Kicking/Punching Resistance

[FoxHound]

Hello everybody,

I've been observing this forum for some time now since I started becoming intrigued with the Western/Thai/Savate styles of boxing/kickboxing. Looking forward to sharing and learning from all of you.
Being a beginning Thai/Savate fighter, how can I effectively close the gap with somebody to do some damage? I posted this over on a JKD forum, and a respected instructor told me that kicking to close the gap (which is what I usually do, since in my experience, in kickboxing, punches disappear when the kicks come into play) is a bad idea. I find it hard to disagree with him because I get slugged by a random punch or flurry everytime I step in. It was also stated that I must use my hands to set up my leg kicks, but how can I possibly do that if I'm not in range?
Thanks for any advice you guys can give!

[darrianation]

There are tons of threads on this subject here.

The short nasty is jab, jab, and jab some more. Did I mention jab? Yeah do that.

Also combos my favorite is a double jab, right cross, right round kick. There are hudreds of combos out there to try out, but remember to jab.

Using a kick to lead is a bad idea. Somteimes it can work as a feint like to feint with a mid to low kick to see if he drops his hands then nail his head.

Remeber also kick low and punch high, and oh yea jab!

[FoxHound]

Darian,

Usually, I would agree with the jab, but the leg teep always tags me on the way in. That's why I throw the kick (my forward stamp) but a random flurry always always catches me.

[KopyKat]

Well im not very experienced at all or anything but are you sure you are taking a bit of a step/shuffle while you give your jabs to close the gap? I find that when i hit the bag and when im just out of punching range or so that it gets me in there with a jab pretty quickly, the thing is you really have to time it with your footwork (the step in) you shouldn't be stepping in before the jab but rather with the jab to get best results im pretty sure.

Read this thread:

http://www.defend.net/deluxeforums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9437

haumana2000 says: This may sound stupid but examine your form as well. because many people who may not be as fast as others really seem fast because of the difference in release time between their foot moving, and their hand shot. Are you using prepatory motions to inititate your jab? telgraphing, see if your foot moves before your hand, this is more of a boxing technique but it works. Because if your foot is arriving before your hand, not only will you expose your face, but he sees it earlier as well.

Hope that helps

[darrianation]

Try a jab just out side his range (the jab does not need to land) and when he teeps you scoop the teep then round kick his support leg. Sometime it helps to take a half step back as he teeps (catch it with a scoop) Redirect it away from you and low kick him. Or just step in and then do a slight hop back as he teeps so the teep just misses then as his foot drops come in right behind it.

Teeps are generally easy to catch. There are many things you can do with a person once you have his leg. Use your imagination and/or training.

You can also do a downward block to redirect the teep then step in with a jab, cross, hook combo. Or jab, cross, low kick.

Practice doing this and also practice getting him to commit to the teep with feints then come in behind it.

I hope some of these help.

[FoxHound]

Darian,

Man, that sounds great! I'll have to try it out at my next sparring session. Thanks!

[M@T]

Originally posted by darrianation

Using a kick to lead is a bad idea. Somteimes it can work as a feint like to feint with a mid to low kick to see if he drops his hands then nail his head.

Good advice. I've been doing kickboxing for years and in all that time I probably got hit with a lead kick to the head about 4 or 5 times. Even the most powerful or fast snap kicks are easily telegraphed by a good fighter. There are plenty of people who adore big kicks and I laugh to myself when i'm fighting them coz they're so easy to defend against.

As the man said, you have to set a big kick up and the best way to do that is to throw a few fast jabs. Anywhere between 1 and 4 fast jabs to open up the area you want to hit then slam the kick in.

[jukado1]

set point control

Foxhound: you might want to try to work on "set point control,"
this is just before you move in to attack your opponent take a step to the side of your opponent, and as he reacts to adjust his position, on his movement you attack, this if done right will catch him at a defensive disadvantage.

[FoxHound]

Guys,

Again, thank you all for your responses, especially you Darian.

When all that is said and done, should I neglect kicking the lead leg to enter? I'm worried that someone will become wise to my ways (provoking the lead leg teep/kick and scooping it to the side) to enter.
Another pertinent question: do you tend to advance with punches rather than kicks?

[Khun Kao]

"Using a kick to lead is a bad idea. Somteimes it can work as a feint like to feint with a mid to low kick to see if he drops his hands then nail his head. "

I must respectfully disagree. Using a kick to lead is not only a standard lead-in of Muay Thai, but can be used QUITE effectively. It all depends on how you do it, though.

In all seriousness, you aren't going to start off with a roundhouse kick to someones head. That is just plain stupid. But low to middle Lead-Leg Teeps and low Lead-Leg Round Kicks are quite often used to set up your combinations.

Examples:

Lead Leg Push Kick to opponent lead leg or to abdomen can be used to setup other kicks, or lead directly into your hands. Heck, we even use it to lead into knee and elbow strikes.

Lead Leg Round Kicks can be followed up with a Teep, or punches quite effectively. I haven't attempted to follow up with knees or elbows unless my opponent attempts to counter by closing the distance with me.

My current coach, Master Bumrung Prawatsrichai, is a former Lumphinee and Ratchadamnern Stadium Champ from the 70's, and he PREACHES beginning your combinations beginning with a lead leg Teep.

Khun Kao

[darrianation]

I was hoping Khun Kao would chime in on this since he has the experience here.

I was just going to mention when I spar my sensei in karate he always lunges with his jab and I nail him at will with the teep I get him up under his jab and he always complains of sore ribs after we spar. After three months I finally told him what he was doing wrong. I don’t know if you are doing this or not but watch for lunging.

As jukado1 was saying I often step out forward and to the left (I am right handed so I fight left foot forward) when I jab it makes you a harder target to teep or kick/punch. Keep covered and watch for his cross.

If you are going against a good counter puncher and he keeps nailing you as you come in (closing distance) then lull him to sleep. You become a defensive fighter and let him come to you. Then you teep him or counter punch him. In my experience when I am aggressive my opponent becomes defensive and when I slow it down and become less active they will become more aggressive and start coming to me. Its strategy you have to find out what works best for you.

[darrianation]

PS: If you do use a lead in kick don't use a rear leg kick, use your lead leg, and again make it low to get them to drop their guard then go high with a punch or a rear leg kick.

[sslinky]

Something that works quite well for me is: a lead-leg kick to the inside thigh (lead-leg) - without much power, just as a distraction - then slide in with a jab as you drop your kicking foot (the jab should land around the same time your foot touches the floor), followed by whatever other combination you want.
Something similar with a fake front kick (front leg) works well too.

[FoxHound]

Well, I tried some of the stuff out. I had great success faking an entry with a few jabs. When I received a lead kick in reply, I scooped the kick to the side and out of the way, then leg kicked his rear leg. It also working like a charm against a TKD friend I was sparring.
So nobody here really uses their lead leg to probe or enter? Someone recommended that I check some K-1 fights out to see how it's done. I just saw the Vanderlei Silva vs. Guy Mezger Pride fight a few nights ago. Mezger had some nice kicks, particularly with the lead leg. He kicked high and punched.
I'm not sure why it's a bad idea. Can anyone share any tactics on using the lead as an entry, or should I just stick with what I'm doing now??

[Khun Kao]

"So nobody here really uses their lead leg to probe or enter?"

Don't read much? I do... ALL THE TIME!

Lead leg Push Kicks and Lead Leg Round Kicks, constantly!!!

Lead Leg Push Kicks and Round Kicks to your opponents lead leg are where its at!!!! You can really destroy their rhythm and timing this way, and it leads so BEAUTIFULLY into so many combinations.....

Khun Kao