Aikido better than Kicbox for Selfdefense?

[timbus]

Something I have a hard time believing. I assume all you guys are aware of Klaus Nonnemacher's quote where he states:

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"Hamburg - Kickboxen sei eher zur Verbesserung der persönlichen Fitness geeignet als zur Selbstverteidigung, erläutert Klaus Nonnemacher aus Karlsruhe - Deutschland-Vorsitzender der World Kickboxing Association.

Kickboxen fördere Schnelligkeit, Kraft, Ausdauer, Flexibilität, Balance und Koordination. Zum Erlernen von Selbstverteidigungstechniken empfiehlt der siebenfache Weltmeister im Kickboxen eine Kampfkunst wie Aikido."

translation: "Kickboxing rather serves the improvement of personal fitness, than the improvement of self defense, says Klaus Nonnemacher from Karlsruhe, Head of the world kickboxing assosciation. Kickboxing improves speed, strenght, endurance, flexibility, blanace and coordination. If you want to learn self defence, you should learn an art like Aikido, the 7 times world champion suggests".

Now did I miss something here? Aikido?

[Tommy DeVito]

perhaps he had good money from aikido people.

[brokenelbow]

Personally I wouldn't pick aikido for self defense because of it's learning curve, but he has a point. Now if you ask me what's lacking in most self defense based arts it's speed, strength, endurance, flexibility, balanace and coordination. I would pick Aikido for the blending and redirecting and that it's a good long term study.

[Colin Chua]

I studied Aikido, Kyokushin Karate, Shotokan Karate and Norther Shaolin Chuan Fa. While indeed it will take longer to learn and be proficient in Aikido, I would still use it as my primary street defense tool. Please do not get me wrong, the other hard styles I studied are indeed effective in their own right, my chioce on Aikido has to do with its "non-violence" ethos as preached by Morihei Ueshiba. It is purely a defensive art with no attacking moves. It is not meant to hurt but to "incapacitate" or immobilise one's attacker. All the moves, you see in Stephen Seagal's movies, while are indeed Aikido moves, were modified to hurt. This goes against Ueshiba's philosophy of peace and harmony.

It all boils down to one's values or objectives. When I am cornered and do not have any choice, in that my Aikido moves are no longer effective (due to my low skills rather than its effectiveness) are still do revert to the harder styles (eg karate), where I am better at.

Cheers

[darrianation]

I think Aikido has some good principles and techniques and is better for going up against people welding weapons like knives and clubs then KB is.

Both have merit but if I were to choose one over the other I would still pick KB and then learn some techniques to deal with the ground and weapons.

Knowing some aikido may be helpful though especially if you work in a position wear you deal with the public in specific way like the police, bouncer, or correction officers when trying to control someone without breaking their jaw.

[Jeremy]

sawasdii krup,

One thing I like about Aikido/Jujitsu is that it's not necessary to draw blood or break bones to stop a fight that has already started.

However, if ever a Muay Thai figher has superior speed, technique, and strength, then there's not much any Aikido/Jujitsu guy can do except hope to get close enough for a grapple. Even then, elbows and knees with knock-out forces start raining down, thus making life even harder for Mr. Aikido-joe. That's my opinion anyways.

[shadowkiller]

Dont have experience in Aikido but the more and more things I do the more and more convinced I am that simplicity is the best self defense. Just look at it from this point, most any MT practioner that has studied for 6 months can beat a karate or TKD or most other art practioner that has been doing it for 2 or more years.

Most other arts were designed for the mindset as well as self defense. They are life long lessons. MT or KB seem to be for quick hard attacks and simple defense. They lack trapping and ground grappling but most street fights you will get into the person doesnt know anything about fighting on the ground. Most people do know how to punch and kick if not effectively they still have a basic instinct to know how to do either. KB is very simplistic in its style, it has a few kicks and few punches and you just drill those untill you can do them without thinking.

This is just my take on what I have learned so far but I think its close to truth.

[Jeremy]

shadowkiller krup,

I tend to disagree with what you said about someone training for 6 months in Muay Thai and being able to beat most practioners of other arts. I'm not sure about karate, or TKD, but unless one was already a very skilled martial artists before studying Muay Thai, I don't think 6 months can fully prepare one to take on a dedicated Aikido/Jujitsu student of 2 years in a similar height/weight/age range.

[shadowkiller]

I dont know man. From everything I have seen it seems its usually the case. But to clarify I was really leaning towards striking arts in that statement.

[thaibxr]

I believe it depends on the person if someone is dedicated to what ever they are learning and are somewhat agileit just depends on the person.I have never personaly trained anything else besides muay thai but I have many friends that have and from what I here muay thais in your face aproach is much more affective than most. but again I also believe that it depends on the individual.

[Rasta]

Aikido is a self defense, MT is both defense and attack

I haven't been practicing MT for very long, so I have to admit my opinion is biased, but I think Aikido is defintely superior in terms of self-defense. Ideally, the best resolution an aikidoist can hope for is that the confrontation never occurs.

With that said, however, I think MT is better suited for kicking-ass.

If your whole point is self defense, aikido will give you everything you'll need to defend yourself, and get out of most rough situations.

If you want to fight back however, aikido won't really help you there. You may be able to subdue the person to a degree, but you won't kick their ass. (This is only partially true. I believe that if you study aikido for about 20 years you'll have the rang of understanding what's involved to be able to kick some ass).

They are basically to totally different mind-sets though. MT involves punching and kicking to subdue and ultimately beat the opponent. Aikido invloves preserving yourself and the other person.

[Thai Bri]

I'm not with you. How, for example, would you "preserve yourself and the other person" when a 16 stone moron decides wo stick his fists in your face at a rate of 90 times per minute? I CAN see a reasonable Kickboxer coping, but fail to visualise the Aikidoka.

[silapathai]

aikido vs. muay thai

I personally from my own experience would say Muay Thai is more effective. I spent almost 2 years studying aikido and aikijujitsu...I honestly didn't learn much but than again it could be the schools I studied. My kickboxing/muay thai skills in 3 months were much more realistic than 2 years of muay thai/kickboxing

[HuSanYan]

I'm not with you. How, for example, would you "preserve yourself and the other person" when a 16 stone moron decides wo stick his fists in your face at a rate of 90 times per minute? I CAN see a reasonable Kickboxer coping, but fail to visualise the Aikidoka.

a good point for once Bri, this must be the first intelligent post in all 2814 of your posts to date, keep up the good work m8

[Shaolinkfman]

martial arts tag

I have done aikido for 1 year and shaolin kung fu for about 5 months. While i have enjoyed shaolin kung fu more than aikido, i beleive akido is one of the most effective arts out there. The akido i did was slightly modified but basically it is not just about trying to grapple, it is also about avoiding the force of the attacker. And even though it is not supposed to be a very forceful art, most of the techniques easily hyper extend joints and break or fracture bones. I remember watching someone new to our class one day trying to punch real hard and fast at one of the black belts, i also then remember the sling he had to wear for months to come. The black belt gave him a spiral fracture and that is not fun. To sum up i tell what a friend of mine told me that is a black belt in aikido. "You may get hit or a black eye if you don't do a move fully right, but which is worse, a black eye or the broken bone the other guy will get."