MMA fighters their level of hand skills

[jubaji]

You know if an electrician goes to do a job he doesn't bring 1 tool to do it. He brings a whole tool box.

It just seems funny that the guy who brought one tool whooped the ass of the guy who supposedly has a multi dimensional tool box.

I guess knowing how to use a hammer real well is better than being a putz with all the expensive equipment.

Don't start bashing TMA!

[kingoftheforest]

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More comments from the penis...ooops I mean peanut gallery.

It's already been proven all you know how to do is talk and even that you can't do well.


Now go roll your pencil and ooh and ahh.

[Tom Yum]

You know if an electrician goes to do a job he doesn't bring 1 tool to do it. He brings a whole tool box.

It just seems funny that the guy who brought one tool whooped the ass of the guy who supposedly has a multi dimensional tool box.

I guess knowing how to use a hammer real well is better than being a putz with all the expensive equipment.

The reverse can happen too, KOTF.

Prime example is Kimbo vs. Ray Mercer. Kimbo has used his basic, multi-purpose MMA tool set to take apart Mercer, the master of the hammer.

Ultimately, it comes down to whomever can use their tools first and foremost, against their opponent's weakness.

Technically speaking, gong-fu probably has the most tools available - everything from forms, medicine/healing, full-contact fighting (sanda/shuaijiao), self-defense (qin-na) - but seeing as we only have 24 hours a day, we have to choose 2 areas at best to become the SME.

[Kintanon]

LOL! Tim Sylvia isn't in his prime now. He wasn't a very good striker before, and he went into this fight in terrible shape. This entire thing was a disgrace.
If you want to see MMA guys with great hands check out the Diaz brothers, Anderson Silva, Lyoto Machida, BJ Penn... and a laundry list of other guys who have good hands that are integrated well with the mixed ruleset.
Pure boxing DOES NOT WORK under a mixed ruleset like that. Just like pure BJJ doesn't work any more. You have to integrate your techniques and adapt them for the environment.
For that reason most MMA fighters would not beat most boxers IN A BOXING MATCH. It's an entirely different sport with entirely different issues.

[Ghost]

Technically speaking, gong-fu probably has the most tools available - everything from forms, medicine/healing..flower arranging...nappy changing and how to grow your ponytail.

very wide ranging tool set
tom, you got a gf yet?

[WildWest.]

You know if an electrician goes to do a job he doesn't bring 1 tool to do it. He brings a whole tool box.

Usually he quotes the job but you don't see him attend to it for ages, weeks maybe. Then, when you think he's forgotten about you he turns up at 7 in the morning, looks at the job and realises he hasn't got the right tool to fix it with him today and you don't see him for weeks again. All of a sudden he comes back again at another ridiculous time when you're arranging to get the job fixed by someone else and attempts to have a go. He mucks around for an hour or so and states that he has to order in a part from Taiwan/China/Pakistan and that will take 6-8 weeks. 14 weeks later he turns up again but the part is the wrong size so re-orders from Taiwan/China/Pakistan. 20 weeks later he comes back to finish the job and charges an exorbitant amount. You haggle and argue with him but he won't budge. Next thing you know he's taking you to the small claims court so he can get his money. Once it's all been settled legally and 1 week after the settlement, the problem he came to fix breaks and nearly fries you.

[WildWest.]

Uke,

Butterbean has fought in a few MMA fights and copped a beating. Have a look on youtube or google video etc. They are there.

[Tom Yum]

very wide ranging tool set, which I'd love for you to put in my box babeeeee!! tom, you got a gf yet? cuz that would make this ghost jealous

Uh, sure thing Ghost.

[jubaji]

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More comments from the penis...ooops I mean peanut gallery.

It's already been proven all you know how to do is talk and even that you can't do well.


Now go roll your pencil and ooh and ahh.

So, you had to go think about it and come back to edit your post and this is all you came up with? kingofthelame

[jubaji]

I'd wager the ones doing the most smack talking haven't got 1 second of actual personal experience to base their opinions on. So in essence the only people smearing the MMA fans reputation is the MMA fans themselves when they make baseless arguments without an ANY experience from which to base their extremely vocal arguments upon.

That famous rock-solid hairdresser logic at work!

[Uke]

I've never said that MMA guys are great boxers - boxing is a whole nother art. To the contrary, I've said that some can put together good punching combinations. MMA isn't boxing and vice versa.

An experienced retired pro boxer can still deliver the goods against someone of lesser boxing ability or use his strength in that range to gain the initiative in the fight. Likewise, a MMA guy can use leg kicks and grappling to beat a boxer.

Kimbo Slice beat Ray Mercer, remember?

As far as self-defense is concerned, I know there's alot of it out there - alot of it in TMA styles. I've been exposed to some material from Applegate's combatives.

Don't sit there and tell that fcuking lie, Tom. You and I went back and forth ... even started our own topic to discuss the hand skills of MMA where you proclaimed over and over that MMA fighters had great boxing skills. As slowly you began to lessen the glowing adjectives you used to describe MMA skills, but you went on and on nonetheless.

That bullshit can be read right here: http://www.defend.net/deluxeforums/o...s-mastery.html

What this fight proved was that a 50 year old guy that was shot in the sport of boxing could come in and take out one of MMA's best fighters. Call Sylvia "over the hill" if you guys like, but that just exposes your ignorance of the sport you all seem to think you know about. All of Sylvia's losses in the last 5 years were to top tier competition with the exception of Andrei Arlovski. Sylvia had beaten everyone he faced except the vanguard of the sport: Couture, Nogueira and Fedor, Mir.

So how does that make Sylvia "over the hill"? Or are are you just calling Sylvia "over the hill" now because it really does demonstrate that even a 50 year old, 300lb non-MMA fighter can come in an smash a MMA champion to pieces? How the fcuk could anybody call that luck? Mercer hit him directly on the button! It wasn't some wild MMA hail mary haymaker that landed. And worst of all, with Sylvia's height and reach advantage Mercer should have NEVER been able to get close enough to land that cleanly.

Sylvia hasn't retired. Sylvia hasn't lost to subpar competition. The only B-lister that's ever beaten him is Arlovski! So what you all are saying is bullshit ... pure and simple.

You have no justification to call Tim Sylvia "over the hill".

You have no justification to call the knockout "lucky".

Man, I've seen some pretty thin threads in my time, but this one is on its way to winning the slimmer of the year.

So a has-been MMA guy got in with a has-been Boxer and got clocked. Sure, that sounds like the perfect reference point to discredit the approach of MMA.

How many MMA fans are on this forum, a few hundred? A bet each and every one of them could post a fight where a well rounded MMA fighter wiped the floor with a one dimensional fighter. I'm sure they don't feel the need to because a) it happens all the time, in pretty much every tournament for all to see and b) they aren't desperatly trying to discredit other people's art to compensate for their own insecurities.

Name one? Name a fight where a one dimensional fighter that was a contender from ANY OTHER DISCIPLINE got a smackdown like this one.

You won't, and if you do you'll probably name someone from the early UFC's like Ron Van Clief(50 years old). What's to discredit? If Brock Lesnar came in and knocked out Lennox Lewis towards the end of his career, the same shit that I'm saying would be found on all internet boards, magazines and sport channels. But somehow what I'm saying is unreasonable.

Not only does it embarrass MMA because a boxer did it. It embarrasses MMA because he was 50, 300lbs and hasn't been in fighting shape in years. Shit, Mercer hasn't been in fighting shape even in his last few boxing matches.

THAT'S THE BIG FCUKING DEAL. Your brains haven't processed that shit yet, but once it does I don't expect your egos to be able to deal with it.

I tell you what. Since Randy Couture is "well rounded", let him try to box professionally at his current weight. "Well" rounded means just that. So he should be able to make the necessary adjustments right? If boxers have been willing to show and prove, why not have MMA icons do the same?

Know why? Cause MMA fighters are niche fighters who, when put in different fighting arenas get their asses handed to them as departing gifts for the most part. Very, very few would attempt to fight in K-1 or Pro boxing. And its not because of the money as the money is usually better in those events. No, its because once they aren't allowed to butt scoot and wrassle 90% of their skills and repertoire are gone. The only gimmick that MMA has brought to the stage that hasn't been done better elsewhere is laying on the ground and wrasslin'.

So call MMA a different entity. Say that it is what it is and these men succeed and excel at it. Call it a complete sport. The truth is that its a toughman tournament where WWE wrestlers can come in and prove that the whole show is a fcuking circus by dominating.

And now a 50 year old, 300lb man did the same thing indicating that not only WWE steroid freaks can crossover to embarrass the so-called "evolution" that is MMA.

No 50 year old fighter should be able to compete with 20 & 30 year old fighters ... many of whom have tested positive for steroids .. unless those fighters are poorly fcuking trained. And now because Sylvia got knocked out all of a sudden he was already washed up because he lost to Couture, Nogueira and Fedor? How fcuking pathetic of an argument is that? Sylvia loses to three of the best talents that MMA has EVER had and because of that he's "washed up".

The reverse can happen too, KOTF.

Prime example is Kimbo vs. Ray Mercer. Kimbo has used his basic, multi-purpose MMA tool set to take apart Mercer, the master of the hammer.

Ultimately, it comes down to whomever can use their tools first and foremost, against their opponent's weakness.

You rarely if ever see two solid boxers walk into the ring and one gets annihilated in 9 seconds. That rarely if ever has happened in K-1 either. Then when you add the fact that the annihilator in this case was 50 years old and 300lbs, then the picture becomes a bit more fuzzy for MMA monkeys and clear for people that aren't trying to protect their own bowl of Uncle Ben's.

So then the monkeys have to scream "It was a lucky punch!" at the top of their lungs and fling shit while rattling the cages. When that doesn't fly they abandon one of their top guys who has only lost to the best of MMA by saying he was "washed up".

Excuse after excuse after excuse.

[jubaji]

Well, thanks for coming back and reminding us that you are still an agenda-junkie asshole, pUke.

[GQchris]

I think what happened here is that Tim showed himself more a "Mixed Martial Bullsh!tter" than a Mixed Martial Artist, and Ray Mercer just exposed that.

[Uke]

I think what happened here is that Tim showed himself more a "Mixed Martial Bullsh!tter" than a Mixed Martial Artist, and Ray Mercer just exposed that.

That's some weak shit, GQchris. That ain't like you.

How can Tim Sylvia be seen as a "Mixed Martial Bullshitter" when he's beaten all but the top echelon?

Okay ... then let's go with that. Tim Sylvia is a MMA bullshitter. That says more about the quality of 99% of the MMA athletes than it does about Tim Sylvia. Hell, Tim has beaten everyone he's faced with the exception of Couture, Nogueira and Fedor(also Mir). Those three men along with Crocop are the vanguard of MMA because THEY ARE TRADITIONAL MARTIAL ARTISTS COMPETING IN A CONTEST FILLED WITH SHITTY FIGHTERS.

Its just that simple.

Those four men usually defeat all their opponents. Its only a super fight when they are fighting each other.

So if Tim Sylvia is able to defeat ALL BUT THE TOP TIER yet Sylvia is perceived as a "MMA Bullshitter", then all of MMA aside from the top tier are bullshitter cannon fodder. The sport is a manure factory in other words.

We all know that when they try their hand at K-1 they get embarrassed.

If they ever had the balls to try pro boxing it would be a spectacle.

So they have no choice but to stick with NHB toughman contests where they can get on their knees and hold on for dear life when their lack of skills are exposed and there's no where to run.

Viva la Butt Scoot!!!

Actually ... thanks for making that point for me, GQchris!

[Mr. Miyagi]

We'd need to see elite MMA strikers fight elite boxers under K-1 style rules to see where things really are. Boxing is boxing and MMA is MMA. You can't compare the standup; an MMA fighter is fighting though clinches and under the threat of a takedown.

Anderson Silva vs Roy Jones in a standup fight with kicks, knees, elbows, and clinch allowed. Who wins?