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catch as catch can wrestling or bjj

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  • #16
    You guys have made the misconseption that I don't train wrestling, or other styles of submission aside from BJJ. I own 3 Black Belts with stripes, and have studied in over 15 styles of Martial Arts. My 2nd student ever (still training 4 times a week with me) is an ex-wrestling coach for Texas State. He is also a Black Belt in Judo. And is a Black belt in Hapkido. I have trained with him for the last 5 & 1/2 years. His is 205-235lbs. He is a contractor & a goat farmer. Imagine if this animal got a hold of you! He would probably pull each person on this threads arms off after he brutally slammed you with a mean takedown. I also train with Daniel Moraes his wrestling is really good, he has been at my house since the Arnolds & will be here till the Pan-Ams. I also go to Brazil to train @ his facilities down there. He has had more private lessons with Darrell Gholar than anyone else in Brazil. Oh & he brought his little brother with that is an excellent wrestler that trains with Gholar as well. So don't think I don't wrestle. And since Master Relson Gracie has made this possible for me I would pretty much consider it as part of my Jiu-Jitsu training. I don't train BJJ as much as I train under Relson, their is a big differance between sport Jiu-Jitsu & Relson's teachings. They are not just limited to sport by any means. Relson doesn't suggest pulling guard in street fights FYI. Just because I have won matches from my guard does not mean I don't win other matches from other positions. Some times it's just SO easy to win in a couple seconds this way & I have taken the easiest path to the submission. You obviously don't know much about Relson or his particular style of grappling because you are claiming that cacc has more submissions than Relson Gracie Jiu-Jitsu. Once you guys implied this I know offically you are out of your mind. Relson is one of the meanest grapplers in the world. He knows more dirty submissions than I could have ever imagined, (all he does is bend people up and make them tap). How much time have you guys taken to learn about his style? Do you think he has not been exposed to just about every way to twist some one up? Remember all he has done his whole life is fight & teach. The human body can only be twisted in so many ways.
    I asked you guy before "Do you have any video footage of catch wrestlers beating up good Jiu-Jitsu Instructors? Does this happen on a regular basis?" - why can't you guys answer this? Can you tell me of any good catch wrestlers that have beaten some top competitors? Do you actually think a catch wrestler could walk into Relson's or Carlson's (both are located in the USA) with out getting their asses handed to them? Can you come up with a catch wrestler that is willing to beat up a Jiu-Jitsu light weight? I am game & travel around the world to compete. Where do you guys train? What type of competition records do you have? What level do you compete at? Do you hold any rank in any styles? Can you produce the name of any large grappling event where a cacc rep. has won? I have won many tournaments by applying the teachings passed down form my Instructor. Can you guys make this claim? jubaji- you might not like it but you need to come to terms with the fact the MATT FUREY is your poster boy. 90% of grapplers think of Matt Furey when they think of Catch, so you really have no room to talk about looking cool. FYI I don't require mats to fight, I have been in many fights & even not so friendly grappling matches on concrete so don't talk to me about needing rings or mats. I am prior Marine Corps (and trained & competed while in) Marines are dense & like to question if some sissy wrestling would actually work on them. Many matches happened over concrete or metal. I think you need to go back & read the first post on this thread, you talk about cacc being more effective in the ring. If catch is so effective can you guys prove it?

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    • #17
      another way of looking at that is, can you prove that catch is not that effective?

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      • #18
        The results from all the large grappling tounaments in the world are missing catch wrestlers in their winning ranks. Check the results. If they could win, be famous & get paid they would. How come each of you don't answer my questions above on this thread?

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        • #19
          hi
          maybe i am climbing that cacc has more submissions than bjj from what i see, who knows maybe relsons gracie jiu-jitsu has the same or more, who knows, but from what i see, and i am speaking about bjj in GENERAL terms!!! catch as catch can wrestling has more submisson but i repeat it is just from what i see!!!!, but one thing is that you are climbing that your jiu-jitsu is the best that relson gracie jiu jitsu is perfect and man, you just told me that you train to with wrestler etc.... so you jiu-jitsu is not a perfect grappling style because you just tell me that you mixed with other grappling styles to be more complete, and i just was telling you that catch offers you great takedowns and great ground game!!!!!!!
          i am glad to see that you train several things to be better i do the same!!!!!!, maybe you are a great fighter and of course your teacher is fucking good!!!!!!!!!and jiu-jitsu is fucking good, but again and again is overated, even if you jiu-jitsu is so great why do you train wrestling????????????
          maybe a catch wrestler don´t have the need to learn jiu-jitsu!!!maybe!!!!maybe yes
          just this
          but i say again i train jiu-jitsu between other martial arts and i love that has an incredible ground grappling game , but who knows maybe catch is another choice that we have there and we are so blind to see that!!!!!!!it is just my opinion.

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          • #20
            Wrestling is part of Jiu-Jitsu, I don't really have the time to explain it to you in deatail, but please do yourself a favor, give Relson a call, 808-589-2524, I train wrestling with Relson & his Son Rhalan @ their house, at the academies, & even at the beach, it part of his life, he is better at expalining this. Right now I think you are very confused. Maybe you need a trip out to the Hawaiian Islands to go train some Jiu-Jitsu with Relson. I think you would be a much more agreeable person after this. You could go out there & "catch" Relson. I am sure he is open to the idea & would enjoy the occasion. I am getting ready for the Pan-Ams & need all the sleep I can get, I have the current light weight Jiu-Jitsu Black Belt World Champ kicking my ass 1st thing in the morning & have not slept enough lately. I got done training a bunch today, ate a bunch & now thier is really one other thing I do, sleep, time to do that. To get back on the mats early.

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            • #21
              re

              bjj is like a cult to some guys. Its very sad to see a mind so inflexible.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by GRACIEAUSTIN
                jubaji- you might not like it but you need to come to terms with the fact the MATT FUREY is your poster boy. 90% of grapplers think of Matt Furey when they think of Catch, so you really have no room to talk about looking cool. FYI I don't require mats to fight, I have been in many fights & even not so friendly grappling matches on concrete so don't talk to me about needing rings or mats.
                Forgive me for not taking notice of this bullshit earlier.

                Actually, I don't have any posters, and have never studied Catch as Catch Can. Your all-too-desperate attempts to paint yourself as a tough character are pretty transparent, you panty-wearing puff.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by GRACIEAUSTIN
                  I don't really have the time to explain it to you in deatail,
                  Doesn't that work out well?

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                  • #24
                    I have accomplished these wins with a 98% submission rate:

                    2003-1 st Advanced to 4 th round @ the Mundials by submissions in the purple belt lt. wt.

                    2003-1st 12 th Annual Relson Gracie International Purple Belt middle weight Div.

                    2003-1st 12 th Annual Relson Gracie Internationals Advanced No Gi div.

                    2003-1 st Relson Gracie Nationals Purple Belt Light Lt. Wt. Div.

                    2003-1 st Finisher Cup Middle Wt. Tournament

                    2003-1 st RCJ Machado TX BJJ Open Advanced Gi Division Lt. Wt.

                    2002-1st Renegades Extreme Fights Light Weight Tournament

                    2002-North American Abu Dhabi Qualifiers Competitor

                    2002-1st Central TX Slam Light Wt. Gi

                    2002-1st Central TX Slam Light Wt. No Gi

                    2002-1st Central TX Slam Open Class

                    2002-World Fighting Championship Winner El Paso TX

                    2002-World Fighting Championship Winner San Antonio TX

                    2002-1st Southwest Submission Championship Lt. wt. Advanced

                    2002-1st Pacific Rims Amateur No-Gi Division

                    2002-1st Pacific Rims Blue Belt Division

                    2002–1st Sport fighting USA, W. S. W. F. Championships Absolute Div.

                    2002-3rd Pan-American Blue Belt Light Weight Division

                    2002-1st Texas Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Open Blue Belt Light Weight

                    2002-2nd Texas Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Open Purple Belt Light Weight

                    2002-1st Gracie Worlds Amateur No Gi Light Weight division

                    2002-1st Gracie Worlds Blue Belt Light Weight division

                    2002-1st S.W. Submission Grappling Championships Adv. Light Wt. Gi

                    2002-1st Texas Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Open Blue Belt Light Weight

                    2002-2nd Southwestern Submission Grappling Championship 8 man

                    2002-2nd Texas Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Open Purple Belt middleweight

                    2001-1st Gracie 10th International Blue Belt Light and Open Weight

                    2001-1st Texas Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Cup Advanced Light Weight

                    2001-1st Texas City Extreme Fights Winner

                    2001-2nd Renegades Extreme fights Middle Weight Division

                    2001-2nd Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Nationals Blue Belt Light Weight

                    2000-1st Big D (Texas State Champ) Light Weight Advanced Division

                    1999-1st Bell County Expo. Pro-Am Tournament

                    1999-2nd Midwestern Grappling Challenge Advance Division

                    1999-2nd "Battle at the Beach" Advanced Middle Weight Fights

                    1999-2nd "Battle at the Beach" Jiu-Jitsu Advanced Middle Weight

                    1998-2nd Gracie Hawaii In-House Tournament Light Weight Advanced

                    1998-Pan-American Jiu-Jitsu Games Competitor

                    I also tapped out by armbar a World Champ Black Belt in competition. That's the part that made me the panty puff huh. Pretty funny you have had pretty much every point blown out of the water and can't answer my questions so you resort to name calling. Talk is CHEAP! Specially on the internet. Because of my personal accomplishments and the FACT that no catch wrestlers have won ANY major tournamnets in the last 3 years (if they had you would have said something by now) I would like to think I am qualified to suggest cacc is not as effective as BJJ. I also asked WAY ealier for you to find a catch wrestler to grapple me (the best way to find out where you stand against a style or competeitor) by you guys didn't touch that offer with a ten foot stick. How come you guys don't answer any of my questions that I have posted previously on this thread? " I asked you guy before "Do you have any video footage of catch wrestlers beating up good Jiu-Jitsu Instructors? Does this happen on a regular basis?" - why can't you guys answer this? Can you tell me of any good catch wrestlers that have beaten some top competitors? Do you actually think a catch wrestler could walk into Relson's or Carlson's (both are located in the USA) with out getting their asses handed to them? Can you come up with a catch wrestler that is willing to beat up a Jiu-Jitsu light weight? I am game & travel around the world to compete. Where do you guys train? What type of competition records do you have? What level do you compete at? Do you hold any rank in any styles? Can you produce the name of any large grappling event where a cacc rep. has won? " I think if some one was able to win huge events, get paid money to grapple & be famous they would. Where are the cacc wrestlers in these ranks? Who's in the cult? Who's mind is easy to shape? I don't claim to be a tough guy, I get humbled each day on the mats training (specially while the World Champ is here in town helping me get ready for the Pan-Ams) but I do know what works because I have been to more tournaments than most people in the world & pay attention to who wins & what works. I am also sure I could pull each of your arms off and any catch wreslter you find. Then we could talk about what's more effective. I think that grappling & competition proves things not talking on the internet.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by GRACIEAUSTIN
                      I don't claim to be a tough guy,the World Champ is here in town helping me get ready for the Pan-Ams I do know what works because I have been to more tournaments than most people in the world & pay attention to who wins & what works. I am also sure I could pull each of your arms off and any catch wreslter you find. Then we could talk about what's more effective. .
                      No, that doesn't sound like claiming to be a tough guy.

                      You ought to claim the title of world champion a-hole!

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                      • #26
                        Why because I shot all your points out of the water & put some questions out there that you have no answer for? Truth hurts, but you must remember this forum IS about fighting, people that don't fight get mad when fighters suggest to fight, this is not Mary Kay, it is a fighting forum, you guys are talking about grappling right? I offered my time to do some grappling & you get all bent out of shape. Man I grapple against people everyday, that's what grapplers do. You guys are about talk not action. If asking for REAL PROOF makes me an a-hole so be it. Sorry for trying to find out what works through training & competeing, not just talking. Boy what was I thinking? Once again how come you guys can't answer my questions that I posted above?

                        "Do you have any video footage of catch wrestlers beating up good Jiu-Jitsu Instructors? Does this happen on a regular basis?" - why can't you guys answer this? Can you tell me of any good catch wrestlers that have beaten some top competitors? Do you actually think a catch wrestler could walk into Relson's or Carlson's (both are located in the USA) with out getting their asses handed to them? Can you come up with a catch wrestler that is willing to beat up a Jiu-Jitsu light weight? I am game & travel around the world to compete. Where do you guys train? What type of competition records do you have? What level do you compete at? Do you hold any rank in any styles? Can you produce the name of any large grappling event where a cacc rep. has won? " I think if some one was able to win huge events, get paid money to grapple & be famous they would. Where are the cacc wrestlers in these ranks? "

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by GRACIEAUSTIN
                          Why because I shot all your points out of the water & put some questions out there that you have no answer for? Truth hurts, but you must remember this forum IS about fighting, people that don't fight get mad when fighters suggest to fight, this is not Mary Kay, it is a fighting forum, you guys are talking about grappling right? I offered my time to do some grappling & you get all bent out of shape. Man I grapple against people everyday, that's what grapplers do. You guys are about talk not action. If asking for REAL PROOF makes me an a-hole so be it. Sorry for trying to find out what works through training & competeing, not just talking. Boy what was I thinking? Once again how come you guys can't answer my questions that I posted above?
                          Who are you addressing this to? For myself, I have made no point other than that you are a self-absorbed numbskull.

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                          • #28
                            I'll just consider the source on that one. Once you actually accomplish something in the Martial Arts community your opinion might matter. Till then you are just another internet troll (that my students could chew up & spit out with ease). I was addressing my comments to the people that are posting about cacc. I have read each of your posts on the forum. WOW you have contributed lots man, good job, by I am really glad you can tell that Gracie Austin guys what's up.

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                            • #29
                              Personally i believe that BJJ is just a craze at the moment, give it time and there will be a new one long. Just like at the changes which has occured already how Judo was the dominant martial art back in the 60's how karate and Kung Fu became more dominant in the 70's and leading to the 'invention' of JKD ,Ufc's ,Nhb etc.

                              Also Bjj is a form of wrestling, and so is Catch, and both use same basics and principles. Its like saying Muay Boran is better then another form of Muay Thai.

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                              • #30
                                HI,
                                please excuse my ignorance but what is the difference between 'Catch' & 'Submission' wrestling?
                                Also what kind of wrestling style(s) do people like Matt Hughes,Dan Severen(?),Genki Sudo,Leigh Remeidos use as they all seem quite capable fighters.


                                Cheers Jez

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