Chai's Instructors and their fight records

[skilzkid]

Just curious...about how many Apprentice Instructors and above does Ajarn Chai have? Of them, about what percent has been in the ring, and what are their records (all winning, mostly winning, mostly 1-0 due to lack of opportunity to fight)? Do instructors without fight records still generally end up with successful schools? How many apprentice instructors end up teaching/have their own schools?

Just day-dreaming about what it would be like to teach Muay Thai for a living...I'd end up giving up a lot of $$$ from my current job, but it would be a hell of a lot more enjoyable than computer programming

[Lao_Padek]

Good question

I was wondering the same thing. I know you lack the credibility when you have no track record to show but if you have a teacher who has that credibility maybe you are in good shape. I don't know. Anyone going to take a stab at answering this?

[JIMI]

That is not necessarily true. What about Mike Tysons trainers. No doubt that they are excellent trainers but have they ever even stepped in the ring for a real fight. Dont think so.

[Tom Yum]

Fantasizing is good in this day and age. Ring experience should be helpfull. Ex: A professor of chemistry may have never worked in the chemicals sector, but has earned enough relevant knowledge to know what are the recent big events in the sector.

Looks like I might be going back to school soon; I'm thinking about participating in Sigma Chi Fight night, but I need to talk to my coach first.

[Khun Kao]

It has been said that "The best fighters do not make the best teachers, and that the best teachers were often not very good fighters."

It has also been said that "Those who can... DO. Those who can't... TEACH."

There is validity in both statements. I am not a student of Chai's, but I was an amateur champion. I honestly do not believe that I was that great a fighter. I was just better than the competition at that time. I have discovered that I have a talent in breaking down the art and making it easier to understand, which makes me a good instructor.

Base your judgment of an instructor on how well they instruct. There are MANY instructors out there who have never fought, but understand the art and the concepts well enough to teach. Outside of Thailand, it is often difficult to get Muay Thai matches.

Khun Kao

[darrianation]

Teaching MT!

Wow! I honestly have been wondering the same thing too.

I started MT in 1981. I had already had four years of karate with a fairly successful tornament record in amateur karate. Anyway I trained for 3 years straight in MT I had only 4 amateur fights. It was impossible to get fights. We mostly fought in American kickboxing matches or full contact karate matches. I had 12 fights (amateur) in those. The reason I didnt continue is I went into the service (military) and was stationed somewhere with no MT. So i continued in Karate.

Since then I have gone to Thailand on three separate occasions to train. I have had 3 exhibition matches against professional MT fighters.

I have been to seminars by Ajarn Chai and trained at Fairtex when it was in Chandler, AZ. I’ve also been to a few seminars with master Toddy teaching. He said for $5000 ( or somthing like that) he would make me an instructor and give me his blessing to open a Muay Thai school. Hell I don’t have that much money! My original coach did not have an impressive lineage either and a lack luster professional fighting career also. But he was one hell of a good instructor.

So where does this leave me? I am to old now to start a fighting career again (now that MT is popular). I live in a place with very little in the way of MA. I still train 3-4 days a week on my own in MT. I also train in boxing (western) 1-2 days a week (just started this). I have asked the coach there about me teaching MT at the gym on days he wasn’t using it. He got real upset with me for even asking. But what if he had said yes? Would I be considered a legit instructor? I can’t get myself fights, so how would I get my students fights? I am worried about that. I have BB in Karate (I could teach that) but I know MT so much better and love MT so much more. I have decided not to pursue teaching MT for now. What should I do? What would you guys do?

[KZL]

My instructor is an apprentice instructor of Master Chai. I am supposed to take my apprentice instructor's test this year as well.

My instructors, to my knowledge, have not fought in the ring. They have however fought many a disgruntled inmate at their job. The run an emergency response team for a maximun security prison. They have a good deal of real world knowledge due to this.

There are some the fight in the ring, and some that don't. And it's true that all that matters is that they know what they are doing and can teach. The tests that apprentice instructors go through (levels 1, 2 and 3) are no picinic either. They are extremely difficult.

I think that you can have a very successful school, and successful fighters, even if you don't fight in the ring. Though I do think there is merit in having fought hard, and having been knocked out.

A certain respect for the art comes from paying the price, as it were. Unfortunately, I personally have paid many high prices in the martial arts, and several parts of my don't work right anymore.

now I'm babbling....
later all

[KZL]

oh yeah, and I forgot this part..... as you can tell from the previous post, my instructor's don't earn a living just teaching MT. Not that I think that they couldn't, just that they love to do it, and it's their hobbie.

[retired]

Darrianation
"I’ve also been to a few seminars with master Toddy teaching. He said for $5000 ( or somthing like that) he would make me an instructor and give me his blessing to open a Muay Thai school".
That's because he's in it for the money!!!!

[Great Sage]

A good instructor is NOT someone who can beat you up, but someone who can make you a better fighter.

While I don’t have much experience in MT, I have been a successful Assistant Instructor in karate/TKD running my own dojan. Furthermore, my fight record may be mediocre at best, but I know enough about the martial arts to instil on a willing student.

I feel these are the most important assets of any teacher: Love and understanding of the art and a geniune willingness to share knowledge.

You must understand that teaching IS fustrating. Not everyone will improve at the same rate, nor will everyone grasp your concepts. At times it may seem as though your methods aren’t working. DO NOT dispare... A good teacher is patient and works through obstacles. Your efforts will be noticed because every student builds on individual attention.

Here are some marketing tips and general guidelines.

Market the QUALITY of your gym, not the price. Set reasonable rates without prostituting yourself. Any student is willing to pay if the instruction is top quality.

Keep the gym clean and respectable. Furthermore, invest in quality gym equipment. No one wants to work out at a dump. And one of the main reasons people join a gym is to use equipment they dont already own.

Be updated and professional. Don’t necessarily follow trends, but keep up to date with the martial world. Validate your own program... Is it evolving? Does it meet the demands of today’s society? Be honest and willing to evolve. Most people today frown on reverse punch techniques.

Join an organization. Take part in organizations that hold tournaments, fights and other sporting events. This is where you can expose your students to matches. It’s not realistic to go hunting for tournaments while you have to teach. There are plenty of organizations within your area that hold fights.

Spar a lot. Sparring is by far the most popular activity at any gym. Most good schools have a ring. If you don’t go to many matches, a ring will solve some problems. Students working in the ring feel more professional and competitive. It’s the natural excitement of being in the ring.

Buy T.V. spots or radio. Like it or not, you need to sell yourself to pay for gym and new equipment. Just present yourself as you REALLY are, not as you want to be.

Lastly, remain positive about your outcome and continue teaching. People will see this and pass it on. Word of mouth goes a long way the martial arts world.

[Double Dose]

Ajarn Chai's Fighters

There are many instructors for Thai Boxing Assoc USA that have ring experience and many champions as well. Bryan Popejoy took home a gold medal in Kings Cup Thailand and is a Muay Thai Champ here in the USA. Erick Paulson as many of you are familiar w/ as a shoot fighting champion in the USA & Japan, Kru Greg Nelson from Minnesota Martial arts has had ring experiance and has won many NHB type fights as well as many of his students such as James Cook who is the US IKKC Champ. I am a professional Muay Thai champion and am an instructor under Ajarn Chai. there are too many more to list. He has had a hand in training many well known champions in Australia, Mexico, USA, etc. etc. The other people are quite right a fighter does not always mean a good teacher but as you can see Ajarn Chai has trained many of us who compete at many different levels successfully. Hope this helps,
Bryan "Double Dose" Dobler

[doubleouch]

I've never really played football. I practice the moves 3 times a week. After passing a football test given by my coach I am football "certtified." I am now an expert in everything football. I can now pass on the valuable football knowledge given me by my instructor. It must be valid right? After all my coach did play pro football. I have never made a tackle, or attempted a block on a live opponent, but I am certain I could if I needed to.
Ya, Right.

I'm sorry, but Thai Boxing is a ring sport and someone who thinks their certification makes them qualified to teach it is fooling themselves. Certainly not everyone who has been in the ring makes a good coach, but everyone who hasn't doesn't.

[CHOPS]

iNSTRUCTORS AS FIGHTERS

I,ve been told that the testing for the TBA is such for this very reason. Ajarn Chai realizes that not every instructor is not going to have the ability to go into the ring, nor the desire. That is why the 3rd level apprentice instructors test is so difficult . It is designed to give the feeling of what it is like to have been in an amateur fight. I've also been told that several pro fighters said their tests were actually harder and more strain on the body than an actual fight. take this for what it is worth.
How many pro boxing trainers were actually pro fighters or champions?

[OctaviousBP]

Doubleouch:

To follow up on your football analogy, if I recall (and I very well may be mistaken) Vince Lombardi, Don Shula, Mike Shanahan, just to name a few very succesful football coaches, never played a pro game in their life. Just something to think about. And again, I may be mistaken...

D

[doubleouch]

Ah yes, but they did play football! Getting paid for it is another issue. I'm talking about people who have never had a hard kick to the leg. Never taken a knee to the stomach etc.