Defendo

[Jun Fan]

Just curious what people think of/know about the Defendo combat system (be it the Fairburn system now carried by the Wolf brothers, or the late Bill Underwood's 'British Jujitsu'). I go to this site (www.defendo.com) regularly and it' a fantastic site, but I'd love to hear the opinions of anyone who has any of their videos or even better trained with them in person.
Thanks in advance for any repsonses...

[m.artist]

i have watched some ov the vid and i think it's pretty legit...i liked it...i think the guy kicks ass. and i don't think there is any reason why someone shouldn't try it

[eXcessiveForce]

one of my instructors is trained in Defendo under Charlie Clark. It is a system were right hits right and left hits left. The small group that have trained in it here view it as somewhat primitive.

[eXcessiveForce]

I found Krav to be somewhat lacking, With the stance structure a bit to wide and forward. It has a few good points but for the most part I was unimpressed.

[IPON]

I found Krav to be somewhat lacking, With the stance structure a bit to wide and forward. It has a few good points but for the most part I was unimpressed.

I agree completely

[RapidAssault16]

Defendo

I really like the Defendo system. I have a copy of Fairbairn's "Get Tough" and I've found the techniques to be very useful. The chin jab, axe hand, gun disarms, and boot kicking techniques are among the most functional techniques I've found. They fit right in with my Filipino Arnis training. The moves are easy, natural, and quick to learn. The system, in and of itself, isn't the end-all-be-all of H2H. But when combined with an aggressive, never-say-die mindset, it's your best friend in a combat situation.

[Ha_ari]

I found Krav to be somewhat lacking, With the stance structure a bit to wide and forward. It has a few good points but for the most part I was unimpressed.

I've trained KM for over a year, and I'll say I think it's pretty amazing. I'm not sure what you mean by the stance being too wide; that sounds like a problem with the individual experience you had. I've found the stance to be extremely well-balanced; it's a basic Thai boxing stance, except KM eliminates all blading completely. When you square up completely I think you GAIN balance, though you make yourself a larger target.

To each their own, and KM is not for everyone, but I'm curious as to exactly what you found unimpressive about it.

[eXcessiveForce]

When you square up you lose your centerline. It would work well with a flack jacket on and equipment but for self defense it is too forward facing.

The arm locks were less effective the way they were done than they way I already had been taught in other systems. Often the lock was changed in a way to reduce pressure instead of increase it.

The instant on instant off aggression of KM isn't bad. I just didn't see much that added to what I already knew.

But that's just me. Others may find it to be a wonderful system for them.

[Maxetai]

Which Defendo?

Which is the real Defendo?
This one: (William Fairbairn to Bill Wolfe) http://www.defendo.com ?

Or this one: (Bill Underwood to Mike Mandel) http://www.defendo.ca ?

Can someone please explain (a little thoroughly)?
Thanks

[m.artist]

it's the dot com one

[Maxetai]

it's the dot com one

Why? Please elaborate!

This quote is from the dot ca one: http://www.defendo.ca/faq.htm

Common Point of Confusion: I thought “Defendo” was William Fairbairn’s system…”

At some point since Bill Underwood’s death in 1986, there are those who began to refer to modern day representations of William Fairbairn’s “Defendu” or “Close Quarter Combat” as “Defendo”. It is not remotely our desire to criticize any of the very credible and experienced individuals and schools who may hold to this line of thinking. Many of these are wonderfully capable, masters of their craft and have made tremendous contributions to the Close Quarter Combat world in recent years. They have our full respect and support.

The record, however, needs to be set straight and it is time that Bill Underwood receives the credit that he deserves.

Bill Underwood was the original creator and has the legitimate right to the name “Defendo”. William Fairbairn’s original system, which was developed in the 1920’s while he was employed by the Shanghai Municipal Police Department, was called “Defendu”. At no point did Fairbairn ever change the name of his system from “Defendu” to “Defendo” as some would claim. When the Second World War broke out and Fairbairn was commissioned to instruct Allied Special Forces in 1940, he developed and taught “Close Quarter Combat”. At Allied Forces STS103 (Camp X) in Whitby, Ontario, Canada, Fairbairn taught a combat course called “Silent Killing”. If Fairbairn’s system was ever referred to as “Defendo” it was in the context of a slang, making reference to hand-to-hand combat techniques in general. (Ahhh… Doing a little “Defendo” today, were ya boys????”)

Fairbairn also did not “pre-date” Bill Underwood. In fact, Underwood was developing Combato as a unique system from approx. 1908 and onward in WWI while Fairbairn’s system was not fully developed and coined “Defendu” until 1926.

Bill Underwood changed the name of his system from “Combato” to “Defendo” in 1945 when he began to engage in his first civilian “post-war” trainings in New Jersey, U.S.A. He then went on to copyright 2 books, “Defendo, Police System of Self-Defense” in 1950 and “Defendo, The Occidental System (Western) of Self-Protection in 1969. From 1945 onward, Defendo was well documented as being Bill Underwood’s system by way of providing instruction for Law Enforcement, Intelligence Groups, the security sector and the general public in North America and various other places in the world. This was further reinforced by public demonstrations, newspaper and magazine articles, radio spots and television appearances from the 1960’s through to his death in the mid 1980’s. Bill Underwood Incorporated “Defendo International Inc.” in March of 1981 in Ontario, Canada and instructed at many locations under that corporate umbrella.

Our desire is merely to preserve Bill Underwood’s accomplishments so that his legacy may live on. Should any desire to dispute the aforementioned facts, we respectfully offer an open challenge to anyone, anywhere, at any time…. to prove us incorrect.

[Jun Fan]

That is the official story.
Fairburn's original system was called 'Defendu', Underwood's was originally coined 'Combato'.
Underwood changed his system to 'Defendo' in the mid 40's, way before the Fairburn system was given the same name.
In terms of which is the 'real' Defendo, Underwood's system was given that name first, but there's very little in a name.
The Defendo now carried by the Wolf Brother's is better known thanks to their instructional videos, and has been rated 'The World's no.1 self-defence system' (how this is decided I've no idea). Their system seems more all round striking, control, grappling etc. Underwood's has been nick named 'British Jujitsu', and consists of techniques within a triad of grips, leverages and pressure points, designed to bring about a world of pain.
I'd love to train under either of these systems to be honest, and I'd be very interested in hearing from anyone who has first hand experience in either....