Knife counter

[lone wolf]

Hi, I think people spend too much time concentrating on the knife hand. I also think that grabbing the knive hand opens you up to strikes with the attacker's empty hand. I think the best policy, if you can't escape is to take the fight to the attacker. Go thru him aggressively and try to take him out. Check out the example on my web site's move of the month. Let me know what you think? Ed.

https://www.lonewolfjujutsu.com

[chris davis 200]

Dont know anyone that would still be stood there after an open full on elbow to the jaw, they would either be back peddling, KO'ed or crumpling backwards.

see your other thread.

cheers
chris

[lone wolf]

Hopefully my first shot was enough. If not the following pictures are to demonstrate my follow up hits. Maybe I missed with the elbow shot. Yes you are right, when you hit someone in the face they do step back. Also they hip out slightly opening thier groin to the follow up shot. I am steping right to keep up with him pressing the attack. I do not favor grabing the knife hand as my primary method of disarming or countering a knife attack. I prefer to hit the attackers arm as hard as possible and then strike the attacker in vital ares untill he goes down. It is some times hard to fully grasp a technique from staged pictures. This whole sequence at speed takes less than 2 sec. You are hitting him in 4 vital areas in that time still pressing the attack and overloading the attacker. It is very hard for someone to attack when they are pressed and back peddeling.Ed

[chris davis 200]

I appriciate that it is hard to grasp from the staged pictures.

I am more in favour of taking the knife arm out of the picture by immobilising it with a lock, or throwing the opponent to the floor in order to make my escape. although everyone works differently.

some good points.

thanks for sharing.

chris

[darrianation]

lonewolf

I agree with you to a point, but you still need to control the knife or keep it at a distance.

[Tom Yum]

Ed,

If you are dealing with some guy on drugs (like PCP) he won't feel an elbow to his head, but his eyes or throat are functional organs.

I would opt to control the knife hand too, but that is just my opinion.

[fullcircle]

Why is it when people teach knife defense, we assume the person with the knife has no idea how to use it? The attacker always seems to be holding the knife like a popsicle. Lone Wolf, that's not a jab at you by any means, just trying to make a point.

[ryanhall]

Not really sure about that one. I don't expect to get attacked by a renegade Filipino Grand Master, but it's still an important point.

I think there are three types of knife carriers:
1) The guy who uses the knife to threaten or intimidate you. He's probably not too serious about killing you, but he wants to make you into a pu$$y and get the best of you.
2) The guy who will use the knife, and won't hesitate for a second. If he's smart, you won't know there's a blade in play until it's buried up to the hilt/handle. If he's not smart, a mad rush full of grabbing, slashing, and stabbing is possible.
3) The tweener. He's just as scared as you are. He might use the blade, but the determination isn't really there. He can go either way depending on the situation and how you affect his emotional state.

I think the bigger problem is that most people work knife defense against someone who's pretending to be an idiot. The knowledge of the blade or lack thereof isn't quite as important as what someone untrained, yet enraged would do. You ain't going to be wrist locking anybody when they have a blade and are serious about using it on you. I never liked training against fantasy knife attackers who slash from a distance or lunge like Olympic fencers. It's a waste of time, and is dangerous/counterproductive, as it does not even come close to accurately replicating a real world knife attack.

As far as training against a skilled/unskilled knifer, I don't really think that it matters. Train for the majority, but be prepared for the minority, I guess. An untrained person with a lot of rage and committment is just as dangerous as a skilled "knife fighter," but in a different way. In any event, you won't be able to tell the difference between them, as things will be over too quickly. The sad truth is that you have a showball's chance in hell against someone extremely skilled with a blade. Just hope you don't run into that somebody.

[lone wolf]

I got slashed once coming home from work on the 6 train,NYC. I did the same technique as in my web site now. Only I added a foot stomp to the base of his neck when he was on the ground. He seemed like he was out. I didn't stick around to find out and took a cab home that day. I didn't ride the subway for awhile after that and I do not know what happened to the guy who slashed me. Oh yeh , his swings were very wild. Very haymaker type of swings. And he was using a box cutter. Ed

[ryanhall]

Ed,
Glad you made it home safe. As far as what you train goes, if it works, then why change things?