Chokes for self-defense

[medic06]

It's a shame all you weapons nuts and dreamers are fucking yanks. I'd love for you to be in England so that you had to back up all your bullshit claims.

your right, it was silly of me to say "combat Hapkido". I thought it would help you to understand.


I'm a bit busy over here making a living and taking care of my family to go sip tea and eat scones with you. Back to the clubhouse boy

[Gunjin]

It's a shame all you weapons nuts and dreamers are fucking yanks. I'd love for you to be in England so that you had to back up all your bullshit claims.

I've already made my comments about using chokes, so I don't intend on participating in the ensuing pissing contest. I do however want to shed some light on to why us "Yanks" are so obsessed with weapons.

A quick google search of world homicide statistics and this is the best I could find(with charts):

http://www.angelfire.com/rnb/y/homicide.htm

37.7% Homicides in the US were due to arguements.
USA is the 5th leading nation while the Brits are only 22nd on the list.

I know the data is a few years old, but I don't imagine the British homicide rate is any where near that of the US. We "Yanks" take pride in our Second Amendment right. And for those that don't have a CCW permit I am sure do so illegaly or carry knives. I know I carry a knife 99% of the time I leave my home. It's just how it is over here...

[Uke]

First of all, if you discount weapons, you discount reality. You say that if a person had a knife he would have used it before the choke came into play. I guess no one has ever been snuffed unaware and had a RNC applied to them. A knife can be deployed during a choke, and if you don't panic, you can open a wound that will definitely change the complexion of a fight. If you had a RNC on me, and I deployed my knife I could easliy slice open your brachial artery as it would be right in front of me for easy access. I wouldn't suggest trying this as it can be a fatal wound within a minute. And this is just one alternative of many techniques that are solid and tested.

Second, what SamuraiGuy said about the hips ... it actually works. Bam is thinking in terms of a RNC with the hooks in going to the ground. But SamuraiGuy's implication was that if you apply it(RNC) standing, as most self defense situations do take place standing, you have about 3 seconds to reverse it. You have about the same amount of time to reverse any lock or choke. Once a lock or choke is applied on tight, it can be lights out. The point of any solid self defense system is to prepare you for such an attack. Anyone who thinks that any maneuver is invincible has been sadly mislead. This is why most self defense systems advocate overkill, so as not to rely on just one single technique. Until someone can perfect one strike knockouts and locks that break bones with ease as well as low kicks that can break bones with ease, overkill will always be the most effective and intelligent way to defeat a foe.

The reason that Bam has argued that point is because he clearly has been affected by the Gracie myth that 90% of fights go to the ground. The truth is that maybe 90% of MMA fights go to the ground. But 90% of self defense situations don't. So while Bam's mind is playing through the scenario on the ground, SamuraiGuy's mind isn't even letting the scenario get that far because obviously the objective of his training is NOT to let it get that far.

Chokes are a great way to win, but if the chokes you use aren't practical then what's the point? Triangle chokes and RNC are great for competition. But in the street if you used a triangle choke, it would have to be such an ideal situation that its almost not worth adding to your arsenal. If you had that much time to spend on the ground fighting for position to get the triangle, 9 times out of 10 the person ain't really trying to hurt you, or they just can't fight. And in a street fight, you're just not going to slap on a RNC and be done with it. Unless the other person is completely inept, you'll have to fight for that position.

Like Ed Parker said" "I'd rather have ten techniques I can fight with, than a hundred that fight me."

One of the systems that I have trained in has a choking drill that teaches how to go from one practical choke to the next. Personally, its the most comprehensive choking program I've seen for reality and its zero fluff. BJJ IMO has the best choking program for MMA and competition, but on the streets because of its focus on using the ground as an equalizer it negates its real conflict practicality.

Now I know there may still be those out there who are mislead enough to argue the merits of BJJ's standup game, but ... let it go.

[Uke]

SamuraiGay, now I know 100% that you are totally fucking clueless. You are desribing something completely irelevant and you haven't a f'ucking clue at all. An RNC is usually done in ground fighting. Do you even know what one is? You can't just turn around if I'm on your backwith my legs wrapped round you and I have the choke fully secured.

Usually? Usually where? Not on the street. On the street, the most common fights you'll see will be using boxing. If a RNC(which is called a yolk or a sleeper on the street) is seen in a street fight, it is usually applied while the combatants are standing. Most street fights do NOT resemble anything like a BJJ fight. No one uses the guard. No one does north/south. No one does flying armbars. No gi chokes.

Now if you were speaking in terms of MMA, then I'd have to say that you were right, Bam. RNCs are usually done on the ground in MMA sporting events. No doubt about that.

But this is the urban street combatives forum. We ain't about sports here, Bam.

[jubaji]

It's a shame all you weapons nuts and dreamers are fucking yanks.

'Cause that's something you've always dreamed of doing?

[SamuraiGuy]

Dude Bam, can you argue with me in one fucking thread, I told you the school I train MMA at in the thread we're arguing in in the BJJ/MMA forum.... stop asking the same question in two different threads.

And you say I dont know what a RNC is, and you say it would be on the ground with your legs wrapped around me.

HAVE YOU EVEN BEEN READING MY FUCKING POSTS. YOU NEVER MENTIONED BODY CONTROL. READ MY FUCKING POSTS AGAIN YOU FUCKING MORON.

Seriously, do you see where I mention hooks and body control? DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH THE HOOKS ARE BODY CONTROL, and usually hooks are only applied on the ground.

You are a fucking knob and a moron, you dont even read what other people post.

You never said anything about body control or being on the ground, you just said a RNC, the RNC is the arms around the neck, not the hooks and body control on the ground, I can RNC you on my knees, sitting down, standing up, hell I could probably do it upside down.

When I do it with body control, youll be on the ground, and I'll have at least one hook in.

Fucking Douchebag.

[BoarSpear]

Shut the **** up moron. saying that MMA is completely different to street fighting is just something TMA rejects spout to make themselves feel better.

Oh look nuttsuck has a new screen name

[medic06]

I've had fun with him all morning

[Sagacious Lu]

By now I'm pretty much convinced that Bam doesn't have anything meaningful to contribute to this board. He never had any intention of having a constructive discussion, he just wants to stir up trouble I'm done wasting my time on him.

[BoarSpear]

I've had fun with him all morning

sorry, having a "Beavis" moment.....but...too much information!!!

[SamuraiGuy]

Yeah f'uck off back to driving round like a paranoid freak taking your seat belt off when you drop below 35mph Segacious Lu! Fucking nutcase!

SmauraiGay, I've responded to your post in the other thread. Took my quite some time though, I had to wait 20 minutes while I finnished laughing my head off at that riiculous mcdojo you terain that is cashing in on the MMA name. lol at your instructor bein "Well, Jeff I guess". Bwahahahhaaa

Dude... your an idiot.

[BoarSpear]

Yeah f'uck off back to driving round like a paranoid freak taking your seat belt off when you drop below 35mph Segacious Lu! Fucking nutcase!

SmauraiGay, I've responded to your post in the other thread. Took my quite some time though, I had to wait 20 minutes while I finnished laughing my head off at that riiculous mcdojo you terain that is cashing in on the MMA name. lol at your instructor bein "Well, Jeff I guess". Bwahahahhaaa

you smell....errr spell like fleetnutz....

[SamuraiGuy]

That should read "YOU'RE an idiot" ... idiot.

Loser...

Think about that word... thats what you are... think long and hard about it... this isnt just a internet insult... think about what your doing... look around at your life... loser... its the truth and you know it... loser... theres that word again... loser....

Not a F***ing loser... not a F***Face loser...

just a loser..

plain and simple... thats what you are, a loser.

[SamuraiGuy]

I'm quite happy with my life SamuraiGay. I've had a real laugh at you today. It's been hilarious.

Remember that word buddy, acceptance is the first step into getting your shit together...

loser... remember it... your a loser.

[BoarSpear]

BoarQueer, please understand that making excuses about weapons and saying that you only care about serious, real, deadly, fights to the death, doesn't hide the fact that you are a crap fighter with no knowledge of grappling and who hides behind his weapons obsession.
Try again BoarQueer!

yeah you got me there.

So how pitiful are you? you got nothing more to do than troll the net? how many times you gonna get banned and reregister?.....oh well, if thats all a loser has...thats all he has, at least you realize your potential...its a shame you havent even lived up to that though, loser.