he did not realize, the state the country was in. Regardless of war, it was a mulitcultural time, a time where he would have had a lot of freedom doing movies if he found the right people with money, mainly hippies, beatnicks, and revolutionaries. It wasn't til 2 or 3 years doing so called B movies in China, that he caught on to this, and how much because of the change in time and view,and how marketable he now was. So he went from a stage of being frustrated and distraut to almost immediate superstardom. Not to mention how crazy it was for him in China. So he went from a point where he was starvin himself, taking back pills, and having ridiculous amounts of stress, to a point where he could now have a way to get what he wants, he would just have to grab it. This added more anxiety, which was controled by weed, and some times supressed by drinking saki. But lets not forget about his failing relationship with Linda, and his constantly having to watch Raymond chow pocketing his money, and people following him, his other women, and the media as well. Bruce could not take it, because the world was moving to fast, and he was out of control.
And what is sad is no one helped him, but they all say that he wouldnt let anyone near them as an excuse.

true true true
adn the sad thing was it was a bad excuse at that
if your friends then you help
end of disscusion.

[konghan]

The problem is, I think Bruce didnot want any help he was too proud of a man. In fact I was suprised when I saw the movie Enter the Dragon, Bruce physique look bad to me. He lost a lot of weight, his chick bone is too visible. Compare his earlier physique in movies like The Way of the Dragon & Fist of Fury he looks very healthy.

Even with Bruce success in Hong Kong he was still not satisfied he seem to have an inside grude of vendictiveness against hollywood.

And his unending quest to try to discover the perfect fighting system, which he failed to realize is, that there is none. This would eventually led to his own death.

[sean carter]

The problem is, I think Bruce didnot want any help he was too proud of a man. In fact I was suprised when I saw the movie Enter the Dragon, Bruce physique look bad to me. He lost a lot of weight, his chick bone is too visible. Compare his earlier physique in movies like The Way of the Dragon & Fist of Fury he looks very healthy.

Even with Bruce success in Hong Kong he was still not satisfied he seem to have an inside grude of vendictiveness against hollywood.

And his unending quest to try to discover the perfect fighting system, which he failed to realize is, that there is none. This would eventually led to his own death.

Yeah thats what they say, he didn't trust anyone, but I dont think thats an excuse a friend or family member could give. There were too many of his Chinese friends saying after the fact that they told him he looked sick and etc... I just dont see the real effort to stop him from killing himself. Bobwall says that Linda used to bake him Hash cookies, so see must have seen the stress. I feel there must have been some distance between the two because of his philandering which is understandable. Not to mention those people who he spent his night life with. In the end you really have to asked what people felt for him in general. I have heard because Raymond Chow was at almost every instance Bruce fell sick especially the major one when he fell comatose, he could definetely be considered liable and very aware of Bruce's health. Some say his lifestyle was encouraged by Chow. He was quoted after his death as saying "Bruce was a very sick Man", and also "he was always using other people's drugs".