Gun Confiscation Now Beginning in California

[Tony10]

I'm voting for him.

The Jello Biafra idea is intriguing, isn't it?

[Yojimbo]

Ronin posted.

"Believe it or not, I don't want to ban all guns, but certain weapons like semi-autos have no legitimate purpose other than to vaporize human tissue. Don't be such an extremist. Liberals DO support the Constitution you know, as flawed as some of it may be for a 200-year-old document. The NRA has to learn to compromise a little bit. "

Ronin,

I would think someone who practices martial arts would see things in a different light. To say that "semi-autos have no legitimate purpose other than to vaporize human tissue" is just as bad as saying that BJJ has no legitimate purpose other than breaking limbs and choking people to death. Any firearm regardless of what type semi-auto, full-auto, revolver, single shot musket will only do what the operator does with it.

There is a Zen saying "Satsujinken, Katsujinken". It's translated as "Sword that kills, Sword that gives life". Yes a gun can be used to wrongfully take a life but it can also save life to...

The Constitution is definitely not outdated, many have just lost the ability to relate to the mindset of the founders and sitiuations they encountered that brought the U.S. Constituition into being.


Respectfully,

Yojimbo

[Lacrymosa]

Yeah Ronin, it is....

Biafra also had another interesting idea to battle our children's apathy toward the adult world: Lower the voting age to eight.

Of course, mainstream politicians dismiss Biafra's solutions as wacky, but it does pose an interesting question to those that have no other answer.

I personally would never vote Biafra into public office, but he does have some intriguing ideas.

[Mickey Finn]

Originally posted by Ronin

I'm a self-proclaimed liberal. Believe it or not, I don't want to ban all guns, but certain weapons like semi-autos have no legitimate purpose other than to vaporize human tissue.

Not true Ronnin. Semi Auto rifles and handguns are legally used for hunting and target practice all the time. They will limit the size of the magazine that can be used in a hunting application, but nonetheless, it is a legal and legitimate use of the firearm.

[Lacrymosa]

Jimbo...

Unlike BJJ, any moron can waltz up to you and end your life with a gun. My personal problems with guns: Too much power given to an individual with too little discipline required. Of course, that doesn't apply for all gun owners.

A large number of gunowners are indeed honest and hardworking. These people keep the guns for sport (though I can't fathom how this can be enjoyable to a civilized human being) or to reinforce a false sense of security.

That's fine, but not everybody holds this as an idealism.

[Yojimbo]

Lacry..

I see what your saying about guns but the same can be said about many other things. Any moron can climb into to a car while intoxicated and I don't even need to explain the what the awful results could be.

Don't get me wrong I'm 100% behind what you said about the responsible use of firearms. I feel those who commit crimes with guns should pay a high price, even loose their life in some situations.

The problem we run into is that the people who are most affected by the well meaning but ineffective anti-gun laws are not the ones we have to worry about. Remember criminals by definition do not obey the law, so they won't be protesting against gun control because it make their job easier knowing the law abiding people can not protect themselves.

If everyone could only use hand to hand martial arts to defend themselves the only the stonger more skillful people will have a chance. What about my 115lb wife? How would she defend herself or our children against a 200lb criminal intent on harming or killing? A firearm will give her a chance fighting chance but not martial arts.

-Yojimbo

[Lacrymosa]

Jimbo,

I understand exactly what you're talking about. I believe strongly in gun control. I think in this day and age, there is little use for firearms for the general public.

John Q. Public wants his wife to have a gun to protect herself from muggers and rapist....yet it's illegal to even carry a firearm in public.

John Q. Public also wants to have a handgun to protect his home from intruders. The irony is, more fatalities involving these guns result in deaths to family members....especially children.

I am not %100 certain that the motives behind the Great California Gun Ban is in the best interest of the general public, but firearms (especially automatic firearms) have proven to be more harm than good. Contrary to what many NRA people are going to think, guns do not equal security. Guns do not equal freedom.

For many, guns will always loom as an opportunity to take the law into their own hands. That reality often scares me as much as the faceless mugger out on the street. Absolute power given to the frustrated masses.

[Hawk]

One of the good things about this country in the past has always been the fact that even though a select group may have a brief moment of glory, if their heart isn't in the right place, they have lost credibility quick. The KKK, New Black Panthers, numerous motorcycle gangs, etc., etc. However, one of the worse terrorist acts in U.S. History, the bombing of the Federal Building in Oklahoma City, has been linked to the militia movement and that movement is still going strong and gaining representation everyday. Why?
Mainly because of this administration's attack on the second amendment. The gun confiscation issue has banded legitimate, hard working Americans, rich & poor, young & old,that believe strongly in the 2nd amendment,
with some of the sorriest Neo-Nazis this country has to offer. There are some law abiding people who will give up their guns and some who won't. If this keeps up we very well may end up in a Civil War. I'm for Bush, not because of his party, but because he pushed through our right to carry law here in Texas. Gore has carried forward Clinton's attack on firearms and seems to have the same close contact with the Red Chinese via Hong Kong contributions that Clinton had or has. Is "Red Dawn" coming? Confiscation of weapons is the first step that way. I'd certainly hate to see a SOS Neo-Nazi like William Pierce become a prophet and I'd hate to see "The Turner Diaries" become a reality.
Hawk

[knuckledragger]

I guess you could say I am a pro gun person ..I dont want to argue pros and cons of it here, people are passionate about this issus(much like abortion)they feel that "they are "wrong " and "we" are right. But I have a question to ask : This country is so technologically advanced(meaning that the citizenry has experience with and access to machinery and metals and the information on how guns work and are made ) that do you realy think that even if there is a total firearms ban that there would be a huge underground firearms market...and in that case wouldnt they be even easier to get then .Hope this made sense just a thought.

[Lacrymosa]

Gawd!

Every time I hear about the Turner Diaries, I get a sick feeling in my stomach.....

I guess my feelings about firearms has to do with my personal experiences. Like I said before, I have never fired a true firearm and have little ambition in owning one. I grew up in a little town called Scottsbluff, Nebraska. As many of you could probably deduce, there are several (pardon the expression) "redneck" types in this region. More than once in my life have I been threatened with a firearm by these types.....typically for nothing more than a minor insult.

In archaic American history, I can understand the right to bear arms. That part of the Bill of Rights was created before the nation had an organized military. Hardly seems applicable in this day and age. Those that are bent on carrying dangerous weapons, however, will stand behind it regardless of what context it was written in.

Yet the Great California Gun Ban is somewhat puzzling that such a giant leap can be made regardless of a constitutional right . I would think that Federal guidelines on these fireamrs would supercede State law, but Hawk, as a district attorney would know more about this subject. My general standpoint on gun control is the strict criminal guidelines on those wishing to purchase firearms rather than a governmental imposition on lawabiding gunowners.

[Hawk]

Lacrymosa,
You are correct as to the giant leap and there is a good chance the law will be ruled unconstitutional at an appellate level. As to "The Turner Diaries", I became familiar with this book during the trials centered around the Byrd dragging and that book was published in 1978. If you are familiar with that book and some of the things that have come out of it, (Federal Building Bombing, "The Order" and Robert Matthews, and the Byrd Dragging Cases), along with the reason that "Revolution" started (abolishment of the 2nd amendment) then you see where I'm coming from. One thing further, there were not militias' in place in "The Turner Diaries" at the time of gun confiscation as there are at this time, in this country.
Hawk

[Lacrymosa]

Hawk,

That's what sincerely bothers me about those people. The militia types of this country are basically threatening the well-being of innocent people. I have always felt that guns provide a temptation to take the law into your own hands. These people, for all practical purposes, have taken this country hostage.

I am familiar with the Turner diaries....much in the same way that I'm familiar with Mein Kampf: I see little difference in the attitude of the two (though the Turner Diaries is tamer in comparison). Tim McVay seems to be quite an avid disciple of that philosophy. In fact, if my memory serves me correctly, he actually patterned his vicious act to parallel the story in that book. As far as an All-Out War against the government....it will never happen. Despite the raving of these lunatic minds, history will prove these barbarians as nothing more than the merciless killers of infants.

[John Bennett]

You guys don't see the Big Picture.

You are too caught up in the day-to-day blather and rehtoric on TV (the trees) to see the larger leftist worldview (the forest).

Take some time to read. Gain a broader perspective. Rise above the blather. Really stop and think about the core structure of our government and society.


Throwing out zingers and spewing rehtoric is childish.

Convince me why it's better for the goverment to control my life than me.

[yusul]

what the hell is a gun post doing on a MMA and BJJ site?
whether or not you support guns is your choice, but i am sick of gun supporters trying to lump in their rights with martial artists; just because you practice a martial art, doesn't automatically mean you support private gun ownership. It's like the gay rights movement lumping themselves in with the women's rights movement or pro-choice movement. (i guess if you support gender equality in the work place, you must be gay, a gay supporter or you must be pro-choice) my point is, these are all separate issues!!! they should be judged by themselves, instead of lumped in one category.

[Lacrymosa]

Really now, Johnny, do you really think that the government DIDN'T have control of your life before they planned on taking your toy guns away? LMAO!

The government is a big hungry monster, but the Republicans are part of that monster as well. Open your eyes.