Catching someone's arm

[David Hume]

In real life scenerios, how likely is it that even an experienced MA will be able to grab the puncher's wrist (or knife attacker's wrist when making a stabbing motion)?

From my first class in Bujinkan it seems like a lot of interesting things can be done if you successfully evade the knife/fist and actually catch the wrist, but is this a pipe dream scenerio or can people really get the attacker into those nasty locks & throws?

-David Hume

[crazyjoe380]

i've never done it or will try it.. i've caught a hand but not without taking a few first..

[holte2]

if someones coming at me with a knife, i think the last thing i would do is try to catch his hand or his wrist...too me its to dangerous, you screw up and the best case scenerio you get the shit ct out of your hand or possibly your wrist or whatever he was going for in the first place...try using a hands thats got a 6 inch cut in it to punch with....

[jesse7]

Have a read of the knife thread over in I think its the JKD forum.

[Szczepankiewicz]

A hand catching another hand is like hitting a bullet with another bullet.....

Why try to hit the bullet when you can hit the gun?
Why try to hit the gun when you can hit the hand holding the gun?
Why try to hit the hand when you can hit the arm?
Why try to hit the arm when you can nail center mass?
Etc, etc...

Attempting to catch the knife hand or punch is best left to the professionials (read Hollywood make believe).

In my limited experience, against a knife the best thing to do is avoidance (but of course). If you have to deal with a knife, get a longer weapon and keep your distance. If you cannot do this, disable or intercept the arm.

Best bet, read up and train with people who have actually dealt with knives.

If you see the knife before you start bleeding, you're dealing with an ameteur to begin with....

Spanky

[ryanhall]

but is this a pipe dream scenerio or can people really get the attacker into those nasty locks & throws?

pipe dream. without a doubt. seen it tried in practice, and when the "attacker" is not playing along, it will never happen. ever. locks and throws in a knife situation are suicidal. parry the blade if you can, and blitz with strikes to the head/neck. attacking the attacker is the way to go. the only "safe" way to grab a knife hand imo is the v-grip. especially if they are stronger.

just my 2 cents

ryan

[chalambok]

Quite possibly the easiest way to grab an arm is to make an attachment of the shoulder then follow down the arm to where you can grasp it. Pekiti Tersia students have probably done this numerous times in training, usually preceded with a slap to the jaw hinge then followed by an elbow attack to the hand/forearm/upper arm. If you practice this be sure not to try and shortcut the motion by going directly from the shoulder to the wrist, you will miss every time. You MUST feel your way down the arm. If you do this you may find it is not as difficult as you have been led to believe to actually get a hold on the hand. I am not saying it is easy, or even recommended, but sometimes last resorts should be trained too.

[jesse7]

armlocks /grabs are far from impossible and say they can never happen is just plain ignorance. No offence guys but there is lots of situations where you can place and arm lock after a punch. Hey its most likely to not work every time of corse.

But if you practice at something and can apply it with insane speed and without thinking ... it is possible.

You just have to know when to apply it.

For example .. someone attacks you and throws three or so wild punch's all of which miss and he goes in for a four .. just because hes fired up and cant properly control when to stop .. but he doesnt really want to throw the last punch because he knows he wont hit or whatever .. so this punch is likely to still be thrown but it will be slow and weak. Here there is a chance to grab the arm and do lock.

Or my favourite that someone show'd me. The classic wild haymaker punchs that come at you .. if one go mid level .. you can lift your arm and step into the person so he will hit you under the arms in the ribs .. but by steping forward is weakens the blow. Drop your arm over his .. make a triangle .. lift up .. snap arm. This works Ive tried it .. ive also goten a few cracked ribs too :P.

Its all about distraction .. you distract the person away from the arm your really going to break and its possible .. again im not saying it works all the time. You just have to pick when to attemp to apply it ... and you pretty much have to have masterd it.

I do however think is nearly impossible to grab a striaght full force punch that will be snapped back.

Knives are completely diferent story ... check out the knife thread for that one (its in the filipino forum sorry)

[ryanhall]

armlocks /grabs are far from impossible and say they can never happen is just plain ignorance.

jesse,
please reread my post before you call me ignorant. i was talking about a knife. not a punch. it's not impossible to catch a weak punch. there are just better tactics in my opinion. if it works for you, then by all means do it. my rule of thumb is: assume you are dealing with one tough mfer. do something that will work on him, and you're doing something that will work on just about anybody. what if the guy throwing at you is a boxer? try grabbing his hand. like the way a fist tastes? why not block/jam the haymaker and then strike--less room for error in my experience?

real life/street is not the place to fu#k around--after you execute the masterful arm break, what's to say the bg won't take out his folder and gut you? some people have had their arms broken with a baseball bat and then used the limb like a club to maim their assailant(s). is that arm break gonna work on them? finish it fast and get the hell out of there. the more complicated a technique is, the more likely it is to fail and get you hurt.

if you have the ability to move people like marionettes and break limbs at will, then that's fine. i do not. i have never heard of someone breaking an arm when someone punches at them. never seen it either, and i don't expect to. i have seen on person get seriously fu**ed up trying something just like that though. he tied up some jerk's arm trying to break the elbow, and evidently didn't do it properly (this the part where people chime in and say "well if it was ME, i'd have broken ten joints before he knew what was happening"). he got punched in the nose twice, kneed in the groin, and kicked after he fell. not his lucky day. i guess he wasn't enough of a master to make that deadly technique work. remember: this is the internet, and my info is unverifiable, so take it as you will. but i'm not selling anything, so i have no reason to make up silly stories.


ryan

[Szczepankiewicz]

It has been my experience that people from Oregon City, Oregon don't now sheet about sheet.


Whatever!


Spanky!

[jesse7]

heh take it easy... I wasnt slamming you ... and I rered your post and to me it still looks like your talking about both .. if you read what you quoted then read the first two words this is exactly what it looks like. But obviously you didnt mean it this way.

Anyways, I wasnt trying to sound stupid, its not like I go and arm lock someone in every fight im in. Sometimes it just happends and I dunno how it did.

In my example ... i didnt literilly break anyones arm, but I could have .. instead of hurt it bad .. and as he squeal'd in pain I head butted him in the face, and I was very concious he had a free hand. I was ready to albow him to the throat or drop a knee .. but I never had too. This guy was slightly bigger than me too. I have tried that same thing before on small guys .. I was still able to grab their arms and hurt them then pull out some other move .. but at the cost of a few cracked ribs and sometimes a weak knee that I was looking out for.

I havent really had that much experience Ive only ever been involved in like 7 or 8 real fights. The rest were just scuffles or messing around with my mates.

[ryanhall]

i hear ya dude. no problem. i've just had to listen to way too many dojo darlings about how they would have done this or that or how deadly their moves/art is without an ounce of actual experience. i wasn't disrespecting you personally. i like the way you explained what happened to you when you used the lock.

Anyways, I wasnt trying to sound stupid, its not like I go and arm lock someone in every fight im in. Sometimes it just happends and I dunno how it did.

if it happens, then it happens. if someone gives you the arm for free, lock it or whatever. if someone wants to offbalance themselves, hip throw him if you want. forcing a technique is always wrong. if a boxer with a monster hook tries to force his weapon of choice, he'll probably lose because he refused to see other options. i run into a lot of people who say "always do this" or "never do that." do what works/is right for you at the time. just because i choose a different tool does not mean that your choice would not work. peace.


ryan