Muay Thai Stance

[bustr]

Could someone explain the logic behind the stance used in Muay Thai? Is there a practical reason for standing straight up with the hands near the brow and the elbows out away from the ribcage. Wouldn't a standard boxing stance (more sideways, crouched, elbows in, chin down) offer the body more protection? Are Thai fighters intentionally presenting a target or is there a practical reason behind the position?

Thanks

[zoti]

Standing sideways makes a very good target out of your lead leg. It's very hard to block when the kick is coming from the back of the knee.

The hands are higher than in boxing because of the head kicks. If the hands are low the top of the head is exposed.

Muay Thai stance is similer to boxing stance but the differences are:

- more square stance. Face your opponent so you can defend the kicks.
- Belly in. Head turtled between the shoulders to protect it.
- Elbows are IN. Not out. Having your elbows out exposes you rib cage to kicks.
- Chin is down but probebly not as much as in boxing.

Hope this helps.

[pittbulldog]

Stance

The Muay Thai stance is designed to draw attack down the center line where it can be met with all of your forward facing weapons.

[fugetsu]

stance

The Muay Thai stance as taught by Ajarn Chai and his students is for many of the above stated reasons. A few other additions:
Elbows aren't in, but a little less than 45% out so you can throw elbows easier. Elbows in or hands on the chin don't facilitate this.
A forward stance also allows for easier kicking. In a more sideways stance, it takes too long to get your kick around.
Kicks, knees, elbows and modified boxing punches are all thrown easier from a forward, upright stance. Needless to say, this facilitates offense and defense.
Fugetsu

[zoti]

OK. I mean elbows are in to cover your ribs and not completley out. Just not in like in boxing.

[Muay Siam]

if you would have the time to do research and get into more detail, muaythai in its original form has many stances each for different styles. Moreover, in the old days muaythai's style differs in various villages and war trainning camps, so the stances differ as well as the techniques. some of you might have known the different styles as muayboran(ancient fight). three very well known ancient styles left today are Muay chaiya(from chaiya village expertese in elbows and throws), Muaylopburi(from lopburi province expertese in penetrating fist blows which was said to be able to penetrate any guard), and Muaykorat[from korat province, well known for its buffalo swing punches(it was said a boxer performed in front of the king by striking a buffalo dead with one blow, he was named by the king as meun changad cherng chok)]
i have seen some of those original stances that are different from skimpy stances we see often nowadays, those stances had ground, degrees, strenght.

[Khun Kao]

Is there a practical reason for standing straight up with the hands near the brow and the elbows out away from the ribcage?

Standing straight up facilitates kicking and kick defense. You keep the hands up near the brow as opposed to blocking your jaw only because in boxing kicks and elbows are illegal. You have to protect your ENTIRE head in Muay Thai or take a nap. The CORRECT Muay Thai stance has the elbows tucked inot the ribs. However, many fighters have actually adapted the stance to more comfortably protect their heads AND bait their opponents by allowing the elbows to "wing out" a bit. This is NOT considered to be proper technique, but is part of many fighters strategy.

Wouldn't a standard boxing stance (more sideways, crouched, elbows in, chin down) offer the body more protection?

Absolutely not. As others have pointed out, the sideways stance exposes the back of your lead leg to kicks. It also makes kicking more difficult. The only kick that can be quickly thrown from this stance effectively is the lead leg "side" push kick (Push Kick thrown in the manner of a Side Kick). The sideways stance would make lead legged roundhouse kicks too weak and therefore negligible, and it would slow down rear legged kicks making them too easy to avoid or defend. The crouch, though making your more mobile, prevents you from throwing kicks or defending against them. As stated above, the elbows ARE SUPPOSED to be held in, and the chin is supposed to be kept down.

Are Thai fighters intentionally presenting a target or is there a practical reason behind the position?

I've already answered this above, but the main reason is you are baiting your opponent. Also, another factor to consider is that by keeping your hands/arms higher to protect the head, it makes it harder to be KO'ed. Thai boxers block most body shots with a raised knee, so many fighters opt for maximum head protection and rely on their leg speed to defend their body's.

[bustr]

re

Thanks for all the answers guys. I hadn't considered the possibility of getting crowned with an elbow strike.

...and Muaykorat[from korat province, well known for its buffalo swing punches(it was said a boxer performed in front of the king by striking a buffalo dead with one blow, he was named by the king as meun changad cherng chok)]...

Muay Siam

I'd like to hear more about this. Is this related to the Karbau Silat style?

[EmptyneSs]

our main instructor teaches us a bit differently. he used to be a serious boxer(western boxing) for many years, and then trained in muay thai afterwards. so our stance is more like a boxers however all muay thai techniques are utilized. we learn to use both styles together. our stance isnt as upright. only our hips and shoulders are turned sideways. we keep the lead elbow in line with our lead knee so we can acheive maximum reach with our jab, and use it to counter while also being able to protect our body. body shots coming to my body are nearly always met with my lead elbow popping straight into it and then i immediately counter. our legs arent that sideways, only the upperbody, the lead knee straight foreward. any kicks coming to your body require a block that goes straight into the kick anyway. u need to meet it with force, cause if u leave your leg just there u can easily get sweeped. the stance also allowes me to nail people with the inside leg kick with the lead leg all the time wich i then fallow with punches, or vice versa. this also alows me to utilize foot sweeps all the time to off balance or take down someone right in the middle of boxing them. our sideways, western boxer type upperbody position also makes it easier for u to parry punches coming to your face as well as countering to attacks. our knees our bent and we utilize tons of fast footwork, slipping, countering, parrying, ducking, clinching in addition to all kicks, knees, elbows, and combinations, all strikes utilizing full body power. i spar many rounds a week against people of different sizes, skills, and styles all the time since i train at an mma school, and this style has really worked out well for me.

[Muay Siam]

Muay Siam

I'd like to hear more about this. Is this related to the Karbau Silat style?[/QUOTE]



no relations, isn't Karbau silat indonesian?? or something from around that area?
the styles i had previously mentioned are various traditional styles of muaythai, some call it ancient muaythai, some call it muay boran...but they're the same thing. let's take a trip down history lane...during the wars between siam and other countries surrounding siam(eg. burma, khmer, etc.) they used various forms of "muay" to fend off any enmies of siam. back then, muaythai was used in battlefields, soldiers would be trained in "krabi krabong"(weaponry) and various "muay" which come to use when the soldiers dropped, broke, or lost their weapons, they would use their body parts as weapons. those forms varies as in each village and war trainning camp would have different styles, similar to how china has various different styles(north styles are more internal and south's are more in a straight line and has very powerful blows).now the reason you do not see these distinct styles as often anymore that is because muay thai has been commercialized and transformed from a warrior's art- to a boxing ring sport, which is what kept muaythai popular today but in its less agressive form. many of the deadly moves have been banned and forgotten. let's just say muaythai HAS grappling and breaks and throws, but those wouldn't work in a sportive fight, because the competitor would die...promoters do not want that(less boxers, less money...and more money lost to their funerals)so they decided to have a less violant-sport, thus, hence the loss of traditional styles. thus, hence the various stances, there are some traditional styles left in some of the modern muaythai we see today such as the stances in some schools are lower or wider, some has their guard stretched out, some guards in an X, some has their feet in a 45 degree, and some are just straight like karate. very long story, i've tried to shorten it...but history was never short
thanks for reading and participating in this thai art, i really appreciate people who are always eager to learn more about this. hope i've helped.

[john888]

Karbau Silat is from Indonesian. However I do not know much about it. I believe that all martial arts are interlinked in some way or the other. When the Buddist Monks came from India to China I believe their teachings filtered all the way down. Does anyone else think this?