In pain / exhausted for 2/3 days after training (supliments/stretches?)

[Reala]

Hello,

I have only just started Martial Arts (Kick Boxing) and however much I enjoy it, I am really feeling the strain. In an hour we must have done around 100 push ups, 100 press ups and 100 squats (in sets of 20), as well as 2/3 minutes shadow boxing about 3/4 times as well as the actual kicking and boxing techniques.

Any ways, where as I just manage to complete the hour long session and that night I feel exhausted, the next day and the day after that I feel as though my arms, legs and chest had been done over with a sledge hammer and as our training is Tue, Wed, Thur I couldn't make it to Wednesday and struggled badly on Thursday.

Just wondering if any body has any tips on suppliments, training techniques or extra stretches / warm downs to reduce this a little. I really enjoy the training and want to attend 3 times a week, but would love to be able to give my all in each session.

Thanks so much and I am enjoying reading the threads on this forum, look foward to an interesting discussion,

Marc.

[sapatiero]

Hi Marc - know the feeling.

Your fitness will increase as your body adapts to the training, but perhaps you could plan light & heavy days? That way you're still getting in the same amount of training, without burning yourself out.

On the off days, I've found that using icepacks on areas that ache/getting a hot bath or massage, and gentle stretching in front of the TV all help. Also, try a little time release ibuprofen before bedtime if your aching muscles are keeping you awake as you need the sleep to recover properly.

If you're hating the idea of training, it's time to take a little break - you can't eat an elephant in one sitting

[Reala]

If you're hating the idea of training, it's time to take a little break - you can't eat an elephant in one sitting

I love the idea of training I actually get more frustrated at myself that I can't train, then dread the training, because I really wanna go in there but can't.

I have heard that a lot of stretching after the workout and taking some 'glutamine' before and after may also help. Thanks for the ice pack idea, gives me and excuse to be lazy and watch a lot of television

[sapatiero]

Yep - the hating training feeling only comes when you ache all over

In terms of supplements, it depends on what you want to achieve...

Lose fat? Try one of the 'safe' metabolism enhancers/fat burners like ephedra, and drop your fat & carbs a little.

Build muscle? You need something that's anti-catabolic/anabolic like creatine/glutamine/whey protein.

Get fitter? Train hard & incorporate stuff like Vit C & echinacha to boost your immune system when you've trained hard.

Either way, a good diet is gonna help too.

Best of luck with it.

[Reala]

Appriciate it sapatiero,

hadn't actually heard of Ephedra... could try it, I am trying to lose about 7/8 pounds, so I am a good weight for running and help me be fitter. THanks for that =)

I have taken Whey Protein for a while now, but deffinetly interested in Glutamine, Creatine I hear can end up making you put on quite a bit of weight quickly? So I may try and keep away from that, I don't wanna put any weight on :P

[treelizard]

Wouldn't recommend ephedra at ALL for this situation. If you MUST, use Mormon tea, which is a little safer than the Chinese stuff... Echinachea isn't an herb you'd want to take all the time, either. There's really no catch-all immune stimulant you can get without looking at a ton of other factors (except maybe green tea). And I wouldn't recommend ANY supplements until you figure out what's going on before throwing in more variables.

How much water are you getting? You should be drinking TONS of water. Stretching (a lot of stretching)--active isolated is my favorite. Take Epsom salt baths. Are you just getting started? Try those three things and then if they don't work...

[Reala]

I am drinking a lot of water now, I wasn't actually allowed to train with my gym for a month, because I had very low water levels.

My water level was 49% and I got told it had to be a minimum of 55%, preferably closer to 65%. Now I am around 60% though =) I am driniing 2-3 litres a day, which is what I was told to drink! (Feels like a lot though).

Stretches are something I wanna give a go, I have seen quite a few books, does anyone have any in mind that are particularly good? Obviously I will also ask my instructor for info, but a book for home use would be good =)

Never heard of the salt, what is that? =)

[treelizard]

Yeah, if you have water issues, DO NOT use ephedra, and do NOT use creatine. You'll want to really look at suggestions like that very closely... and it's okay to drink even more water when you're working out hard.

My favorite is Active Isolated Stretching, though I'd recommend the (boring but very useful) videos over the book. http://www.stretchingusa.com/

Epsom salt...you know what, I take it back, don't use it if you have problems with low water... Let me think on this and get back to you on something better to do... I think maybe I'd recommend using ginger in a bath instead...

[bigred389]

It all depends on relative fitness. Obviously, this is a level of work your body simply isn't used to.

If you're already taking whey protein, I'd have to ask are you taking it immediately AFTER the workout? There's apparently a 2 hr window after exertion where taking whey will help you remove lactic acid buildup in your muscles, meaning you won't be as sore the next day.

I know how you're feeling now. For me, taking whey did the trick. There were days I'd wake up and have so much soreness/pain I couldn't even work/type at full efficiency. After taking whey properly I'd wake up with just a little tightness...barely uncomfortable.

And always stretch out afterwards. It also helps to just "walk it off." For 10 minutes or so. I always do that after hard sprints or anything else leg intensive.

[Reala]

Thanks guys, I don't have 'water issues' I was just not aware I was meant to be drinking so much more water (I was going to the gym and cycling a lot) so obviously that got to me and I was sweating more than I was drinking. My water percentage is fine now =)

I will deffinetly check out Active Isolated Stretching, looks interesting. I will try to walk more after the exercise, although in a way I kind of do anyways because my home is 20 minutes away andstraight after I walk home :P All be it very slowly lol

Ah, I was taking Whey Protein in mornings, lunch and before bed. Guess I should take it like before and after workout? =) Any idea how much I should take? 22g is one dose in 125ml of water at the moment, should I increase that? I think that gives me emmmm, 17g of protein.

[sapatiero]

Yeah, if you have water issues, DO NOT use ephedra, and do NOT use creatine. You'll want to really look at suggestions like that very closely... and it's okay to drink even more water when you're working out hard.

There's going to be plenty of opinions on supplementation. I ran a gym & coached natural bodybuilders for years before starting MA.

Ephedra is a natural version of ephedrine (which many bodybuilders would use as a safer alternative to Beta Antagonists such as clenbuterol, or drugs that affect the putuitary gland). Creatine helps to pull water into the muscle cells & increases the level of creatinine in the bloodstream. It has an anabolic affect, and can be used as a natural alternative to steroids.

My point is, these aren't scary drugs that will screw up your electrolytes or push you into hypoglycemia... These are the type of things that may well help you, and are available in a local health food shop. But (as always) a good diet & plenty of water are the most important thing.

Train hard, fight easy

[treelizard]

HAhaha, sorry, no judgement intended there!! I have "water issues" too because I live in the desert. My point is that if you're exerting a lot of effort to make sure your water levels are okay, it would be self-defeating to soak in salt or take herbs that are dehydrating.

Is this the first or second week you're training? And what's your diet like?

[sapatiero]

Ah, I was taking Whey Protein in mornings, lunch and before bed. Guess I should take it like before and after workout? =) Any idea how much I should take? 22g is one dose in 125ml of water at the moment, should I increase that? I think that gives me emmmm, 17g of protein.

Protein only lasts about 2 hours in your system, after which your body goes into a 'negative nitrogen balance', and is catabolic (ie. breaking down muscle instead of building it - 'anabolic'). So you need to eat quality protein (that includes all the essential amino acids, like whey) every 2 to 3 hours. Your body can't absorb more than 30 gms of protein on one serving, so don't have much more than that.

For weight training, you need a gram of protein per pound of bodyweight per day, so anything approaching this should suffice for 'martial arts muscle maintenance'.

So... Try to every 2-3 hours, with a 25 gms of protein in each meal.

Of course, this stuff isn't so important if you're not too fussed about your lean muscle mass.

[Reala]

Trained 3 sessions,

Thursday, Tuesday, Thursday, next session is Tuesday (2 days). Feeling fine now.

However I missed the Wednesday seassion :P

Diet is not bad, I have lost like 8 pounds in the last 6 weeks, as I am on a relatively low carb, but high protein diet. Eating:

Eggs & Tuna in morning
Lunch varies - probably eggs again
For tea Cod/Haddock with vegetables and sometimes I put a small about of potatoes.
Any thing other then that might be yougurt or something small like that.

That isn't totally acurate as obviously it varies each day, but to give you a rough idea, there you go =)

[sapatiero]

Sounds like you're spot on - just keep doing what you're doing I reckon