Gun Confiscation Now Beginning in California

[Eazy-E]

Gents,

Some well thought out opinions and some absurb verbal garbage here. I guess its like most long threads.

I'll put a few thoughts here as well.

First, regarding the original intent of the Second Amendment: scholars are arguing over it now, but there are pretty strong arguments that it meant state armies, not individuals. Remember that armies were originally raised by each state and then sent to the US government. You can speak all you want about your Second Amendment rights, but the case isnt that strong.

Second, the demographics of gun ownership are overwhelmingly middle aged and older white men. So guess what this means over the next few decades? This group will age and slowly die out, and the younger white men just arent as interested in owning guns as these older guys. This is a demographic fact, not an argument. Unless the NRA types can appeal beyond their older & white male base, it will die out in a few decades.

Third, regarding home defense, who the heck needs a handgun?! Personally, I much prefer a pump action 12 gauge! I have heard several ex military experts recommend this very weapon for home defense. Its easy to use, reliable and scares the living sheet out of any intruders.

Personally, I think this whole pro/anti gun argument is somewhat a proxy for the huge cultural, technological, economic and demographic changes underway in the US society. Many people see firearms as somehow representing the part of society that they dont want to change. I find it curious that the main firearm supporters are white guys over 40.

But I think that the gun control forces are winning and only need to be patient. Demographics will mostly do the job for them.

E

[Martial Artist]

Rosie O'Donnell can pull it out her ass,Just like the other hemisphere thats in there!The idea of Law abiding citizens turning in there guns to make the streets safer is stupid.The only thing it will do is make Law abiding citizens defensless!!!The media is totally against guns as well as republicans.They have people like Rossy "Fat ass" O'Donnell shooting off there fat mouth about guns.Yup they show you footage of people like hunters running after people,what do you think the hunter is carrying?As for kid shooting up a school,maybe if parents would get there head outa there ass shit wouldnt happend.

[Edited by Martial Artist on 10-03-2000 at 08:06 PM]

[Joe Manco]

Easy-E:

And so it is with all great societies. Decadence destroys them.

All great societies were made through war. Through fire, through killing, through an upheld ideal, through victory and perseverance of those lofty ideals.

And all great societies eventually come to an end because, after the smoke clears from the wars, the next generations of people in that society eventually begin to question the very power, the very energy, and the very fire that was able let let them lie there, slack-jawed, and quietly masturbate their minds.

It is always the forthcoming generations that ruin any great society. They never had to fight for what they have, kill for what they have, die for what they have. They just "have" ... and so their character muscles never had to work ... and so they get weak, their minds get weak, and their wills and hearts get weak. And they begin to develop weak habits, weak lifestyles, weak ways of thinking. Everything about the way post-era societies live their lives eventually becomes weak. And so eventually all great societies decay and get slaughtered by a new, virile society who is young, strong, and who has stronger thoughts and stronger goals.

Why should our society wind up any different? We all know the saying, History repeats itself. Our society was envisioned with valor, it was built upon heart and ideals, and it was won through war ... and it was maintained by war. Yet, slowly but surely, too many of its following generations (you bozos who have no concept of anything but taking TRUE VALUES for granted in your "safety-first" decadence) will gradually erode all of the shine and internal integrity from our Original System ... until the whole thing comes crashing down and burns.

You people's limp, lame, leftist thoughts prove this inevitability. But such is the way with all societies, eventually. The decadence of too many white worms destroys them.

[Patterson]

A war on drugs hasn't worked and a war on guns won't either. If someone thinks that will make the streets safer they are an idiot.

[Yojimbo]

E,

The writers of the BOR abd USC where masters of the English language. When the founders meant "states" they clearly say it in the USC. The reference in th 2nd "the right of the people" are repeated again in the 4th, 9th, and 10th Amendments and the courts have ruled repeatedly that these rights belong to individuals not the states. Yet for some reason when many read the 2nd they interpret it to mean the "state"!!!

The reference about the "militia" in the 2nd does not change it's orignal meaning, it supports it.

-Yojimbo

[Yojimbo]

Joe/Pit,

Good post but I hope with all my heart that you are wrong...

I hope the majority of Americans can see through the smoke thown up by the touchy feely types who think they know better than those who paid the ultimate price to make this country what it is.

Some of the other posters mentioned how America behind the rest of the civilized world because they have total bans on firearms. They need to look closely at these other so called civilized countries and and see how really they are compare to America. There really is no comparison....

-Yojimbo

[Ronin]

Joe Manco:

You know I like you, but man you're a whack-job.

Have you seen 'Gandhi'? I just saw it again the other night. An entire nation (actually three) were liberated based on the ideals of pacifism and non-violence. Instead of confronting the British with guns and knives, the Indians simply refused to cooperate. Eventually, the Brits went home, got bitter, and unleashed the Spice Girls upon an uncaring world. I'm not saying that non-violence works in all cases, but your reading of history is based on too much Nietzsche and Hemmingway. Violence and war aren't the only noble virtues worth living (or dying) for. Gandhi, MLK, Thoreau, Ang Sung Suu Kyi, The Dalai Lama...many great leaders have proven that non-violence works. We don't need to kill each other to survive anymore. Quite the opposite. India and Pakistan have now embraced the path of madness, and spiral towards nuclear destruction. Some people never learn until it's too late.

And we don't need guns to defend ourselves. The NRA are made up of conservative hobbyists who think the government is run by Israel. They're paranoid whackos, for the most part. I don't want to ban guns, but I want to make it as difficult as possible to obtain a firearm for the few sick minds who want to shoot up McDonald's out of some twisted sense of vengeance.

Violence doesn't make us strong. It makes us weak.

Capice?

[Yojimbo]

Ronin,

Non-violence resistance won't work when those you oppose would just as soon kill you.

‘‘Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest.’’

— Mahatma Ghandi


Regards,

Yojimbo

[Joe Manco]

Yojimbo:
You clearly are an educated, insightful person. I was in fact silently applauding all of your posts here, since your first one on 10-03-2000 @ 03:24 PM.

Sadly, however, I do not think I am wrong in my observations/predictions. All one has to do is look about at the majority of people today, and listen to them, to see the limp, lifeless, reality-blind direction we are headed. Unfortunately.

Ronin:
I'm a wacko, eh? Ever question WHY the main firearm supporters are white guys over 40? They're the last ones who defended our asses in real wars.

As for Ghandi, he was a great man in his own way, but could never have defeated a super-power in a real war bozo. I couldn't possibly have said WHY this is so better than Yojimbo. And what a quote BY Ghandi

Lastly, no law will EVER make getting guns difficult for criminals, you long-haired, limp-wristed, lefty. I can get any kinda gun I want, legal or illegal, from people I know who have "contacts." Do you think a "law" will ever change this? No. It will only make getting a gun harder for wide-eyed, gape-mouthed lemmings like you.

Personally, I just have a LEGAL .44 handgun and a LEGAL Navy Seal pump shotgun, because I try to stay on the right side of the law. I also have considered getting my Class 3 Permit to get a Heckler & Koch MP-10. But whether I elect to do this or not should ALWAYS remain my choice. And the day it ISN'T my choice is the day there is no more democracy, but the tyranny of the left. They want to CONTROL people and people's destinies, not let them control their own.

What better way to have control than an unarmed general populace?

"When the government fears the people, there is liberty; when the people fear the government, there is tyranny."
~ Thomas Jefferson




[Edited by Joe Manco on 10-03-2000 at 10:19 PM]

[Ronin]

I do NOT have long hair!

And my wrist isn't limp, it's FLEXIBLE!!!

[Joe Manco]

Ronin:

LMAO.

OK, so you're a short-haired, flexible-wristed ... wide-eyed, leftist lemming then ...

[Ronin]

Call me all the names you like, Mr. Manco, it will avail you not when the One World Government "reeducates" your anarchist ass!

Excuse me, I must run towards the ocean now.

[RYAN410]

Gun paranoia

Big Bird...Put the crack pipe down and chill...

[E1am]

Bigbird and Lacrymosa,

Abortion and capital punishment are two different issues. Is being pro-choice and anti death penalty also contradictory? If you want to argue about an issue stick to the topic and don't attack someone's view on an unrelated issue. For the record, I am against both the death penalty and abortion.

As for the the constitutionality of the California law, I thought that the Second Ammendment only applied to the federal government and that states were able to put stricter controls on gun ownership.

[John Bennett]

Easy-E:

It's pretty simple, the constitution grant RIGHTS to individuals and POWERS to states. Read it and see.

The scholarship confirming the 2nd as an individual right is in fact so strong it's called the Standard Model. Anti-gunner attempts to characterize it otherwise are simply fraud.