Honestly to all women about self defense..

[RBFC]

"Professional Rapists"

I have to disagree with the statement that you are as likely to face a "professional rapist" as you are an "amateur". Five out of six (83%) of rapes are committed by someone you have met at least once. Many of the acquaintance rapes are by potential "boyfriends", etc. who don't want to take no for an answer.

The image of the ski-masked attacker leaping from the bushes to jump the unsuspecting female has been used to fill the McDojo studios for years. The odds of this type of attack are far less than you being groped on your own couch by a guy you've let into your home.

The tactics and techniques used to defeat the attacker don't really differ much in any case. You need a foundation of the nastiest, simplest SD arsenal (both unarmed and wepon-based) to provide good alternatives for your defense.

Don't be swayed by over-thinking of the situation!

Remember what you are defending, and what the worst-case scenario could be like: PREPARE ACCORDINGLY.

Lee

[Ms. J]

questions, answers and understanding crime stats

First am going to try to bring some understanding to rape and the way crime statistics work. Unfortunately being groped on the couch, molested as a young child or young adult by a family member, a man raped by a man, or a domestic violence rape is not counted as a violent or forcible rape in the overall bulk released government rape statistics.

Why do you think I state so often that rape, abuse, assault and so forth is not just a woman’s victimization? Because its not. In addition, women are not the largest victims of the so-called crimes we tend to push in society. We tend to use stats in society to pay for things, again based on what the government and money state more then what the realties are.

However that does not mean people should not protect themselves incase. In addition, looking at the cases of the incase should cover all of the majority of instances.

Furthermore, saying this about the stats, agreed it sucks, and I am working my hardest to change what is considered rape in statistics and I am working hard to bring out the real issues.

All of the above listed victimizations are what the government has categorized as special interest groups. In addition, these stats are not part of the released nationally bulked out statistics. It is the Justus department and state and fed crime offices that determine what are actual cases of violent rape or attack.

A few more of the special interest groups are re occurring victims of violet crime, re occurring victims of domestic violence, molestations of children under the age of 13, rapes of men and boys in prison, rapes of the mental insane inside Americas institutions, and non- hetaera sexuals that are raped. These groups have their own statistics and are not part of the overall crime stats reported to the US populace. The statistics are there but they are not advertised. Actually, it took me over a year digging in the government’s files to find them and then another year to read them all.

Out of the two types of rapists listed in my previous posting based on the stats, The professional rapist is one that plans and does on a regular bases, regardless of what he does to facilitate the end. This is something that the attacker has done before and has had time to improve on with each new instance.

The drunk punk in a bar or a drug addict on the streets committing random rapes is much different then a spouse or domestic violence rape. As far as the drunk or deranged dude jumping out at you and trying to rape you. It happens, hell, I had it happen to me once, but granted it was not facilitated, mostly because he was drunk and i had training. In addition, it happened in a place that I would have not expected it too (on a military base at 3pm in south Korea.) and he had training because the dude was US military personal on special training in the ROK.

And yes many times for women who is dealing with the drunk or druggy it’s a date that has gone wrong or your at a bar and the dude is dragging you out the door to do the humpty dumpty regardless of what your intent is or want it to be.

Normally with the drunk or drugged out dude, when you try and say no is when the trouble starts. I have real life cases and even my own real life experiences to understand the dynamics of what a woman faces with a drunk or drugged out attacker. As far as what a man faces I have a good idea as well based on lifetime experience with friends, clients, life time experience from the jobs i have worked, and then with government, and hospital records.

Actually the bar scene is getting even more dangerous because of the drugs that are being slipped into woman’s drinks. One of my business partner’s recent clients was a victim of this kind of rape. She was at a bar, she was drugged, and then followed home, and the dude broke in, and had his way with her. This dude was cocky as shit though he just sort of took advantage of her while she was out and drugged and slept with her. She woke up to find him there and the physical evidence with him smiling acting like it was her idea. He was popped but she has some very serious issues to face now. The other thing that got me about this case is because she had been introduced to him at the bar by someone else there the police considered it an acquaintance rape. Now..... She did not know this man but evedently the laws and the definition of acquaintance is being stretched in many instances based on what the government determines.

Ok here is another reality based on case studies of a single attacker with intent to rape. Most times when someone actually has there cloths ripped off them, its because they freeze up, are drugged, or some how have become incapacitated.

I have trained a number of victims and have read a number of cases where the victim just lies there frozen as the cloths are taken off. (Yes If your not fighting its an easy thing for your attacker to do.)

In other cases of single attacker rape instances that my clients have faced or I have read about, it was after the victim was subdued by the attacker in some way that they lost their clothing.

Even in a date rape or acquaintance rape, you have to comply at some point to have your cloths taken off you. Even if the compliance is to be knocked out cold, or frozen between, their legs in utter terror because you fear you will die if you dont do what you are told. (Note: this can be the mindset of a victim during these kinds of instances, its not always as easily understood as most think based on other issues that may be present) add a weapon being used as intimidation you further the fear of death. When you have a dude pointing a gun at you saying, " bitch comply or you die" its an easy thing to comply too for some especially for someone without training and awareness education because they serously belive they will die if they dont comply. And sometimes it is the only thing you can do dependant on how dangerus the mindset is of the attacker.

Here is another thing i found out, victims tend to be reoccurring victims and that freezing up deal is linked normally to the past victimization. However, because they are re-occurring victims the categories change again and they fall into the statistical bases of “Special interest groups"

I have worked out statistics in a different way for the program and book TAO SDA. I try to explain statistics so that people understand them. Then we work with cutting the risk of being a victim of each stat based on life style and changes that can be made frist, and this is what i consider part of the awareness education.

When i state that the average rape victim is an 11-year-old child. That is based on all the records and taking it out of the governments special category of special interest groups. When i came back to the united states in 97 i started compiling the data i would need to build programs for FATE org. this data is what taught me the truth. It took me thousands of hours and over 2 years of both mine and my team’s time to filter though 20 years of government and hospital records on a national level to even understand the truth. God it was so frustrating when I found out the facts.

Oh I new and suspected because I have been there and lived in it. That is why I looked so deeply into it because what was being put out made no sense based on what I had lived and seen.

The frustration came because I knew I was going to have to try to change things so that what I taught was helping to change the cycles of violence instead of re-occurring it. Its these special interest groups that help to either re-occur the cycles or break the cycles and why I am working with them so closely to change the pattern. The other patterns have to be changed based on prevention and awareness in community programs that teach real statistics based on real instances of crime.

Open Question: Anyone know what the highest rate of violent crime is in today’s society? Remember we are talking about the law and what is considered a violent crime. Furthermore, this violent crime goes beyond age or gender and is the highest case of violent crime in each state on a national level.

Ok so a street predator: tom I agree with you about awareness, here is something i use in my class format and as a revelation for people. It is something that i use more to get people to understand how awareness can save their lives.

The Average Time of Attack:

Most muggings, stalking, abductions, and street attacks take place between 4 pm and 6 pm. At this time of day, most people are just getting off work or leaving school. Their awareness and alertness levels are at a low

Example:

Serial killer, Ted Bundy after being arrested, and convicted stated repeatedly that his selection of victims was based on them being easy pray and a fast target, when he chose his victims he would look for someone that was unaware of their environment and looked easy to abduct based on their lack of alertness and awareness.”

For RBFC : Sounds like your doing the right things; it is the core for us as well. Part of the level one 40 hour program we teach covers a section on weapons 101 and sounds like the same concepts you have going with the house. However not only is it part of our home safety course but part of all our 11 scenarios.

During scenario training of specific instances, we use what is on us, around us and so forth. In addition, all techniques are interchangeable between weapons or empty hand. BTW, the format for these programs are on line on the web site

https://www.fate-organization.com

I have an article coming out in about 2 months that will cover in more detail a reasonable outline for a level one core SDA program compared to a single instance of violent crime workshop. This will shed some light on the concepts I teach more fully. This article will be printed in Black belt’s Self Defense for Women magazine. I am told that it will not be coming out this up coming issue because of the other things I have in line that will be printed frist in the Aug-Sept Issue. I am told by my editor that it will come out in the October-November issue.

Weapons: this is to answer both weapons related comments, as far as rape, apparently more then the majority of forcible rapes have a weapon used as part of the intimidation tactics. Based on hospital reports more knives used then guns. Based on police reports it is almost equal. However, that is because many knife attacks and wounds go unreported. Mostly that is because you can’t get treated for a gun wound in the hospital without it being reported. That is not the case with other kinds of weapons, i.e. knives, sticks, and improvised weapons. when stats are reported to the us populas its only based on the reported instances of crime. Huge numbers of crimes including rapes go unreported each year.


i am just back from my 1600 mile bi weekly round trip and need a vacation...

Ms. J... Bows deeply...

PS but i had a hell of a time sparing this big studly prison guard with these huge mucles and tatoos all over him, that was at about the 800-mile mark so it was well worth the trip...

[terry]

I don't have anything to contribute to the crime statistics sub-thread going on currently. You guys are more informed than I am. But I just had a thought relating to the original title of this thread "To all women about self-defense." I think it would be a good idea to go down to the police department and check whether and where there are any sex offenders living in the community. Here in California there is a law called Meagan's Law that requires police to provide this information free of charge. There may be other similar laws in other areas.

[RBFC]

Back to Basics

While it's interesting to quote various statistics, etc., it really doesn't matter to the woman who is about to be raped. What she needs is a functional toolbox of tactics and techniques with which she can extricate herself from the situation.

I have heard long descriptions of rapist "profiles", etc. and the truth is that this knowledge is mostly for "after the fact" discussion. The women who end up being statistics are most often ill-equipped to defend themselves during the actual attack. This is the pivotal point of "Women's Self Defense" discussions:

1. Do we endlessly discuss statistics and feelings of dread?

OR

2. Do we provide realistic, functional methods with which a woman can defeat a larger, more powerful male attacker (given the scenarios involved in rape)?

If the answer is #1, then I have little more to say here.

If the answer is #2, then I can provide over 20 years' direct experience in dealing with women's attack issues, including the statistical research, etc.

The basic tools to instill safety skills for women are basically:

1. Awareness of surroundings and risk exposure
2. Verbal de-escalation and "trickery" tactics
3. Vicious, simple unarmed SD techniques
4. Familiarity with weaponry, both dedicated and improvised
5. Participation in adrenal-stress and other specialized drills to enhance versatility and confidence

This is only a basic list, but comprises the core of necessities for females.

I feel that any successful discussion forum will concentrate on these items, and not on recital or minute dissection of statistics.

Lee

[Ms. J]

Stats and tools

Its all relevant, and it should all be balanced. and to understand what the realties are it all has to be looked at. as far as what is or should be discussed here, i did not set the tune for the discussion. As far as you being fully educated in women’s SDA, and woman’s attack issues. I am not sure how that became an issue here.

Please remember as well this is an open forum, and when i discuss issues i do them openly without hostility. its not an attack on anyone person its just my opinions and open discussion on the topic.

Its an important part of how we should teach people in America as well. making sure that we are honest about the actual stats helps protect not only woman from rape but it helps break the cycles of abuse, and violence. Just training someone and giving them tools will not change things in society long term.

My opinions will be different then yours because of my gender and experience. Its not right or wrong its just different because it comes from a different perspective.

Ms. J bows deeply.....

congrats on the 20 years experance in womans attack issues, i have nearly 40, nearly 20 of which were in differnt kinds of war zones.

[Kingston]

Re: Stats and tools

Originally posted by Ms. J
congrats on the 20 years experance in womans attack issues, i have nearly 40, nearly 20 of which were in differnt kinds of war zones.

lol Ms. J.....BAM! suck on that RBFC!

come on guys......whats a measely 20 years worth anyway?

But seriously this undertone of hostility (or competition?) between you two guys is becoming.........Good reading! keep it up.

[Ms. J]

hostility

yes well, if there was no intertainment value we would not be over 2000 readings of this one string....

woo woo....

btw 20 years or 40 years it just shows how old we both are and actully i have no problmes admitting i am an old and slow chick.


Ms. J.. Bows deeply...

[RBFC]

I don't remember mentioning any names when I made my previous post. I have seen many discussions of Women's SD degenerate into a number-crunching contest. Statistics can be used to prove anything we wish, depending on how the numbers are presented and collected.

At any rate, during training sessions is when you get the opportunity to help women UNDERSTAND what the importance of any certain statistic is. You also get the opportunity to give them the ability to NOT BECOME A STATISTIC. In my experience, when female clients meet with friends and family, etc. they discuss the new skills they are learning and thereby increase awareness of rape avoidance issues.

Historically, societally-driven change on public issues has come from a "series" of events which runs this process:

1. A "leader" takes a stand involving the issue at hand. This can be a publlic speech, or one woman defeating an attacker.

2. That leader does not allow the issue to disappear quickly, as the latest "hot news" stories seem to do within a few days.

3. A group who supports and agrees with the leader now takes up the cause, and increases public awareness of the issue.

4. The media, not wanting to be left out, now claim this issue for themselves. The issue is splashed onto newspapers and (in the last 50 years) TV.

5. The public becomes aware (as a mass) of the issue.

6. Legislators (seeking to retain their seats) get "interested" in the issue, especially when many constituents of their district are writing letters, etc.

7. Laws are introduced, etc. which deal with the issue.

8. There are a series of challenges and misinterpretations of those laws, until loopholes are closed, and a general understanding of the "intent" of the law is generated.

9. During the next few generations, the law and its intent become "standard operating procedure".

This process requires several generations to take effect. Witness the issues involving racism, women's suffrage, etc. Although a worthwhile goal, this process TAKES A LONG TIME.


My point is that statistical analysis does not save the young woman who is underneath a male attacker. Humans are animals. We have been given the natural abilities to fight for reasons seen since the beginning of time. I'd be willing to bet that if 50% of rapists found themselves with an eye gouged out or a BIC pen shoved into their neck, the statistics generated concerning rape would change much faster than through the societal-interest method. (Take the issuance of CCW firearms permits and crime statistics as an example: every state which has enacted a CCW law has had a reduction in violent crime).

I will restate that widely spreading a foundation of the skills I mentioned in my previous post will do more to reduce/eliminate rape than any involvement in governmental processes. The rapists do not care what laws exist, and don't care which "sub-group" they fit into. They do care if they have lost an eye or have a broken leg.

For the record, I have over 35 years experience, 20 in my current program. I've read the statistics and been just as disgusted as anyone else at the results. My computer desktop is filled with Dept. of Justice, etc. statistics files.

Simply put, all the understanding in the world about rapists will not save you when a 200 lb. guy is on top of you! If your "toolbox" does not include solutions for being the "end-user", you have done yourself a dis-service.

It is my philosophy that an understanding of the statistics, etc. should be used to generate the curriculum which provides the safety skills for women. The skill set is the primary goal, since reduction in rape will happen most quickly when more rape attempts become unsuccessful (and painful for the rapist).

RBFC has one of the most advanced programs for augmenting the treatment of clients with PTSD (Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder). The formation of this curriculum required a great deal of study, including years of reading academically-oriented papers which describe minute details of the psychological manifestations of this syndrome. The effects of being "victimized" can destroy your life completely. MORAL OF THE STORY: DON'T BECOME A VICTIM. In the end, only the individual's willingness and ability to fight back can repel the rapist.

You can become a statistic, or you can turn your attacker into one. Your choice.

Since this thread ( and my participation here) have become "entertainment" for some readers, anyone who has further interest in discussing this topic with me is free to send a Private Message or email me through my website listed in my signature. I have no interest in spending time in an atmosphere of "entertainment" when my time can be put to better use by individuals who are serious about this issue.

Thank you,

Lee

[Ms. J]

LEE Wrote: RBFC has one of the most advanced programs for augmenting the treatment of clients with PTSD (Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder). The formation of this curriculum required a great deal of study, including years of reading academically-oriented papers which describe minute details of the psychological manifestations of this syndrome. The effects of being "victimized" can destroy your life completely. MORAL OF THE STORY: DON'T BECOME A VICTIM. In the end, only the individual's willingness and ability to fight back can repel the rapist.


Good, i have some questions for you then:

1) Is your program paid for by the government for victims of violent crime?

2) Do you have a full LSW degree? if so what state is it with. And what kind of interventions have you used on the floor to help victims get past the frist attack? and how many practical hours of counseling did you have to go though to get your degree?

3) And what do you do for a client when they are falling at your feet in a mush ball because they saw a gun during training and they are reliving there past experience?

4) how many actual victims of violent crime that had PTSD symptoms have you taught? and have you kept the data? have you tacked there progress over the past 5 years? and if so what was the outcome?

5) And what have you done to teach victims to over come the past victimization and not relive it in the next instance? what is your format for helping them get past this point so the can start training?

6) Do you have your victims work out multi attackers as well as single?

7) who was on your development team when you designed your program? have you taken your program to the government yet and has it been approved by the state your licensed in? where do you teach your programs?

8) What training do you have in crisis intervention for victims of violent crime?

9) How many woman instructors vs. male instructors do you normally have on the floor when teaching a program to women?

10) How many hours is your level one core SDA program for victims?

11) How do you make sure your not over empowering your woman students and victims of past crimes against them? And do you require them to work out the techniques your teaching them based on all the instances of attack they might be facing? Or do you just lie them on the floor and let them pretend they are fighting off someone once they are on top of them?

NOTE: i hope you dont think i am not serious about this issue, because i know fully well the reality’s of teaching real hard core victims of crime to over come the past victimization. That’s why I run an organzation that teaches victims of violent crime a special program and I don’t bulk them into a normal class outline until I know they have dealt with the past issues first. They have special needs and to expect them to over come there limitations from the past in a normal class environment is not the best suited program for them. That’s why they are part of the ‘ Special interest groups”

STATS: as far as stats I have a feeling you did not read the post very well, I am basing this statement on the responses you have had since it on stats, and especially this past response:

Positive Social Change: It takes 10 years to bring about positive social change, FATE organzation is 5 years into a plan that works to do this. As far as bringing change already, that has been done. The programs we ran on the east coast the past 5 years helped to make major changes in the way victims of violent crime are treated for there past victimizations and help on how to change the cycle of re-occurring victimization.

Lee wrote: MORAL OF THE STORY: DON'T BECOME A VICTIM. In the end, only the individual's willingness and ability to fight back can repel the rapist.

Based on your statement: RBFC has one of the most advanced programs for augmenting the treatment of clients with PTSD (Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder). The formation of this curriculum required a great deal of study, including years of reading academically-oriented papers which describe minute details of the psychological manifestations of this syndrome

How do you justify telling a victim that its about there willingness and ability to fight back when all they can see and feel is the frist victimization? And what do you think telling a victim “ its up to them to make sure they don’t become a victim again” does to there mind set? Its like telling a woman that she got raped and its her own fault. Do you have any idea what that does to the mind of a victim? And how do you justify it base on all the things you claim you have read and are educated in?

Its one thing to be able to recognize PTSD symptoms after reading papers, its another thing though to be educated and have enough real experience to be able to help a victim be treated for the disorder.


Please note: these are honest questions, they are not intended to inflame or piss anyone off, but they are real, and are based on real experience in the areas and topics touched in this post.


Ms J bows deeply……

[RBFC]

Mrs. J,

Your post follows the same approach which got you banned from SDF. You don't really say anything about what you do, but rather you attempt to discredit and belittle others to build up your importance.

There's two ways to win the game:

1. Play better than the other guy.

2. Hope that the other guy makes errors.

I feel no need to justify my experience and the success of my program to you. ( I have been in personal contact with the world's leading neurobiologists and psychologists during the formation of our program. One of my assistants is a PhD psychologist.) I notice that you don't say how you handle any of your questions.......

If you have found a new audience to listen to your drivel, then enjoy the attention while it lasts. Unless you actually begin to teach people here methods to increase their personal safety, your superiority complex will be exposed for what it truly is: LACK OF SUBSTANCE.

You constantly advertise your organization in your posts, but say nothing specific about what you do. Unfortunately, there will eventually be a need to demonstrate the effectiveness of what you do.

Please write us back in five years when you've changed the world.

I will request that the site administrators remove my registration from this site. I cannot participate in activities which will delude innocent readers. Hopefully, the lack of good information here will not result in anyone being harmed.

Lee

[Kingston]

Originally posted by RBFC


Since this thread ( and my participation here) have become "entertainment" for some readers, anyone who has further interest in discussing this topic with me is free to send a Private Message or email me through my website listed in my signature. I have no interest in spending time in an atmosphere of "entertainment" when my time can be put to better use by individuals who are serious about this issue.

Thank you,

Lee

I agree with you completly the second learning new things, and viewing other peoples opinions become fun I DONT WANT ANYTHING TO DO WITH IT!!!....

your right, my time is to important to be "...in an atmosphere of entertainment" ...come to think of it, i having a little bit of fun right now......i better get off the computer.

oh ya and RBFC in response to your last post....once again your right.....Your to important to share knowledge with the general public.....Your far to smart to voice any of your opinions, someone mite question them....hold someone elses opinion in higher standard!!

i know when someone posts something i dont like....I leave the forum!!!

"i dont have to be a part of this.....to think someone disagrees with me, ME! When im so obviously right, the general martial arts comunity is to stupid to tell whats right for themselves, they could get tricked and hurt themselves as a result! My prestigeous name cannot be associated with these commoners....Good day sirs!!

Im glad that by leaving, it will make things much harder for people to get the "good" information.... i guess your dicks to big to debate with people in an adult fashion. (not saying Ms J is any better)

iv read through all the post, nothing seems to come into direct opposition from what either you (RBFC) or Ms. J have said.....is there any proof her system doesn't work? Is there any proof your system doesn't work? Is it just the fact that there are "lies, damn lies, and statistics"

could it be possible that perhaps there is more then one way to teach womens self defence........RBFC are you the best womens self defence teacher in the world? Is Ms. J? does it matter?

RBFC you said "there's two ways to win the game" wtf is that? Are you playing for points or something? whos winning right now?

Its just the lives you live, is it possible Ms J's system has hurt anyone? is it possible yours has? most likely the answer is no to both. SO WHATS THE PROBLEM!

I dont like Ms. J more then you.....she asks to many questions, i agree with that, not enough answers...the problem is not with this thread, or with this forum, it is that BOTH of you have desided to see who can piss the farthest.

[Ms. J]

Lee i asked simple questions, they are honest questions and the same list of questions i recommend to any women that wants to take a self defense and awareness corse.

As far as me, being asked the questions no one here has asked me what i do or how i teach programs.

As far as finding out the information or questions about my program that i asked about your program. The answers to the questions i asked you here are publicly published on line and all information for our programs are listed openly on our web site. (And it has been so for years) Anyone that wants to go there and read it is welcome too. My bio is there, my team member’s bios are there, and the education and backgrounds of the development team are there. Full outlines of all courses are there, including what we teach to victims throughout the program.

You made statements and i had questions about them, but for some reason they are a threat to you. You know something these are the same kind of questions i tell victims to ask of organizations when they are looking for a program to take in their area.

Its also part of a set of questions that are part of a column that will be printed soon. This article will help others fully understand what they should look for when going to an organzation for training in SDA. It will also help to set the tone for the community at large when developing programs that make sense and are in the best interest of the client instead of the organization.

As far as saving the world, hey, i never said that was my intent. What i said is that i want to bring positive social change, part of that is bringing programs to the community that make sense. I have taught enough people that have taken classes in the past from other organizations that still ended up victims because they took programs that did NOT cover what was really needed to prevent as well as avoid.

As far as my memories serves me, the Only board i have ever had any real problems with involved a gun activist group that did not like my views on the long term gun laws. Mostly because i believe that we should require new gun owners to take a safety course that covers childhood safety, the use of a weapon and then the laws and responsibility’s to owning it, before its sold.

These are important questions Lee, and if a client or anyone else can’t ask them without making someone mad by the asking then there is a problem.

As far as whos program is better, i guess i am a fool because i never even thought that way, i asked questions seriously because i was interested and wanted to know. and i tryed to stipulate that before hand because i really wanted to know the answers and that it was not and is not about hostility. though i guess i was wrong. and the game deal, well again i dont see the game here. peoples lives are not to be played with and these are very serious issues.

Ms. J...

[Ryu (JKD?)]

Hmm....

Ryu

[RBFC]

Kingston,

The amount of contribution in your posts is a perfect example of why the direction of this forum is suspect. If you have read my previous thread here at defend.net titled "Drills for Women's SD", you would be exposed first-hand to the amount of research, etc. that goes into forming effective SD training for women. In that thread, I clearly state what I do, and give an example of a complete drill which we implement. I came here to contribute easy-to-grasp effective SD info, gathered through over 35 years of MA participation, including an offer to fight in UFC2, as well as training several MMA fighters to remain in personal shape with brutal physical training.

I have no interest in a "pissing match" with anyone, including Mrs. J. Her approach to the subject of women's SD is far more liberal/political than mine. She is genuinely interested in helping others, but it is MY OPINION that the statistical analyses and art therapy/dance/etc. do nothing to PREVENT a woman from being overwhelmed by an attacker. It does not take a genius to understand that if a woman is not successfully attacked, then she does not become a "victim" or a "statistic". It seems that Mrs. J and I operate at different ends of the crime scene. I have had many women applaud my approach to the arts, not "feminizing" them as much as showing how femininity can be a useful weapon.

If you are seriously interested in any topics relating to SD, I'd be glad to discuss them with you via the aforementioned routes. I am the moderator for the Women's SD forum at www.selfdefenseforums.com, where you can address me as well.

Mrs. J,

My comments are not meant to downplay your commitment and concern for women's issues. Your specialty seems to lie at the post-event side of assaults, mine is preventative. Upon reading your site thoroughly, there is still no clear description of anything that you do specifically.

I have trained government agents, law enforcement officers, and everyday citizens. I am currently nearing certification as a Specialized High-Risk Instructor and Professional Lecturer for the Dept. of Public Safety. My reputation, etc. are certainly out there for people to examine.

Your comments regarding my status as a social worker, etc. about the PTSD program reveal that your interest and expertise lie in the counseling realm, while my expertise lies in the use of physical means to augment the classic desensitization treatment protocols used in this situation. I leave it to you to research the use of progressive adrenal-stress inoculation theories as an adjunct to standard psychotherapy for PTSD.

We are currently undergoing the processes leading to grants from the National Institute for Mental Health (PTSD) and Government Grants for Secondary Education, wherein our programs would be placed as curriculum for high school girls. That's a big load, and the amount of communication, etc. is enormous.

We have had many clients (both male and female) with documented PTSD participate in our program. Our success rate is excellent, but as you must know, coexisting standard therapy modalities confound any simple statistical analysis of treatment results.

Overall, I will return to my original point:

WITHOUT A FUNDAMENTAL KNOWLEDGE OF SIMPLE AND EFFECTIVE VICIOUS SELF DEFENSE TECHNIQUES, AND A WORKING KNOWLEDGE OF DEDICATED AND IMPROVISED WEAPONRY, NO AMOUNT OF STATISTICAL INFORMATION OR ANY OTHER STRATEGY CAN BE RELIED UPON TO RESIST A VIOLENT ATTACK. Attempting to use verbal tactics, without the physical tactics as a back-up, can leave the user with no options if the verbal tactics fail.

Your website places the majority of your SD training on the FMA. Now, I'll ask the questions:

1. Do you understand and incorporate the use of graduated adrenal stress drills in your curriculum? If so, how do you conduct the drills? What client profile indicators do you use to set the parameters of the drill for each individual? What visual indications do you use to adjust the intensity of the drills?

2. Do you incorporate the combination of verbal distraction with positive gestural communication? Do you teach enhancement of tactical positioning by the use of physical non-alarming distractions?

3. Do you show methodologies by which the defender can construct a profile of the attacker to decide which sequences of pattern interrupt can be employed?

4. Do you teach how to grapple while in cars, on glass-covered blacktop, on a mattress, etc. and the special considerations inherent in each situation?

5. Do you perform low-light, low-sound, sensory deprivation drills to enhance target landmarking? How about drills where the bad guy doesn't attack at all?

It becomes obvious that the "question game" can be used to make another person's experience, etc. come into question. I've played that game many, many times before. The answer is that nobody does it all. My program focuses on fighting off the immediate threat. Yours, from your website, devotes far more time and energy to the healing aspects and post-event treatment.

When there are thousands of inexperienced "lurkers" who read this information and may use it to defend themselves, you must understand the responsibility of giving them simple and effective tactics to start. The confusion of masses of statistics and "feel-good" therapies is not fundamentally life-saving. It is because of this responsibility to provide information which can be put to use immediately that I have contacted Mr. Mousel and asked that my membership here be removed.

If the desire of this forum is to degenerate into a liberal group-hug mentality, or to not closely monitor the content of the posts, then the disservice that this will provide is something I cannot professionally become associated with.

Thank you,

Lee Aldridge (RBFC)

[Ms. J]

sigh, i am sorry for this next long reply in advance

Lee: Upon reading your site thoroughly, there is still no clear description of anything that you do specifically.

All 300 pages?

Here is the outline for the level one SDA program: this is just level one, and it is for the average person, without past victimizations. It deals with the highest instance of crime today. Each level of the program changes based on the instances of crime faced. http://www.fate-organization.com/art...s/TAOSDA.htmls

Level two and three cover the other 10 instances of crime detailed in the format for lifestyle scenario training:

http://www.fate-organization.com/articals/fundraising/trifolds/lifestyles.html

Level 4 is left for instructors that wish to rank and teach the program to victims, they then have to spend an additional year training in crisis intervention, PTSD, Rape-DM and Victims of violent crime advocacy, contact levels, teaching ability’s, and on site experience teaching the program.

Its full outline covers all of the highest risks of violent crimes relevant to the average person’s life. Moreover, the program utilizes an adult-learning format comprised of instruction and assessment that encourages individual thought, synthesis of group contribution, and assimilation of practical, physical, and theoretical teachings through experimental learning. This learning format is the quickest and most effective way for an adult to retain the information they have learned.

For the victims program:

This is the same basic format taught to Victims, though it is taught at a different contact level and normal practice weapons are not used, other props and tools are replaced for the class for victims. This is done mostly to help keep flashbacks off the floor. Before victims are taught the SDA part of the program they are frist introduced to Foundation Tools found here:

http://www.fate-organization.com/articals/fundraising/trifolds/foundations.html

Foundation tools is again based and taught on an adult learning format. Foundation tools are about giving victims options to deal with the past victimization. It is not about counseling them. It is about empowering them to bring positive change on their own.


When the core SDA part of the program is taught (after foundation tools have been presented), there is a full crisis intervention team on the premises.

This team is provided by the organzation we work with to teach a victims program. We don’t teach a program for victims unless its taught within a hospital, counseling center, or women’s center. Though many of us on the team have counseling experience and degrees, we do not counsel victims. There are strict rules that also apply to the victims before they can take a program with us. They are however required to receive counseling through the center we are working with wile training in the program.

Two weeks of pre-training with the crisis intervention team and the FATE team takes place before each program is taught. At that time all drills and program format is gone over with the team. Teams then set up floor singles to deal with a crisis wile teaching a victims program. When a problem arises, the crisis intervention team pulls a student off the floor and works individually with them to get them though the flashback or issue they are facing. After each possible instance I or one of my staff works privately with the student to deal with the instance they faced and just relived. Each student that applies for the program have to be prescreened by both myself and by the center that we are working with.

If a client is not stable enough to take the class based on their possible trauma or PTSD then they cannot take the course.

Domestic violence victims are taught but only if they are out of the relationship and living in a shelter or new home. This is because the majority of dm victims that die due to Domestic Violent attacks die after they have left or try to leave. Based on this fact its apparent they need training to protect themselves. However, if they are still in the relationship it only helps to keep the cycle of violence re-occurring by training them in full contact SDA skills. Because of this Fact FATE, organzation will not teach a DM victim that is still in a present DM Relationship. Instead, they are sent to a crisis team and a safety plan is made, after they are out of the relationship they can receive training.

After a victim has gone though the frist 40-hour training program at level one they are then offered long term empowerment training with any organzation that has a program that suits a victims special needs. Students are incorraged to take 4 weeks of organized class time in either more SDA training, Realty based martial arts training, long term traditional martial arts training or holistic healing modality’s

As stated above, this is to further the long term personal training that helps keep them on a growth path. Victims are most times victims of long-term abuse of some kind. The self esteem issues they face have to be dealt with long term or they just go back to the same mind set and the reoccurrence of victimization keeps happening. This is especially true of victims of DM or childhood victims of rape, abuse, and trauma from violent crime.

FMA-JKD- and other martial arts are taught via FATE but they are not taught as SDA programs, they are taught as long-term traditional or long-term realty based arts. All money from anything taught from this page

http://www.fate-organization.com/articals/fundraising/fundsite.html

Goes to teach the program to victims freely. FATE Organzation is not a martial arts organization. We are a non-profit volunteer holistic healing organzation that teaches victims of violent crime using, SDA, Martial arts, and Self Awareness as creative arts Therapy.

Lee wrote: Your website places the majority of your SD training on the FMA. Now, I will ask the questions:

1. yes and the drills are on the website, keep looking

2. Yes, these concepts are taught throughout the program and are instance of violence based.

3. Yes

4. Yes

5. Yes, yes

Lee: It becomes obvious that the "question game" can be used to make another person's experience, etc. come into question. I've played that game many, many times before. The answer is that nobody does it all.****

Learning and knowledge come from questioning.

Lee:”My program focuses on fighting off the immediate threat.****

My core SDA program for the average person focus's on fighting off the immediate threat, creating a distance, stopping the threat and then saving your life, we just also make sure to cover all the issues.

Lee” Yours, from your website, devotes far more time and energy to the healing aspects and post-event treatment.****

Treatment for victims has to come first before they can train effectively; they have to have this kind of training before they are fit really to learn contact SDA. In addition, I assure you, I am not there to counsel victims. My job is to give then options, teach them how to avoid, deescalate, stop the re-occurrence of violence in there lives and to teach them how to protect themselves.

Government Funding and approval: In 2000 this program was evaluated by Rutgers university’s Masters Psychology Program, and social working department. At that time the full outline for victims and the intervention tools that were used were approved and cleared as appropriate for Victims.

In 2000 the US Justus department victims of crime unit in Washington DC evaluated and approved this program, at that time assuring FATE that this program will be paid for state by state via the victims of crime bill act for victims as part of their healing process after facing a violent crime. Not only for woman, but men, and children.

Again i appoligize to everyone here on this board for having to valadate and for having such a long reply. i have tryed to keep it short but i was unable to do so based on the questions asked. i also applogize for forgetting who Lee was, and for being so nieve. He is right he did play this game with me before. though i did not think it was a game then and nor do i feel its a game now. futhermore, if i recall, the last time this happend, he had an apprentace working with him on the game.

Ms. J bows deeply...