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So you think BJJ is effective for street self defense?

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  • Originally posted by Uke

    And putting a man on the ground doesn't relinquish control of him. .

    So you feel maintaining control is important? Good.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Uke
      but they don't immediately dive to the ground .


      This is right up there with "charge from 8 feet away" in your highly-informed collection of statements.

      Comment


      • jubaji

        Originally posted by jubaji
        This is right up there with "charge from 8 feet away" in your highly-informed collection of statements.
        At no point did I say that control wasn't important, so why was it so important that you felt the need to accuse or imply that I did? Are you that lost?

        And by saying that anti-grappling doesn't exist, you again show just how clueless you are. All anti-grappling does is focus on preventing being taken to the ground, whether you use strikes, sprawls or throws to do it. There is no one anti-grappling art, just thinking martial artists who realize the importance of not getting involved in ground bouts, so they've begun to put more focus on preventing them, and not being proficient at them. Many self defense systems have begun doing this now that the "Gracie phenomena" has worn off.

        And if the box you train in is so small that you could write " Yeah, 'cause it doesn't exist", then my suggestion is get out in the world and learn more than what's available in your neck of the woods.

        And the next time you decide to highlight something that someone has written, why not try offering more than childish remarks and put in some points? People who play devil's advocate from the sidelines usually do so because they know they have no business on stage of show and prove.

        Comment


        • Uke,

          Somewhat rhetorically you asked when the last time I've seen someone thrown in NHB fighting was.... well last I can think of was Fedor being chucked onto his head by.... oh who was it... anyway fedor subbed him right after but there are throws.

          In response to that though I think you see less "throws" and more, pulling down, or slamming... because there is no gi, wrestlers already have no gi, so in a no gi situation it seems the wrestlers tactics of taking you down would be better. I'm not aware of how well a Judoka can throw without the gi, pretty damn good I would assume, but without anything to grab, they do lose alot of their game, just like BJJ guys lose alot of their game when they have no gi.

          Possibly thats why you dont see any throws?...

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Uke
            And the next time you decide to highlight something that someone has written, why not try offering more than childish remarks and put in some points? People who play devil's advocate from the sidelines usually do so because they know they have no business on stage of show and prove.
            Your underlying premise:

            BJJ's strategy of taking a fight to the ground, while effective in duals or sporting arrangements, is ineffective against multiple attackers and against weapons.

            Your evidence:

            You've got your man in your guard, he's got a marker (to simulate cutting) and his buddies are 100 yards or less and running in.

            Cut & dry (no pun intended)

            You've got a good point, because most of BJJ training is done without weapons and rarely with multiples. But your spikey attitude alienates people. However, you can't discount a talented fighter with the ability to get dirty. Not saying anyone is at any given time, but its also a function of the individual.

            You attract more flies with honey than you do vinegar.

            And if anyone asks, a fetus told you so....


            ....continue with those stories about how the Flintstones used to live,
            daddy-o.

            Comment


            • SamuraiGuy

              Originally posted by SamuraiGuy
              Uke,

              Somewhat rhetorically you asked when the last time I've seen someone thrown in NHB fighting was.... well last I can think of was Fedor being chucked onto his head by.... oh who was it... anyway fedor subbed him right after but there are throws.

              In response to that though I think you see less "throws" and more, pulling down, or slamming... because there is no gi, wrestlers already have no gi, so in a no gi situation it seems the wrestlers tactics of taking you down would be better. I'm not aware of how well a Judoka can throw without the gi, pretty damn good I would assume, but without anything to grab, they do lose alot of their game, just like BJJ guys lose alot of their game when they have no gi.

              Possibly thats why you dont see any throws?...
              There was nothing rhetorical about what I asked. It wasn't for effect my friend, it was a question.

              Also, if you think that practicing with no gi brings you a step closer to reality, you must live by the beach where everyone is wearing bikinis. And even though you don't remember who it was that threw Fedor or what kind of throw it was, it doesn't matter. Its an exception, not the rule. If out of the hundreds of BJJ matches we've seen, you can only name one fight that you THINK a judo throw may have been used by a guy you cannot remember, then its definitely the exception.

              Comment


              • Tom Yum

                Originally posted by Tom Yum
                Your underlying premise:

                BJJ's strategy of taking a fight to the ground, while effective in duals or sporting arrangements, is ineffective against multiple attackers and against weapons.

                Your evidence:

                You've got your man in your guard, he's got a marker (to simulate cutting) and his buddies are 100 yards or less and running in.

                Cut & dry (no pun intended)

                You've got a good point, because most of BJJ training is done without weapons and rarely with multiples. But your spikey attitude alienates people. However, you can't discount a talented fighter with the ability to get dirty. Not saying anyone is at any given time, but its also a function of the individual.

                You attract more flies with honey than you do vinegar.

                And if anyone asks, a fetus told you so....


                ....continue with those stories about how the Flintstones used to live,
                daddy-o.
                You might have a point, Tom Yum. My attitude may alienate people, but not intentionally. Besides, I am not here to gain a following. Your post, for the most part, agrees with what I have been saying. So if you believe what I said to be true and you feel that you are more diplomatic that I am, then maybe you should should be writing the same messages here for those who can only receive information through sensative and caring dialogue.

                Whether you or anyone else here will admit it, no one here who worships BJJ will accept or even consider what I have written, even if I had written it in a Hallmark card. The only way people will challenge their own beliefs is when what they believe in fails, which is why I gave an exercise that people could try on their own. I never asked anyone to take my word for a thing. I simply asked BJJ fans to put themselves in their most common defensive position and work the scenario. And the most common response I got from BJJ fans: They said that I only ASSUMED that they would go to the guard like they do in nearly every BJJ/NHB match you can find to watch. Which is why no one responded when I asked how many fights/matches they've won on their feet.

                But your point was made, Tom Yum.

                Lastly, I am interested in reading about this rare BJJ multiple attack and weapon training that you wrote about. Because to date, the only approach that I've seen that BJJ has shown concerning weapons and multiple attackers is on the early Gracie Tapes. And if anyone would be willing to teach their students to defend themselves like that, then my God I hope they all carry guns.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Uke
                  At no point did I say that control wasn't important, so why was it so important that you felt the need to accuse or imply that I did?

                  Your disparaging remarks about following an opponent down with a takedown, since the purpose of doing so is control, incdicated that you didn't understand how important it is. Or, as I suspect the case to be, you are just a fuckin' moron.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Uke
                    All anti-grappling does is .

                    ...is fool stand-up fighters into believing there is some 'trick' or shortcut that can enable them to avoid learning to grapple. A nice marketing tool for those looking to milk a few extra bucks out of lazy dojo-darlings.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Uke
                      And if the box you train in is so small that you could write " Yeah, 'cause it doesn't exist", then my suggestion is get out in the world and learn more than what's available in your neck of the woods.

                      Nice try, chump. I think I've seen a fair amount of the woods.

                      Comment


                      • jubaji, another fan of mine

                        Thanks for your comments.

                        All the cute cartoons won't change the fact that more and more people are waking up and agreeing on what has been discussed here. Its obvious that fact causes you great pain, which is peculiar because no one has made any personal assaults towards you.

                        A real martial artist trains hard, and goes out in the world beyond what he has learned to see if what he has dedicated himself to will work. You, like some others here, are satisfied taking the word of someone else that what you do will work outside training in the safety of your school. That's not a martial artist, that's Stan from the Eminem video, meaning you're not the real thing but are content to seem like it because you have the company of so many who do the same.

                        I'm not going to waste time arguing with you off-topic when there are many more knowledgable and experienced forum members here who actually have something of value to say about the discussion at hand. I may have even mistaken you for having some knowledge, but when you wrote that going to the ground is the only way to control someone there, I knew I was dealing with a beginner.

                        Enjoy you tantrums.

                        Comment


                        • RE: jubaji, another fan of mine

                          My pleasure. Perhaps there are a few exceptions.I think you mean "it's" or "it is" not "its". Not obvious to me.
                          How old are you?
                          How old are you?
                          But I like to gossip.Please correct my mistake. What is a martial artist that is Stan from the Eminem video meaning you are not the real thing but are content to seem like it because you have the company of so many who do the same ?Where will you go instead?Would you recommend this action to a friend?
                          I do not understand.

                          Comment


                          • Have you ever "worked hard" in your short life, boy? I doubt it.

                            Originally posted by pUke
                            A real martial artist trains hard, and goes out in the world beyond what he has learned to see if what he has dedicated himself to will work. You, like some others here, are satisfied taking the word of someone else that what you do will work outside training in the safety of your school. .

                            hahaaaahahahahaaaa

                            When these silly little bullshit assumptions start showing up, I know your kind has run out of anything else to say.

                            You keep working at it, junior, and maybe in ten more years or so you may manage to see half as much of "the world beyond" as I have. But don't let that get in the way of your feeling good about yourself.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by pUke
                              there are many more knowledgable and experienced forum members here.


                              Compared to you, that would be just about everyone here.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by pUke
                                but when you wrote that going to the ground is the only way to control someone there.

                                Had I written those words, you might have something to argue with. However...



                                Are you stupid, or dishonest? Which is it?

                                Comment

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