Historical issues about Muai / Muay

[black crown]

Above data came from Sunthus's CD and book. Now Sunthus had launched new edition of Pahuyuth printed material in black cover.....(I won't loose my money on it, for sure.)

If u need a novel buy it. If u need source of informations, throw it away and find the others.

.....As I said Pahu means arms, Yuth means fight....

Pahuyuth means ....arms fight.... not ....storm fight.... as above.

A lot of info that posted above are mixed and twisted by Sunthus.

Some infos'd been stole then twisted and translated from many books written in Thai without credit...

Take ur own chance.

[Sieh Tanonchai]

Black crown,

it looks to me you know quite well about MT and the history, you have some pretty good points. As expected from some of the users in here I better do some homework, so I picked up their advise. Best to see what is right or wrong is checking.

Actually you could give me a little help. I would like to ask once in a while some tricky issues where it is hard for me to see what is black and what is white. Possibly I am not the only one in the whole wide world.
The parts I copied and pasted in this thread, what do you think about it. Are there some reasonable points or is it all twisted?
AT least it seems to me if you say something you have good reasons to say so.

thanks
Sieh

[george stando]

Wow! you are back already. Doesnt seem to me like you are doing any research at all. You are like a person smoking crack who cant quit. Its more than embarassing. Why dont you confront and question sunthus? Ask him. Hes your teacher and cult leader. This is what i dont understand. If you believe him, ask him all these questions. Question him relentlessly and then come back on here with that research. It would be MUCH more helpful to everyone including yourself if you start there. I personally would just love to hear that!

Also most importantly please supply us with the date of when the king issued whatever you said he issued him and what was issued, so we can verify that in thailand. Things like that will go a long way.

Much of the info you cut and pasted is stolen from books. History is not a cut and paste. Historical issues should hopefully come from a credible source. Your "source" and the "credibility" of that source has been seriously questioned and that should be what you are looking into.

Its your job to go out there and do the work yourself and committ to finding the truth. You havent begun to accept that challenge yet.

[black crown]

Sieh,

I would suggest you to find more books in Muay Thai, apart of Suhthus's. You will find those data had been written by someone else before. Some was written more than 50 yrs ago but wasn't so popular in the market. Some was in research activities. Some has been translated to English. Some were written in Novel. By misinterpreting and misunderstood of Sunthus, he mixed them up to one story..

For Example, Have you ever heard about "Mongkol"?



Sunthus wrote that it was adopted from "Sūn Wùkōng" or Monkey king in chinese novel called "The Adventures of Monkey" or "Journey to the west" as tranlated into English.



This novel has been written in 1590s but has never been translated into Thai until 1806 but first published in 1874. So How it became to Pahuyuth's story 5000 yrs ago.

The conclusion came from both of them were worn around the head. So silly isn't it?

Mongkol was used as amulet for good bless and encouraging but Monkey king Headband was used for punishment.

In the same writing he wrote about "Zhu Bajie" or "Pigsy", The pig in that novel, soon after he died he then became the "Budai" in China...(Totally different but he had that conclusion. ...you can fiind story of "Budai" on GOO.) And he had this conclusion because they were fat.


Sunthus always has funny and stupid conclusions. He has talents to mix things that never involved into the same story.

If you read those referrences i've mentioned you will then understand what is the real story.

Too many to count..

[george stando]

Thanks, Black Crown for the patience to deal with such an obstinate person as Sieh. He refuses to open his eyes to anything other than the fact he is trying in some way, some how to prove himself right. At every turn, he is proven wrong. The conclusion of this is that you cant cut and paste what you dont know and understand as sunthus did, then later create a hodge podge of physical techniques of equal to no value. Hopefully this is the sad conclusion to these endless threads.

[Sieh Tanonchai]

Wow! you are back already. ...

Much of the info you cut and pasted is stolen from books. History is not a cut and paste. Historical issues should hopefully come from a credible source. Your "source" and the "credibility" of that source has been seriously questioned and that should be what you are looking into.

Its your job to go out there and do the work yourself and committ to finding the truth. You havent begun to accept that challenge yet.

george, you are not my father, so why the heck you think you have to tell me what to do?
I do my research whenever I want, with whom I want, how I want and I decide if how I spend my time. If I say I do some checks than I do. Anything else is not your business.
I am thankful there are some users in here who actually help instead of attacking the whole time. And be sure I am in contact with my teacher.

Black crown,

thanks for reasonable answers, I appreciate.

You have any idea what brought Sunthus to this conclusion of 'Mongkol'?

Also, what about the story of a 2-colored belt for superior martial arts (Pahuyuth) given by the king. Have you heard of it? In case you have, how many people got this belt in the last time? Would you know who they are (Is Sunthus one of them)?
Please get me right, my sources to check this kind of information are very limited and you seem to know what you are talking about and you give good reasons (and links) I can understand.

thanks to all for the last threads and posting, it helps me a lot to improve.
Sieh T.

[george stando]

Sieh
And you are not my father either! Who the hell are you to tell what business is mine? You havent even been on this forum more than a month and you expect respect for what? 69 worthless posts by you is all you offer. I have also showed that most of the information was just nonsense that you posted in the first place. This is a FREE FORUM not a german gestapo forum to be run over by fools and charlatans. You get no respect from me because you write endless foolish nonsense that serves no intelligent purpose whatsoever. Nobody responds to you because nobody is learning anything from you and you contribute nothing at alll to understanding thai boxing, thai martial arts or thai history. Read the other threads on this forum and see what your contribution is to any of to them. Zilch! nothing! Its a forum community, you have every right to post but contribute something to the greater good instead of satisfying your ego.

You are like talking to a wall, not much interest in that. And as you can see the amount of people who respond to you on your threads is little to none. So you are entertaining your own foolish ego by thinking you are contributing something of importance, i mean you are in one respect, you are a perfect example of a runaway train, ego and stupidity colliding within one person, how a gullible foolish person buys the holy grail for two dollars at a dime store and preaches to the world his special gifts. I have alot of people contacting me as well with droves of information that backs up and continues to destroy your claims, credibility and writing.

You cant go to links to research for this info. You need to do research with people of knowledge in this area in thailand. You have no proof first off sunthus has the belt, do you have proof of that? Simply ask sunthus for a photo of the belt, year it was issued and for what? Its simple. So simple. even a fool could execute that. Go bring back the information and people in thailand will check it and get back to you. If your information is good and checks out then we will adjust that on the forum.

Like i said you keep running your damn mouth but when you are going to back it up> Also if you got a problem with me then take to me direct. I am still waiting for the PM from you. Contact me personally in keeping with forum decorum.

[black crown]

Sieh,

Ask Suntus, Who were those kings? When did they live?

2-colored belt..... Have you ever heard about Japanese Martial Arts?..After they did the black belt. There are a lot of "Dan" to go further. The 2 colored end of the black belt came from there? Do you know what i mean? Same as Mongkol in Sunthus's story.

All of your questions have the same answer.

It does not exist in Thai history. Just Some stupid mixed it up.

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