Thai boxers live shorter

[jimbo7]

Hey, is it true that muy thai guys live a lot shorter than the average person because of all the punishment their bodies take? I know it can't be good for your body to kill off your nerves because nerves help you feel pain, which warns your body that damage is occuring.

Is it possible to do muy thai without that shin beating thing? Do they allow shin pads in muy thai places. Look, I just want to learn how to defend myself, and am not looking to compete, so learning an effective striking art is appealing, but so is safety.

[theprophet]

Unless you are training hardcore, or planning on getting in the ring I would not worry about shin damage or a shortened life expectancy. As far as shin guards, we use em in my school. I personally only use em if my shins are messed up, otherwise I don't for conditioning purposes.

Muay Thai is a great art for self defense. I was able to whoop up on the TCMA students at my school in a very short time in sparring, even the higher rank students. As far as the street it can be a devastating style

[Damian Mavis]

Jimbo, don't believe the hype man. Most western muay thai academys spar with shin guards. No one I know has ever beat their shins, that includes the pro fighters I train with in Thailand. Most pros retire by like 22, and they seem very healthy and strong, they live as long as the next Thai guy in a country with very few safety concerns and dangerous incompetence abound.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD Thailand

[Abe]

Well, i gotta say some fighters will live shorter. Guys like Orono and Sakmongkol take hits like is nothing. Impressive as it is but it really can't be healthy, especially your brain, which is very fragile.

But why you so worry though? You train to defend yourself, not smashing your own head in. Of course you will take hits, but when was the last time you saw a guy won a fight by getting smacked silly? If you're really worried about it, work hard on your defense and counters. Personally i train a lot of boxing, because i rather be superior in boxing and take the kicks, then the opposite.

Shin gaurds are common in alot of gyms, and often wore in amatuer fights. I wouldn't worry about it too much.

[Khun Kao]

Hey, is it true that muy thai guys live a lot shorter than the average person because of all the punishment their bodies take? I know it can't be good for your body to kill off your nerves because nerves help you feel pain, which warns your body that damage is occuring.

No, its not true. It doesn't "KILL" off nerves, but it does desensitize them. Basically MuayThai training drastically raises your pain threshold. But, it is a myth that you can condition yourself to feel no pain. You will ALWAYS experience some pain. Even age-old Thai boxers will tell you that you ALWAYS feel pain.

Is it possible to do muy thai without that shin beating thing? Do they allow shin pads in muy thai places. Look, I just want to learn how to defend myself, and am not looking to compete, so learning an effective striking art is appealing, but so is safety.

You don't "BEAT" your shins. You kick the heavy bag hundreds upon thousands of times. Shin pads are usually allowed in most places. If you want to learn "self defense", MuayThai may not be your best choice. Most (not all) MuayThai gyms focus on sport fighting. Yeah, you can fight, but it doesn't prepare your for scenarios that occur outside of the ring, as a general rule. If you're truly interested in Self Defense, I'd recommend Krav Maga

[Shard]

Muay Thai is a Great method of fighting. Utter Crap for self defense.
OOOh. Did i hit a nerve? So you go in for the Jab, elbow him unconcious and then knee his body to pulp. What do you tell the cops then? Opps?
Self defense also means keeping your ass out of jail.

[Khun Kao]

Muay Thai is a Great method of fighting. Utter Crap for self defense.
OOOh. Did i hit a nerve? So you go in for the Jab, elbow him unconcious and then knee his body to pulp. What do you tell the cops then? Opps?
Self defense also means keeping your ass out of jail.

Hit a nerve? No. However, I disagree that its "crap" for self defense. But its far from the best self defense art. However, I will say that the rigorous, realistic training of MuayThai actually makes it more effective than many other so-called "Self Defense Arts", because even though you might not know actual self defense application, you have the technique and the timing to defend yourself against a lot of attacks, armed or unarmed.

And as far as what you tell the cops, who says that we're dumb enough to stick around and wait for the cops? I coach MuayThai, and I will readily admit that 99.99% of what I teach is meant for the ring. But I always emphasize ONE self defense strategy.

Hit them as hard & fast as you can, then run like hell. Once you're home, call a friend and get them to vouch that you were with them the entire evening.

[GonzoStyles]

utter crap? I guess thats why no other art (imo) has had such an impact on the world in general. I am glad it is finally getting some of the recognition it deserves. EVERY other style that has faced Muay Thai has been defeated in decades of challenge matches, and only by analyzing Muay Thai and modifying their own style was any level of success against Muay Thai (Kyo-Kushin kai, San Shou,etc) attained. I love it when people tell me (no offense but it mostly seems like CMA practitioners) "there are no old Thai boxers", I have heard all the rumors, It destroys your knees, it leaves you a punch drunk palooka, you'll die from a stroke or heart attack, all those blood clots in your thighs. please! Muay Thai is only 5 rounds in a pro fight, and with a full body target the repeated traumas to the cranium (ala boxing for 10 rounds)
are not as common. plus I think the pro referees in Thailand are some of the best in the world. I have seen a Thai boxing ref fall to the ground with a KO'd fighter and place his hand UNDER his head to soften the smack on the ring floor!! people have perished in sport TKD as well but what the hell, you can slip on the soap in the shower too but I'll bet guys like SHard have that sope on a rope?

[Shard]

I didn't say MT doesn't make you a good fighter. Its just bad for self defense. Especially for guys.
If you beat the living shit out of the guy and there are no witnesses when the cops catch you. You'll be the one in trouble. Of course the rational course of action would be to put the guy's lights out and haul ass out of there. But some people in a fight stop becoming rational...

[Shard]

Btw Gonzo, I've done MT on and off and let me just say i love MT. Hell i wouldn't give a flying fk if MT Halved my life expectancy.
Ok maybe Utter Crap was abit strong. But you do have to becareful when your handing that mugger his dues. There's no ref to pull you apart. :P

[Little Apple]

In all fairness, MT is an awesome system of Martial Arts that we all love, but Martial Arts isn't the best form of self defence. Your brain is. If you get mugged while alone in a back alley at night, MA would probably help you, but what the heck were you doing alone in a back alley at night?

My brother was once waiting for his bus and this guy runs up just as the bus got there screaming that he was being chased by a crazy man with a gun. My bro looks, and sure enough down the street is this dude charging their way waving something that could be a gun around. My brother is a darned decent martial artist; solid, quick, experianced, and level-headed. What does he do? Chucks the 250lb panicking man on the bus, and pays both their fairs before the other guy gets there.

jimbo7: I hope where ever you go, if your going strictly for self defence, they teach you how to be smart and stay out of bad situations. The reason I recomend Martial Arts at all for self defence is because even if you suck, it hopefully makes you confident enough to 1) not just stand there like a victim, and 2) keep your head in agressive situations. That's usually enough. Of course MA are always fun too, and like theprophet said, unless you take it to the ring, I'm sure you'll be fine.

[jimbo7]

Thanks for all the response guys. Yeah, I hear what you guys are say. Ok, now to address the different issues. That whole nerves thing/health issue. I'm sure it isn't as bad as they say, but it just doesn't look healthy and if I can avoid it I will because if I live up to a really old age, I kind of want my body to be not as broken down as possible.

Muy Thai is a sport, but by training in it, you get exposed to the intensity level of a real fight in the street. Yeah, I know there are different types of fighting like ring fighting and street fighting and even in the street there are different situations like a straight duke it out, rock em sock em, and then theres some guy threatening you where you have an opportunity to surprise attack him and get away and then there the situation where you get attacked by surprise and more.

I am learning for self defense purposes and for fun too. I think I have the tools to be a pretty decent fighter and would like to train so I can duke it out with somebody if need be, like if some guy insults the chick I'm with or something. I know thats immature, but still. I would also like to learn stuff where there is a lot of situational type stuff and it is drilled over and over again until it is just a response. Grab my hand, break the wrist. Stab at me, side step...

I'm just exploring right now...

Anyway, thanks for the responses.

[Khun Kao]

I am learning for self defense purposes and for fun too. I think I have the tools to be a pretty decent fighter and would like to train so I can duke it out with somebody if need be, like if some guy insults the chick I'm with or something. I know thats immature, but still. I would also like to learn stuff where there is a lot of situational type stuff and it is drilled over and over again until it is just a response. Grab my hand, break the wrist. Stab at me, side step...

The scenario based training you are speaking of will be found in your typical Karate/TKD class. NOT in MuayThai.

[chalambok]

I am a long-time muay Thai practitioner, and am pretty sure I will live shorter than a lot of people. I am 5'6"... I prefer to think I am, like muay Thai, energy-efficient.

[Garland]

Okay...you guys bring up some stuff, I'll get my 2cents in...

1) To say muay thai practitioners live shorter lives may hold credance only if one can show that athletes, by far and large, live shorter lives. The abuse a muay thai kickboxer receives to the body may be greater than that of a boxer...but boxers have much more head trauma...which is negligible compared with that of football (american) players. Still...what are the stats on muay thai guys with internal injuries...and how do they compare to other athletes and average joes? I'd say, as speculation, and an educated guess...that because of the level of fitness involved and the rigorous training of a muay thai combat athlete...that they are less sucseptible to injuries caused by inactivity, and diseases caused by sloth, obesity, and a shit immune system.

2) Muay thai is an excellent, in my opinion, self defense art. It encompasses everything (with the exception of some dirty shit any untrained person can do...hence an athlete could do better) that unarmed stand-up can cover...and for most so-called "street fights" that's all you need.
True...sport muay thai (not krabbi krabong) doesn't cover weapons work...but as almost ANYONE will tell you...if somebody pulls out a knife...luck and physical attributes, as well as natural athleticism, all play as much of a role as does the knowledge of manipulating the weapon. See the Vu video in the urban combat forum entitled "Vu says run..." to see my point...Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje (argueably, if you argue to lose, the best knife man in the WORLD side by side with Tuhon Chris Sayoc), also argues this point. There is NO such thing as a real effective unarmed v. knife defense...you can learn some things to give you an edge...but you're still at one HELL of a disadvantage.

Since running and roadwork are essential for any athelete and is an important aspect of muay thai...I think that gives you an edge when a knife is pulled...because you can RUN.

There we go...my 2 cents.